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Thread: New Coronavirus in China

  1. #976
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    IT IS NOT WISE TO APPLY LYNCH LAW NOW

    neither to EU
    Neither to Italy
    Neither to China,
    neither USA
    neither to politicians,

    Right now we must follow the safety orders given to us
    and protect us primary and those who we love.
    and those who can, give a bottle of blood,
    someone at this war may need it.
    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    If you bothered to listen to the links I provided unstead of always analyzing through your reflexive anti-Americanism, you would know that randomized control trials of Plaquenil, Plaquenil with Zithromax, Remdesivir and others are all being conducted in the U.S. as we speak. Governor Cuomo has been talking about them every freaking day and how he is personally following the progress of the trials.

    Unless someone is on a ventilator and has only a day to live, to give patients untested drugs, by which I mean drugs which have NOT gone through "randomized control trials", is irresponsible, bordering on malpractice.

    Left one out: plasma transfusions, and probably others.
    offcourse Angela,
    But today,
    If Italy and rest EU, knew these medicines one month before
    she could save more
    , TRUE

    now about Italy EU and America,
    Lets see USA results, and we discuss again in one month,
    if European Italy is more effective, or USA's Italy is more effective.

    As for my Anti-Americanism,
    I see how some Americans care about Italy, bringing mess and screaming for 'Lynch law', in the midle of the battle, to Italians,

    PS
    I wonder if now we discuss as mature and wise humans, or under emotional stress, and for what?

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    offcourse Angela,
    But today,
    If Italy and rest EU, knew thse medicines one month before
    she could save more, TRUE

    now about Italy EU and America,
    Lets see USA results, and we discuss again in one month,
    if European Italy is more effective, or USA's Italy is more effective.

    As for my Anti-Americanism,
    I see how some Americans care about Italy, bringing mess and screaming for 'Lynch law', in the midle of the battle, to Italians,

    PS
    I wonder if now we discuss as mature and wise humans, or under emotional stress for reveange,
    By USA's Italy, you mean New York? :) Well, I guess it can look like that: Governor Cuomo, Dr. Fauci etc. all are New York Italian-Americans as are a good number of anchors on TV and financial media people. I refuse to claim DeBlasio; that isn't his real surname, and he's only half-Italian anyway. :) Actually, it's the fact he's a dunce, and his far left "woke", "progressive" politics.

    In actuality, however, this is the breakdown:


    • White: 42.67%
    • Black or African American: 24.27%
    • Other race: 15.12%
    • Asian: 13.95%
    • Two or more races: 3.51%
    • Native American: 0.43%
    • Native Hawaiian or Pacific Islander: 0.05%

    Italian Americans are only one of the ethnic groups which make up the "white" community. There is a huge Jewish community, and Irish, German, Polish, and English "AMERICANS".

    There's 8.5 Million people in New York City, and of those "only" about 800,000 are Italian Americans. By comparison there are 1.1 million Jews in the five boroughs. If you count the greater New York Metro Area it's 1.3 million Italian-Americans. It still means NYC has the 3rd greatest concentration of Italians outside Italy, after Sao Paulo, Brazil, and Buenos Aires, Argentina.

    Then, there was the exodus out to the suburbs for many of them as they climbed the social/economic ladder, and not just New Jersey, but also Nassau and Suffolk Counties in Long Island. On Long Island they constitute 25% of the population.

    I think I can say for certain New York has a better shot, because it has the United States behind it, and Italy has no one to help it.

    When you start talking crap about lynchings I'm out. If you mean the things which happened in the early periods of immigration, Americans don't obsess over what one ethnic group did to another one over one hundred years ago. This isn't the Balkans.

    New Yorkers don't care, not just now but as a general principle, whether you're Italian-American, or Irish American, or Jewish-American or some mutt with various ancestries, which is increasingly the case. Did you even look at one of Cuomo's briefings? He picks the people he thinks can do the job, whatever the ethnicity. People here don't pick who to save based on ethnic background.

    As for me personally, I've lived here most of my life now, and traveled all over the country, and I can say that I've never felt disrespected or devalued in any way. I can't say the same for some parts of Europe. Yes, I'd go so far as to say that on the whole Americans do love Italy, as Trump said. Of course, I wish some help went with that, but Italy isn't in a union with the U.S.

    Now, I'm going to have a glass of wine, listen to some music, and play Scrabble with my friend.

    Wait, no wine until after the game. She's a shark! :)


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    Yetos "Lynch Law?" Nobody is talking about hanging people, that is in my view rhetoric that is not consistent with at least what I am saying, and what others here who are Americans of Italian ancestry are saying at least from my perspective. Now, speaking for me, and only me, all I said is that I hope Italy follows the UK an exits the EU. I have given my analysis of the Strategic advantages that Italy has in an earlier post. One of them is Italy being an loyal and Strategic NATO ally to the US, hosting the 2nd Most US Military personnel in the EU at about 13,000 (trailing only Germany), an the largest US Navy presence in Europe. UK which is 3rd has about 9,000, Spain about 3,500 and Belgium where NATO HQ is about 1,500. That is a strategic advantage that Italy has that can be used if Italy does an Italian EU exit, which can be leveraged into Economic advantages given that Italy has 311 Sea Ports. Some of those ports, at strategic sites, can be upgraded to handle more shipping of goods and the US given its military presence can help with security of those ports.

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    New Coronavirus in China

    Spaces that are being converted into emergency hospitals in Belo Horizonte. Municipal and state governments, plus private initiative, doing their part in the face of the omission of the federal government.

    Othon Palace (current use: hotel).


    Expominas (current use: exhibition park, large business events and large shows).


    Mineirão (current use: soccer stadium, arena for major events and shows).



    Sent from my iPhone using Eupedia Forum

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    Quote Originally Posted by Palermo Trapani View Post
    Yetos "Lynch Law?" Nobody is talking about hanging people, that is in my view rhetoric that is not consistent with at least what I am saying, and what others here who are Americans of Italian ancestry are saying at least from my perspective. Now, speaking for me, and only me, all I said is that I hope Italy follows the UK an exits the EU. I have given my analysis of the Strategic advantages that Italy has in an earlier post. One of them is Italy being an loyal and Strategic NATO ally to the US, hosting the 2nd Most US Military personnel in the EU at about 13,000 (trailing only Germany), an the largest US Navy presence in Europe. UK which is 3rd has about 9,000, Spain about 3,500 and Belgium where NATO HQ is about 1,500. That is a strategic advantage that Italy has that can be used if Italy does an Italian EU exit, which can be leveraged into Economic advantages given that Italy has 311 Sea Ports. Some of those ports, at strategic sites, can be upgraded to handle more shipping of goods and the US given its military presence can help with security of those ports.
    Lynch law is not hanging people,
    but to punish someone with summary trials and an informated court.

    so my 3 Questions,

    1. If Italy was not in EU, would have done better?

    2. NATO is changing, is coming to Greece, and Severna Makedonia, only half Airforce will remain to Italy, so
    What this has to do if Italy is in, or outside EU? I mean, NATO will help Italy more if it is outside EU? than now inside EU
    How? with coronavirus Marshal plan especially for her in the peak of the pandemia?
    or will build special open hospitals to her? if so? why did not help her now?

    3. Do you think it is wise to suggest residents of Italy about that, this exact moment?
    especially from the other side of the Ocean, declaring so easily EU as the 'scapegoat', the bull to sacrifice to clear the sins.
    have you search if and I say If, it is a political mistake, a hidden backdoor not locked, something unpredicted etc etc?

    I keep my cents for change as we say in Greece.
    a) NATO right now at this moment is helping noone, Just keeps it troops outside infection, even the humanitarian project that can deploy are hold,
    I cooperate and work for some moons with such projects,
    b) At least Italy is a democratic state and has the right to vote and exit the Union, and reenter if wants, some others Don't.


    and a general question to those on the other side of ocean,
    If USA break Italy's records, or can not hold the line,
    Would you blame your Union? would you ask your state to leave?
    or you keep say China the Bull of sin and Europe the scapegoat?


    Coronavirus lockdown is not good for most of us all,
    especially the ones who have aged parents,
    soon some of us may show marks of non normal/healthy psychology
    I was in Panic 3 days before, my beloved wife, which I can not stand 24 hours beside me, helped me,
    The pressure we all accept is high,

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    I think you guys understand the word “lynching” with two different connotations.

    The word Lynch or Lynching has a very profound and strong meaning in the United States,

    it has a lighter weight in some other Countries.

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    Yetos:

    I haven't heard the USA is moving that many forces to Greece. For the record, I think it would be good to move forces to Greece and get that out of Turkey as Erdogan is not someone long term that I think the USA should Trust. My point of Italy not being in the EU, if they choose, is the same thing with the UK. The US will eventually do direct Trade Deals with the UK, these Trade deals will be done based on classic Supply/Demand and reach an optimal solution for both countries, sort of like the Nash Equilibrium which won Prof. Nash the Nobel prize in Economics. Win Win for both USA and UK. Goods that are in excess Demand in UK, but supply can't meet them, USA can sell those goods, same thing in the USA. Deals on key National goods for National Security, Medicine, both countries can designate appropriate levels that must be made in each respective country. So the USA and UK will be a good pilot test so to speak to see how bilateral Trade deals can work between 2 Countries that respect the rule of law and don't use trade practices, that for example, the Chinese Do, which is nothing amounting to Free Trade.


    My point being about Italy not only being in NATO, but being a country that has been a long-term loyal NATO ally and as I stated, 2nd most US Military personnel are based in Europe. France for example, the US has less than 100, in the Nordic Countries, zero. So unless you have some news in Greece that I don't have in the USA about the US moving half its forces from Italy to Greece, I have not heard that. Like I said the USA has a long history of having US Military personnel in Italy without significant anti-American Protests, something untrue about other countries. Don't you think there is reason the USA has less than 100 Military personnel in France, whereas 13,000 in Italy. Which one during say the 1980's during the Reagan/Thatcher/Soviet Era would you say was more anti-American. Most Americans will tell you France.

    If Italy were not in the EU could it have done better. It is my belief that countries that can produce the essentials for basic security, food, and medicine internally are better off. When crisis like this hit, then what. The EU has in my view not worked for Italy. Italy, like Greece, bears the brunt of the Migrant crisis that are pushed for and supported by the EU bureaucrats, most of which can't get elected back in their home countries, the UN, and in particular Mr. Macron and Ms. Merkel. The EU has been used by certain countries, in my opinion, to control the European economy for the benefits of certain Corporations in those same countries. Italy is seen mostly as a strategic country to move and ship goods from its numerous ports (I know there is no 1 single port there as large as the one in Holland) but if you add them up in Italy (they have 311 Sea Ports), the are 2nd in the EU in the total value of goods that go in and out of EU Ports. So from a strictly Economic point of view, Italy's Ports are strategic to all of the raw Materials and finished goods that move in and out of the EU. So my view is how can Italy best leverage that for its Economic and in this case Health Security. What these data tell me is that the EU Brussels Bureaucrats and countries North of the Alps see Italy as being nothing other than a key Port Country for Supply Chains and a market for them to send finished goods back to. So if Italy had leaders that can leverage its strategic assets, then I think they could be better off out the EU. Look at the data, The Netherlands, Italy, UK, and Spain all take in more than 100 Million tons of goods just in their main ports. You think the UK realizes that it has important Ports and that those Ports will enable them to have a successful economy that works for the people of the UK. I think Italy can do the same.

    https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statis...quarterly_data


    And you are correct, Italian voters will decide this if there is a Up or Down vote on EU. I think there will be a vote that Italians will get to choose.

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    I think you guys understand the word “lynching” with two different connotations.

    The word Lynch or Lynching has a very profound and strong meaning in the United States,

    it has a lighter weight in some other Countries.
    Salento: Fair enough, I obviously took it in the connotation as we understand it here in the USA.

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    @ Trapani,

    Is not the correct time now to speak such,
    is Like at 10 days when USA is under nervous stress and emotional collapse
    someone attacks US system, constitution etc,

    and plz STOP IT,
    it is not morale to them (Italians) now.

    YOU JUST PROMISE THEM ANOTHER PARADISE THE TIME THEY FIGHT FOR THEIR LIVES AND MOARN THEIR DEAD.
    The only you achive, is to make foundamentalists that make coronavirus battle worse,

    EU agreements are fair enough to give Italy an exit if she wants,
    and after the coronavirus war, Italy and Italians would have plenty of time to think and decide,
    and you will plenty of space and time to express your ideas.
    But now, brings more panic and nerves and stress them.

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    After Vo' Euganeo the village which erase coronavirus
    I learn from from news about another place, Ferrera Erbognone an area inside the high virus, with high average aged people

    https://www.ilgiorno.it/pavia/cronac...rera-1.5085963

    https://www.laregione.ch/rubriche/cu...do-corona-free

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    Country: Albania



    Countries with strong tourism will be deeply affected by this economically if it continues during summer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ihype02 View Post
    Countries with strong tourism will be deeply affected by this economically if it continues during summer.
    Indeed, Greece is not going to open boarders before end of June if all things international prove well
    with possible date the end of Octomber

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis President James Bullard predicted the U.S. unemployment rate may hit 30% in the second quarter because of shutdowns to combat the coronavirus, with an unprecedented 50% drop in gross domestic product.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ar-to-30-in-2q
    The current situation is completely untenable, and will destroy the United States, and the world. They better come up with a god damn vaccine ASAP! We don't have time to wait.

    Peak unemployment during the Great Depression reached a staggering 24.9% in 1933

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/sarahha.../#396cd9ff15bd
    There can be no covenants between men and lions

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    COUNTRY Population /1000 Confirmed infected deaths upon confirmed Confirmed infected /1000 people deaths /confirmed infected














    San Marino 33 224 22 6,7879 0,0982
    Europe with Swiss's Statistics (No Russia)
    Andora 76 334 6 4,3947 0,0180
    Luxenbourg 614 1950 21 3,1759 0,0108


    Feroe isls 52 159 0 3,0577 0,0000
    Infected Deaths
    Iceland 364 1020 2 2,8022 0,0020
    1186380,56 6640,50
    Swiss 8570 14829 300 1,7303 0,0202


    Spain 46733 80110 6803 1,7142 0,0849
    Europe with Italy's Statistics (No Russia)
    Italy 60318 97689 10779 1,6196 0,1103
    Liechtenstein 39 56 0 1,4359 0,0000


    Austria 8903 8788 86 0,9871 0,0098
    Infected Deaths
    Belgium 11516 10836 431 0,9410 0,0398
    1110431,34 75652,94
    Norway 5368 4284 25 0,7981 0,0058


    Deutch 83149 62095 541 0,7468 0,0087


    Netherlands 17425 10866 771 0,6236 0,0710


    France 67022 40174 2606 0,5994 0,0649
    USA with Swiss's statistics
    Porugal 10277 5962 119 0,5801 0,0200
    Esthonia 1328 679 3 0,5113 0,0044


    USA 328240 142106 2479 0,4329 0,0174
    Infected Deaths
    Denmark 5823 2395 72 0,4113 0,0301
    567966,27 6640,50
    sweden 10303 3700 110 0,3591 0,0297


    Slovenia 2100 730 11 0,3476 0,0151
    USA with Italy's statistics
    Ireland 6573 2121 22 0,3227 0,0104
    Malta 494 151 0 0,3057 0,0000


    UK 67547 19522 1228 0,2890 0,0629
    Infected Deaths
    Czech 10650 2817 16 0,2645 0,0057
    531606,44 36217,99
    Finland 5521 1240 11 0,2246 0,0089


    Lettonia 1920 347 0 0,1807 0,0000


    Cyprus 1189 214 6 0,1800 0,0280


    Croatia 4076 713 6 0,1749 0,0084


    Lithuania 2794 460 7 0,1646 0,0152
    Montenegro 631 85 1 0,1347 0,0118
    Severna Mac 2077 259 6 0,1247 0,0232
    Turkey 82004 9217 131 0,1124 0,0142
    China with Swiss's statistics
    Greece 10768 1159 39 0,1076 0,0336
    Serbia 6964 741 13 0,1064 0,0175


    Moldova 2682 263 2 0,0981 0,0076
    Infected Deaths
    Romania 19402 1815 43 0,0935 0,0237
    2470314,14 28882,22
    Bosnia 3511 323 6 0,0920 0,0186
    Albania 2877 212 10 0,0737 0,0472
    China with Italy's statistics
    Slovakia 5450 314 0 0,0576 0,0000
    mainland China 1427648 82122 3304 0,0575 0,0402


    Kossovo 1810 94 1 0,0519 0,0106
    Infected Deaths
    Bulgaria 7000 346 8 0,0494 0,0231
    2312170,59 157526,62
    Poland 38386 1862 22 0,0485 0,0118
    Hungary 9773 408 13 0,0417 0,0319
    Ukraine 42031 475 10 0,0113 0,0211
    Russia 146745 1534 8 0,0105 0,0052
    Belarus 9492 94 0 0,0099 0,0000







    Average Europe -Russia 685635 392132 24309 0,5719 0,0620






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    2 members found this post helpful.
    It is spring outside,

    Paschalies are on their max (Easter flowers, Syringa Vulgaris, endemic at Balkans)


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    60 Minutes Australia
    @60Mins
    Just two weeks ago the head of Emergency at Wuhan Central hospital went public, saying authorities had stopped her and her colleagues from warning the world. She has now disappeared, her whereabouts unknown.

    First defective test kits, now defective masks.
    The Spectator Index
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    NETHERLANDS: Country's government recalls 600,000 masks from hospitals for being defective after being bought from China

    Urns in Wuhan far exceed the total deaths reported...
    #Wuhan residents estimate, based on calculations of cremations and urns now being returned to families, that between 42k-46k (!!) died in city + surrounding areas in the 2.5 months of lockdown. Far more than official figure of 2535 deaths. #COVID19 http://rfa.org/english/news/china/wu...020182846.html



    "Intensive care for coronavirus patients now limited to those 'reasonably certain' to survive, NHS London Trust concedes."


    How not to get infected (advice from a Japanese veteran doctor):

    1. Above all and most important: wear a mask. Reuse it for two weeks. Disinfect it with alcohol.

    2. Keep your mouth shut. Breathe through your nose (infections are worse/more likely if they enter via the mouth).

    3. When outside: don't touch your face. Don't ever touch your eyes. Don't even think about picking your nose. Don't put a finger in your mouth whatever you do.

    4. If you have hayfever: double your efforts to clear it as it can make your nose stuffy and make you a mouth breather.

    5. The sooner you take a shower after coming home the better. Best if you go straight to the shower/bath. Wash all your clothes. 6. Don't drink. Alcohol makes you lower your guard, talk loudly to people (spit flies further) and take risks. Save the alcohol to rub on doorhandles.
    6. Stop smoking.

    (I realize the hay fever bit might be a little Japan specific since such a large part of the population suffers from it, & the mask advice was specific for the cheapo mask and ethanol combos you can get easily in stores in Japan, your country probably has a dif. mask situation..)

    Adding#1 for daily use: wash your hands thoroughly before taking off the mask. take the mask off by ONLY touching the straps behind both ears. put the mask on the plate with the outer side of mask upward, "cook" it in the microwave up to 1 min. disinfect the outer side w/ alcohol

    That wouldn’t work at all for an N95 respirator.

    If the mask is a respirator, absolutely *do not* use liquid to disinfect; it will destroy the effectiveness. Heat at 150F/65C for at least 3 minutes."

    I wonder if a UV lamp or wand would work?

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    This morning, I opened up my web browser, and I usually get notification from livescience. Today, I saw they are still peddling the 2.2 million deaths, projection. When I click on the article, it briefly mentions one model, that suggests that would be the number if no measures were implemented. A scenario that is obviously not taking place. Yet it get's the headline in the notification, despite the new projection by Dr. Fauci, which is 100,000 to 200,000.

    https://www.livescience.com/coronavi...ed-states.html

    This is alarmist garbage plain and simple, for click-bait. I've lost a lot of respect for that website.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    This morning, I open up my web browser, and I usually get notification from livescience. Today, I saw they are still peddling the 2.2 million deaths, projection. When I click on the article, it briefly mentions one model, that suggests that would be the number if no measures were implemented. A scenario that is obviously not taking place. Yet it get's the headline in the notification, despite the new project by Dr. Fauci, which is 100,000 to 200,000.

    https://www.livescience.com/coronavi...ed-states.html

    This is alarmist garbage plain and simple, for click-bait. I've lost a lot of respect for that website.
    It reads more like it’s an estimation for worst-case scenario, and note they use “could die” not “will”. Maybe it’s a bit alarmist, but if it’s what is needed to get people to be responsible and prevent hospital overload by staying home then so be it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by spruithean View Post
    It reads more like it’s an estimation for worst-case scenario, and note they use “could die” not “will”. Maybe it’s a bit alarmist, but if it’s what is needed to get people to be responsible and prevent hospital overload by staying home then so be it.
    I wish I took a snapshot of the notification, because the headline certainly didn't read like that. It was different from the one at the top of this article.

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    Well, for me it's coming closer. Two women at my son's company have tested positive, and both their husbands are in the hospital and one is on a ventilator. He's only 40.

    I don't know what other precautions we can take, other than what we're already doing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    I wish I took a snapshot of the notification, because the headline certainly didn't read like that. It was different from the one at the top of this article.
    Eh, there are a lot of headlines lately that have been really quick to grab attention which are then edited. I don’t know any other reasoning behind that then either just getting more clicks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    It is spring outside,

    Paschalies are on their max (Easter flowers, Syringa Vulgaris, endemic at Balkans)

    Sooo nice! Everything is still bare in Vilnius. The Paschalies will only bloom at the end of May in Lithuania.
    It was still snowing, because of arctic wind with freezing temperatures during the night today.

    This is how it looks

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Today it is snowing in half the country and in the other it is raining. I don't think I'm going out today. I feel like staying home.

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    Let's say that you were the chief executive of a country and you had the hindsight from the lessons learned. What would you do? Here is what I would do:
    0. Take the shit seriously. Hopefully you already had a plan, otherwise you're SOL.
    1. Immediately ask the legislative branch for a large outlay of emergency money
    2. Seal the borders immediately.
    3. Construct isolation camps in tents or conscripted buildings/indoor stadiums
    4. Anybody that came from suspected areas in the last 14 days will be put in these isolation camps
    5. People that show heavy symptoms in one camp, light in another, asymptomatic in another
    6. Test the hell of the asymptomatic ones until they either develop symptoms or can be cleared
    7. If any have slipped in the general population identify them, contact trace them and put the in these isolation camps
    8. Of course stockpile all necessary supplies beforehand but be ready to conscript industry to manufacture more

    I think the biggest mistake that was made was thinking that isolating at home was enough. You bring the virus from the outside and you pretty much infect the whole household.

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