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Thread: New Coronavirus in China

  1. #1801
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    I'm going to say something that many of you have heard before... not on this site, not on FaceBook, not many places online. But you have heard it, because many people "in real life" think it, and most do so quietly. They might express these thoughts to a family member or maybe a close friend, but nobody is shouting it from the rooftops.

    Today's events are linked. All of them. The ties between Covid 19 and the riots are glaringly obvious. Unfortunately, in my opinion, there are deeper axis points. I have danced around a subject for time, on a few various threads on this site. The music stops. Now.

    How many world-renown experts have said Covid 19 looks to be not from nature, but from man? I'll produce the names later, if you are reading this thread you are familiar with them.

    Laugh if you want when I introduce next subject. After you're done chuckling and rolling your eyes, I want you to weigh what I've said, roll it between your fingers... and then ask yourself... wait a minute... WHY are the leaders of the largest cities in the Western World letting it all burn?

    Jeffrey Epstein was a monster. His "habit" impacted the lives of hundreds... probably thousands of young people. His "habit" was not his profession though. His profession was blackmail.

    Many weak men were caught up in Epstein's evil scheme, Jeffrey pursued politicians, actors, diplomats, and... scientists. Why did he have a penchant for scientific minds? The answer is layered and would require a separate forum. The simple fact is that he did.

    I don't shy away from "Conspiracy Theorist" labels... never have... and when I look for an answer I don't avoid looking under a blanket because someone else has said "oh that... don't mess with that pile... that is taboo". I'm pulling back the sheets. Always.

    So because of this stubborn trait of mine, I'm equipped with a knowledge set most do not have. Most of you don't know that the world's greatest scientific minds are pursued, or maybe a better term would be "lured", by the elite class. If you make it to the very tippy-top of your craft, you are invited to places like the "Bohemian Grove" in California, or maybe to Davos.

    It's in these places where you're work is praised, your intellect is lavished with constant compliments. You are put high on a pedestal... reminded of your incredible worth... repeatedly... like a drumbeat... like a mantra. "You are so important, the difference between you and the common man is vast."

    And that last part, the "common man" that becomes more crucial as the process goes forward. "But why is he bringing this up?" you are probably asking.
    Last edited by nordicwarrior; 03-06-20 at 05:29.

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    Patience. I'll get there.

    So these brilliant scientific minds, over time, are coached, lulled, encouraged to view "common folk" as almost... insects. Yes. Insects. The language, the specific verbiage is bizarre. But why insects?

    Insects are disposable.

    Now I'm NOT saying Covid 19 was purposely developed and released to unleash the specific chain of events we see today. The elites aren't that smart.

    I will ask this question though, "How many people are talking about Jeff Epstein now?" Really, how many people are even concerned with Covid 19 now? We are facing world-wide riots. Civil society is being cooked by the flames of a potential planetary racial war. New York, Atlanta, Los Angeles, and now London, Paris.

    If someone is caught up in some very, very "unpleasant" business, and this same individual has been coaxed into believing his fellow man is basically a form of insect-- can you see now how they might Release The Kracken? (For those of you in places were marijuana is now legal... the Kracken is Covid.)

    "But what about the riots-- how would they be tied-in with this?" I can hear you asking.
    Last edited by nordicwarrior; 03-06-20 at 06:58.

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    It is here that I must point out what happened to George Floyd was not manslaughter, it was not Third Degree Murder.

    That police officer purposely killed Mr. Floyd, while Floyd was under complete physical control and in handcuffs. Floyd's neck was under pressure, under a knee, for almost nine minutes. At a mininium this is Second Degree Murder, and I could be conviced that it was an Murder in the First Degree. The offending officer should have been arrested and charged immediately with Second Degree Murder-- at the least, and his three uniformed buddies should have also been quickly arrested and charged as accessories.

    The delay in justice from the Minnesata Attorney General's office caused this flashpoint.

    But this initial flashpoint has now been picked up and fostered into a raging flame by the mainstream media-- a legacy media who are doing the bidding of their elite paymasters. Coverage of this story has been warped into contortions I've not seen before-- Somehow President Trump is responsible for the killing of an unarmed man at the hands of a police officer in Minnesota?

    The ruling elite wastes little opportunity... when they see a crack in the armor... the figurative knives come out. President Trump wasn't supposed to actually be elected, because he's not a member of their club... and their secrets are now at risk of being exposed.

    Do you think we would have learned about Jeffrey Epstein if Hillary Clinton would have won the election? What about Biden's million-dollar-a-month Ukrainian bribes? Or his much larger Chinese bribes (1.5 billion dollars)?

    Would we have learned that N.A.T.O. had largely become a U.S.A.I.D. rinse scheme benefitting a few pliable politicians, the Atlantic Council, some Generals, and an Admiral or two? (knowledge compliments of the General Flynn side trial against Bijan Kian). Probably not. After all, the N.A.T.O. nations were getting a free ride regarding their defense budgets, and the aforementioned rich... they were getting richer.

    Would we have learned rogue elements of the Intel Community (and not only from the United States, but really all of Europe) have been spying wholesale on everyone?

    Would we have learned that Obama, once held up-- falsely-- as the light of the world, was a complete fraud who jealously spied on his successor?

    It is doubtful that we would have learned these things without President Trump's election. And now that it's time to "pay the piper"... the elite class has decided it would rather fall back on their old reliable "racial tensions" to avoid footing the bill. Actually the elites are in such deep do-do, they have used their compliant, bought and paid-for press to ramp-up racial tensions into full-bore racial riots.

    How did I do? Does that line-up with what we are seeing currently?

    _______________________
    _______________________
    EDIT
    For my friends in Europe-- I would be labelled as a conservative-- I do have family members in law enforcement, I have conservative friends and co-workers, I listen to conservative talk radio and read conservative on-line news aggregators... at no point have I heard from anyone that George Floyd's death was anything else but murder.

    We are all sickened by it.
    Last edited by nordicwarrior; 03-06-20 at 22:14.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nordicwarrior View Post
    It is here that I must point out what happened to George Floyd was not manslaughter, it was not Third Degree Murder.

    That police officer purposely killed Mr. Floyd, while Floyd was under complete physical control and in handcuffs. Floyd's neck was under pressure, under a knee, for almost nine minutes. At a mininium this is Second Degree Murder, and I could be conviced that it was an Murder in the First Degree. The offending officer should have been arrested and charged immediately with Second Degree Murder-- at the least, and his three uniformed buddies should have also been quickly arrested and charged as accessories.

    The delay in justice from the Minnesata Attorney General's office caused this flashpoint.

    But this initial flashpoint has now been picked up and fostered into a raging flame by the mainstream media-- a legacy media who are doing the bidding of their elite paymasters. Coverage of this story has been warped into contortions I've not seen before-- Somehow President Trump is responsible for the killing of an unarmed man at the hands of a police officer in Minnesota?

    The ruling elite wastes little opportunity... when they see a crack in the armor... the figurative knives come out. President Trump wasn't supposed to actually be elected, because he's not a member of their club... and their secrets are now at risk of being exposed.

    Do you think we would have learned about Jeffrey Epstein if Hillary Clinton would have won the election? What about Biden's million-dollar-a-month Ukrainian bribes? Or his much larger Chinese bribes (1.5 billion dollars)?

    Would we have learned that N.A.T.O. had largely become a U.S.A.I.D. rinse scheme benefitting a few pliable politicians, the Atlantic Council, some Generals, and an Admiral or two? (knowledge compliments of the General Flynn side trial against Bijan Khan). Probably not. After all, the N.A.T.O. nations were getting a free ride regarding their defense budgets, and the aforementioned rich... they were getting richer.

    Would we have learned rogue elements of the Intel Community (and not only from the United States, but really all of Europe) have been spying wholesale on everyone?

    Would we have learned that Obama, once held up-- falsely-- as the light of the world, was a complete fraud who jealously spied on his successor?

    It is doubtful that we would have learned these things without President Trump's election. And now that it's time to "pay the piper"... the elite class has decided it would rather fall back on their old reliable "racial tensions" to avoid footing the bill. Actually the elites are in such deep do-do, they have used their compliant, bought and paid-for press to ramp-up racial tensions into full-bore racial riots.

    How did I do? Does that line-up with what we are seeing currently?

    _______________________
    _______________________
    EDIT
    For my friends in Europe-- I would be labelled as a conservative-- I have do have family members in law enforcement, I have conservative friends and co-workers, I listen to conservative talk radio and read conservative on-line news aggregators... at no point have I heard from anyone that George Floyd's death was anything else but murder.

    We are all sickened by it.
    This is not the thread for extended conversations about politics.Let's get back on point.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    Just when I was starting to get hopeful: WHO says there's no proof yet that Covid 19 has mutated to a less lethal form.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...482_story.html

    "All viruses evolve over time, and many infectious-disease experts think the novel coronavirus will eventually become less lethal to human beings, joining four other coronaviruses in causing common colds. But there is no solid evidence so far that it has changed significantly in the five months since it was first recognized among patients in Wuhan, China.“The virus hasn’t lost function on the time scale of two months,” said Andrew Noymer, an epidemiologist at the University of California at Irvine. “Loss of function is something I expect over a time scale of years.”"

    "Vaughn Cooper, an infectious-disease expert at the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, said the new coronavirus mutates slowly compared with influenza and other microbes, and its genetic changes appear to be “mostly inconsequential.”


    “I believe it’s safe to say that the differences that doctors are reporting in Italy are entirely due to changes to medical treatment and in human behavior, which limit transmission and numbers of new infections initiated by large inocula — a larger dose of virus appears to be worse — rather than changes in the virus itself,” he said."


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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    This is not the thread for extended conversations about politics.Let's get back on point.
    You're right Angela.

    I'll start posting pretty pie graphs about hours per day spent washing hands... that are sanctioned by the World Health Organization.

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    Angela, if you will allow me one last thought on my useless political contribution...

    In no way does what I've said give China a free pass. The lab in Wuhan was known to leak dangerous samples like a broken faucet. Please read what French Intelligence is quoted saying about this very lab eleven years ago (France helped build the facilities). If one or two rogue "Epstein conflicted" scientists wanted to Release the Kracken… well Wuhan would have been the ideal birthing place.

    Rant over.

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    Very strange Again a Doctor. Again Wuhan.

    Backlash in China after front-line doctor dies

    By Kerry Allen BBC Monitoring



    The death of a front-line doctor in central China is provoking a backlash against the authorities' handling of the coronavirus pandemic.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-52897017

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Just when I was starting to get hopeful: WHO says there's no proof yet that Covid 19 has mutated to a less lethal form.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...482_story.html

    "All viruses evolve over time, and many infectious-disease experts think the novel coronavirus will eventually become less lethal to human beings, joining four other coronaviruses in causing common colds. But there is no solid evidence so far that it has changed significantly in the five months since it was first recognized among patients in Wuhan, China.“The virus hasn’t lost function on the time scale of two months,” said Andrew Noymer, an epidemiologist at the University of California at Irvine. “Loss of function is something I expect over a time scale of years.”"

    "Vaughn Cooper, an infectious-disease expert at the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, said the new coronavirus mutates slowly compared with influenza and other microbes, and its genetic changes appear to be “mostly inconsequential.”


    “I believe it’s safe to say that the differences that doctors are reporting in Italy are entirely due to changes to medical treatment and in human behavior, which limit transmission and numbers of new infections initiated by large inocula — a larger dose of virus appears to be worse — rather than changes in the virus itself,” he said."

    I am not sure I believe them. It's the same thing with the masks. When there were not enough masks for even the medical professionals they told masks were not effective. Now they tell us to wear them. Of course they don't want us to relax the social distancing precautions so they tell us that the virus is not weakening. I am not relaxing but the virus is weakening.

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    New England medical journal retracts papers which said hydroxychloroquinine is dangerous. How nice. Anyone who has ever taken it already knew that. I wonder if Chris Cuomo will now apologize for all the things he said about the administration saying it might be a possible treatment. It isn't, but neither is it the poison they made it out to be. Everything is about agendas. You're for or against something in this new world depending on your political "tribe". What a disaster.
    "Lancet, New England Journal retract Covid-19 studies, including one that raised safety concerns about malaria drugs @DrewQJoseph
    “We can no longer vouch for the veracity of the primary data sources” authors Mehra, Ruschitzka, and Patel said in statement."


    Israel's school reopening strategy (with no masks because of the heat) is looking like a total failure. Big spikes leading to cascading closures again.


    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...e-things-wrong

    The more that comes out after the investigation the more wrong he'll be seen to be.

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    What we already feared when Brazil became the 2nd in the ranking of Covid-19 cases about two weeks ago ended up happening today: Brazil surpassed Italy and now ranks 3rd in the number of people who died of Covid-19 (and, truth be told, the real number is certainly a few thousands higher, because undertesting particularly until May caused many people to die of SARS suspected to be Covid-19, but never confirmed).

    My home state, Ceará (CE), is approaching 4,000 deaths even though it has only 9.1 million inhabitants. My home town, Fortaleza, is in an even direr situation: 26,514 cases and 2,424 deaths in a city of 2.7 million (~9800 cases per million and ~900 deaths per million).

    The situation is becoming really dramatic, but what is even worse is that the pandemic curve in Brazil is NOT flattening as fast as in other countries. I don't even want to realize now how awful things will likely be by the end of June.

    My sole solace (oops, an unintended alliteration there) is that the views of the sky have been particularly beautiful during these confined times (could the cleaner air have played some role in it?

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    Cleaner air is good, because SARS might be travelling along with small particle pollution (at least I remember reading theories about it)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    New England medical journal retracts papers which said hydroxychloroquinine is dangerous. How nice. Anyone who has ever taken it already knew that. I wonder if Chris Cuomo will now apologize for all the things he said about the administration saying it might be a possible treatment. It isn't, but neither is it the poison they made it out to be. Everything is about agendas. You're for or against something in this new world depending on your political "tribe". What a disaster.
    "Lancet, New England Journal retract Covid-19 studies, including one that raised safety concerns about malaria drugs @DrewQJoseph
    “We can no longer vouch for the veracity of the primary data sources” authors Mehra, Ruschitzka, and Patel said in statement."


    Israel's school reopening strategy (with no masks because of the heat) is looking like a total failure. Big spikes leading to cascading closures again.


    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...e-things-wrong

    The more that comes out after the investigation the more wrong he'll be seen to be.
    As far as the study is concerned, observational studies are not worth the paper or the bits they're published on. You need large population well designed random controlled studies.

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Two elite medical journals retract coronavirus papers over data integrity questions

    The Lancet paper, which claimed an antimalarial drug touted by President Donald Trump for treatment of COVID-19 could cause serious harm without helping patients, had had a global impact, halting trials of one of the drugs by the World Health Organization (WHO) and others...Three authors on the Lancet paper requested the retraction, after initiating an independent review of the raw hospital patient data summarized and provided by Surgisphere, a small Chicago-based company operated by Sapan Desai, the fourth author of the study. Desai had previously said he and his co-authors—cardiac surgeon Mandeep Mehra of Harvard University and Brigham and Women's Hospital, Frank Ruschitzka of University Hospital Zürich, and Amit Patel, an adjunct faculty member at the University of Utah—were getting such an audit of the data, but the agreement apparently fell apart.


    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...rity-questions


    Now this:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...oroquine-storm

    And this:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ata-questioned
    There can be no covenants between men and lions

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    Two elite medical journals retract coronavirus papers over data integrity questions

    The Lancet paper, which claimed an antimalarial drug touted by President Donald Trump for treatment of COVID-19 could cause serious harm without helping patients, had had a global impact, halting trials of one of the drugs by the World Health Organization (WHO) and others...Three authors on the Lancet paper requested the retraction, after initiating an independent review of the raw hospital patient data summarized and provided by Surgisphere, a small Chicago-based company operated by Sapan Desai, the fourth author of the study. Desai had previously said he and his co-authors—cardiac surgeon Mandeep Mehra of Harvard University and Brigham and Women's Hospital, Frank Ruschitzka of University Hospital Zürich, and Amit Patel, an adjunct faculty member at the University of Utah—were getting such an audit of the data, but the agreement apparently fell apart.


    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...rity-questions


    Now this:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...oroquine-storm
    After the proper trials, it might indeed have turned out that chloroquinine doesn't help either in prevention or treatment. The point is that the studies were halted, and I can guarantee that probably other people taking it who need it stopped taking it, because of a media frenzy over a botched paper.

    What I want to know is who is this fourth partner in the study who collected the data, and what went wrong. It's important.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    Two elite medical journals retract coronavirus papers over data integrity questions

    The Lancet paper, which claimed an antimalarial drug touted by President Donald Trump for treatment of COVID-19 could cause serious harm without helping patients, had had a global impact, halting trials of one of the drugs by the World Health Organization (WHO) and others...Three authors on the Lancet paper requested the retraction, after initiating an independent review of the raw hospital patient data summarized and provided by Surgisphere, a small Chicago-based company operated by Sapan Desai, the fourth author of the study. Desai had previously said he and his co-authors—cardiac surgeon Mandeep Mehra of Harvard University and Brigham and Women's Hospital, Frank Ruschitzka of University Hospital Zürich, and Amit Patel, an adjunct faculty member at the University of Utah—were getting such an audit of the data, but the agreement apparently fell apart.


    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...rity-questions


    Now this:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...oroquine-storm

    And this:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ata-questioned
    The problem is that many other studies had also reached the very same conclusion, including one in Brazil. Hospitals in France and Sweden that had pioneered its use to treat Covid-19 patients refrained from doing so or kept using it only in serious cases, for which of course anything goes, there is not much that they can risk losing. They are of course flawed and incomplete, not enough time to have a very carefully and extensively researched study has passed, but I think there is more than enough evidence to say the likelihood is that hydroxichloroquine is at least not significantly effective against Covid-19, and since it's generally used with azithromicine it's really plausible that this treatment may actually increase mortality rates a bit.

    Nowhere else has chloroquine/hydroxichloroquine become such a hot political topic (yes, political, not scientific or strictly medical) as in Brazil, where the President followed the cue of Trump and started supportinh chloroquine repeatedly and intensely as a sort of "certain and safe solution" to the pandemic, not coincidentally together with urges for the population to stop social isolation and go back to work immediately to stop harming the economy (of course, if people believe a great solution has already been found it's easier to persuade them to do so and to start opposing the measures enforced by state and city governments - most of them turned into "enemies" of the federal government because of this pandemic - in much larger numbers).

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    CQ will always be the red-headed stepchild for the big pharma crowd, only because it's so cheap to produce. You can make a five gallon bucket full for roughly the same price as a can of paint. I said this weeks or months ago. If you read the last study carefully, it does show a very slight (a bit over 2%) level of improvement over placebo. The scientists said it was statistically unimportant though.

    This might shock some of you who know that I am a big Trump supporter, but I am going to predict the mortality rate for this virus-- when all is said and done-- will be at 3.4% of entire population. It won't be over the course of one year, but after three years.

    The current Covid lull in the U.S. and Europe is due to warmer weather and it's impact on our living habits. We tend to be outdoors and away from shared air facilities in the summer months. The vitamin D levels are higher now than in wintertime, mental moods are better (no seasonal affective disorder), even the carbon dioxide levels are lower (by a tiny bit, but it matters with something like Covid). People are also eating more fresh fruit, berries, and vegetables this time of year.

    Look back at the 1918 Flu. It hit in three separate "waves" with the second wave being the most deadly. I think Covid is every bit as dangerous. The workers in the meat packing plant in Missouri that were asymptomatic about a month ago-- they showed up that way only because they had only very recently acquired the virus. Covid spread through those cramped manufacturing lines like wildfire and the tests were given immediately after viral load was acquired. Covid is a bad little bugger as is, and it will also keep mutating until it figures out a way to spread more effectively again.

    I do hope I'm wrong on this.
    Last edited by nordicwarrior; 06-06-20 at 02:41.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ygorcs View Post
    The problem is that many other studies had also reached the very same conclusion, including one in Brazil. Hospitals in France and Sweden that had pioneered its use to treat Covid-19 patients refrained from doing so or kept using it only in serious cases, for which of course anything goes, there is not much that they can risk losing. They are of course flawed and incomplete, not enough time to have a very carefully and extensively researched study has passed, but I think there is more than enough evidence to say the likelihood is that hydroxichloroquine is at least not significantly effective against Covid-19, and since it's generally used with azithromicine it's really plausible that this treatment may actually increase mortality rates a bit.

    Nowhere else has chloroquine/hydroxichloroquine become such a hot political topic (yes, political, not scientific or strictly medical) as in Brazil, where the President followed the cue of Trump and started supportinh chloroquine repeatedly and intensely as a sort of "certain and safe solution" to the pandemic, not coincidentally together with urges for the population to stop social isolation and go back to work immediately to stop harming the economy (of course, if people believe a great solution has already been found it's easier to persuade them to do so and to start opposing the measures enforced by state and city governments - most of them turned into "enemies" of the federal government because of this pandemic - in much larger numbers).
    I actually have doses of hydroxychloroquine in my house that we were supposed to use to prevent malaria on our trip for an African safari. When it was first mentioned, I was hoping that it would be effective, since we already had it on hand. Though if I had Covid-19, I'm not willing to give it a find out without the confidence of the medical community.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    I actually have doses of hydroxychloroquine in my house that we were supposed to use to prevent malaria on our trip for an African safari. When it was first mentioned, I was hoping that it would be effective, since we already had it on hand. Though if I had Covid-19, I'm not willing to give it a find out without the confidence of the medical community.
    I wouldn't take any medication you don't need, but it's a perfectly safe medication which people have been taking for thirty years. The only side effect of concern is to the eyes with extremely high doses, and a yearly eye exam takes care of it.

    The hysteria over how dangerous it is was media driven and politically motivated.

    As I've said numerous times, that doesn't mean it would have helped with covid. The bad thing is that the rigorous tests were never done, and many people who need it and would benefit from it got needlessly frightened, but who cares if it makes a good story and helps your cause.

    I also know a couple of doctors who took it prophylactically because they knew all the hysteria was crap.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    I actually have doses of hydroxychloroquine in my house that we were supposed to use to prevent malaria on our trip for an African safari. When it was first mentioned, I was hoping that it would be effective, since we already had it on hand. Though if I had Covid-19, I'm not willing to give it a find out without the confidence of the medical community.
    Apparently it' doesn't work well as prophylactic. From June 3:
    Column: Study concludes chloroquine drugs promoted by Trump are worthless against coronavirus
    https://www.latimes.com/business/sto...st-coronavirus

    (...)
    "Those doubts aren’t relevant to the Minnesota study, in which half of the 821 participants received a five-day treatment with hydroxychloroquine and half received five days of a vitamin pill as a placebo.


    The trial was double-blinded, meaning that neither the subjects nor the researchers knew which treatment they were receiving.
    The subjects were followed for two weeks to see if they developed symptoms of COVID-19.

    'Approximately 12% of those given hydroxychloroquine developed COVID-19 versus approximately 14% given the vitamin placebo,' the researchers reported. The difference was not statistically significant."

    (...)

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    ^^That's as may be, but that has nothing to do with the papers which were withdrawn.

    The papers which were withdrawn, over "bad" data which has yet to be explained, said it was "dangerous", which doctors who work with it every day knew was crap, which is why so many of them were taking it prophylactically.

    The biggest travesty is the people who need it, and were scared out of taking it. Criminal.

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    This is hot off the presses... "A secretly recorded meeting between the editors-in-chief of "The Lancet" and "New England Journal of Medicine" reveal both men bemoaning the "criminal" influence big pharma has on scientific research."

    Key names and places:
    Richard Horton
    Phillippe DousTe-Blazy
    Chatham House

    Angela, as a small favor, could you rate my powers of prediction on a scale between one and one hundred? I think I have some skills here... what says you?

    Richard Horton (EIC of The Lancet) also says: "Now we are not going to be able to basically, if this continues, PUBLISH ANY MORE CLINICAL RESEARCH DATA BECAUSE THE PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES ARE SO FINANCIALLY POWERFUL today and are able to use such methodologies, as to have us accept paper which are apparently methodologically perfect, but which in reality, MANAGE TO CONCLUDE WHAT THEY WANT THEM TO CONCLUDE."

    p.s. I added caps for emphasis
    Last edited by nordicwarrior; 11-06-20 at 03:42.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nordicwarrior View Post
    This is hot off the presses... "A secretly recorded meeting between the editors-in-chief of "The Lancet" and "New England Journal of Medicine" reveal both men bemoaning the "criminal" influence big pharma has on scientific research."

    Key names and places:
    Richard Horton
    Phillippe DousTe-Blazy
    Chatham House

    Angela, as a small favor, could you rate my powers of prediction on a scale between one and one hundred? I think I have some skills here... what says you?

    Richard Horton (EIC of The Lancet) also says: "Now we are not going to be able to basically, if this continues, PUBLISH ANY MORE CLINICAL RESEARCH DATA BECAUSE THE PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES ARE SO FINANCIALLY POWERFUL today and are able to use such methodologies, as to have us accept paper which are apparently methodologically perfect, but which in reality, MANAGE TO CONCLUDE WHAT THEY WANT THEM TO CONCLUDE."

    p.s. I added caps for emphasis
    Well, I have a problem with some of this. First of all, pharmaceutical companies, or at least the ones which make chloroquine, would seem to me to WANT the study to show that it's efficacious against COVID both as a prophylactic or for treatment.

    Second of all, they wouldn't make much money, because the patent is long expired and it's cheap as dirt to make and buy.

    Third and most important anyone wanting to get to the bottom of this would have to investigate the disgusting scientist, Sapan Desai, CEO of Surgisphere, who provided the data and see if he has any specific ties to a pharmaceutical company or to any other group for that matter.

    It's possible, but it's also possible he's just an incompetent and fraudulent quack, because this disgrace to the scientific community is having all his myriad papers pulled and audited, and it turns out he even digitally manipulated the visuals on his PHD dissertation. Of course, if all his work is sold to a specific company, that would be a different story, but again, a pharmaceutical company would WANT this medicine to be seen to work, and that's not what the "data" such as it was, showed. It might be possible that if someone was paying him to do it, it would be someone hoping to embarrass the administration, although I suppose it could also be some company making a different drug.

    Another possibility is that the other scientists just expressed the perhaps innocent comment that they hoped it wouldn't work because of their own prejudices, and he happily obliged.

    Needless to say, a lot of this would be extremely difficult to prove in a court of law, and, like Rorschach tests, people often see in the circumstances what they want to see. That 's why actual "evidence" is essential.

    https://amp.theguardian.com/world/20...mpression=true

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    The WHO, the CDC, and even Dr. Fauci got it wrong when they initially said mask wearing doesn't help. Just plain old common sense and looking at the success of the Asian mask wearing cultures told a different story, which is why I said months ago that I was buying and wearing masks.

    Now this...

    "Study suggests that routine face mask use by 50% or more of the population reduced COVID19 spread to an R of less than 1.0. Other studies have generated similar estimates. More widespread masking with higher quality masks could help mitigate a second wave."

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN23G37V

    The ones who are skeptical are probably on record initially as saying they wouldn't work and don't have the guts or the honesty to admit they were wrong.

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