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Thread: What happened in Bósnia?

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    What happened in Bósnia?

    I know that haplogroups do not determine autosomal genetics, but when I went to look at the Bosnian autosomal mix I was hoping to see a much larger amount of WHG based on the exceptional amount of haplogroups like (I2*/I2a). How did the amount of R1a / R1b remain relatively low if the amount of genetics relative to the steppes increased so much? Bosnia.pngHaplogrupos Bosnia.jpg

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    I think that the EHG also had the haplogroup I2, so the vast majority of that I2 you see in Balkanic people like the Bosnians does not come from the WHG in the EEF that lived there before the Bronze Age, but from the EHG portion of the genetic makeup of Steppe people (I'm not sure, but I think some I2 has already been found in BA steppe samples, hasn't it?). Balto-Slavic people also seem to have, generally, an excess of EHG that can't be explained by LCA/EBA steppe (Yamnaya, Sredny Stog) samples alone, so they might have got some I2 from local northern EHG groups, too.

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    what if you model them with more than just steppe, whg and anatolian N? maybe it changes a bit when you include EHG or anatolia BA.

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    I've never seen anyone from the Balkans get that much Yamnaya.


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    What program did you use to obtain these results?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I've never seen anyone from the Balkans get that much Yamnaya.
    What do balkaners and south Slavs typically get?

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    Holy crap WHG is a very small percentage, but that's where South Slavs get haplogroup I2 is it not?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hrvclv View Post
    You should include an independent EHG and CHG-rich source to have a better picture of the genetic history of the region. Northeastern Europeans, including Slavs, have a lot of extra EHG in addition to the EHG in their steppe admixture, and there was CHG-rich movement into the Balkans and Italy since the Late Neolithic probably via Chalcolithic and Bronze Age Anatolia. So, using only 3 reference populations will skew results a lot in favor of Yamnaya, which had EHG and CHG.

    Again I also stress that I have noticed, comparing the results of Vahaduo to those I get using the R software and nMonte2, the Multiple test does not work as well as the single one, the results are somewhat distorted and less accurate, so I'd caution against reading too much into them. Testing each sample separely using the Single tool is more reliable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ygorcs View Post
    You should include an independent EHG and CHG-rich source to have a better picture of the genetic history of the region. Northeastern Europeans, including Slavs, have a lot of extra EHG in addition to the EHG in their steppe admixture, and there was CHG-rich movement into the Balkans and Italy since the Late Neolithic probably via Chalcolithic and Bronze Age Anatolia. So, using only 3 reference populations will skew results a lot in favor of Yamnaya, which had EHG and CHG.

    Again I also stress that I have noticed, comparing the results of Vahaduo to those I get using the R software and nMonte2, the Multiple test does not work as well as the single one, the results are somewhat distorted and less accurate, so I'd caution against reading too much into them. Testing each sample separely using the Single tool is more reliable.
    Well... I was just trying to answer the question above, which obviously referred to the model in the OP.

    As far as I know, the Multiple Test in Vahaduo simply compiles the results you get with the Single Test, without changing them. How reliable it is is another question, open for debate.

    The models you suggest need to be carefully considered - or else you'll get another type of "bias", with the CHG being transferred onto a more southern population, and the Yamnaya artificially reduced. Something to do with Kura-Araxes, maybe? I'll give it a thought when I have more time.

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    Just gave it a try, with Ganj Dareh and/or Kura-Araxes (vs Bosnians). Both were ignored in the results - even with Afanasievo as a proxy for EHG.

    Only way to get K-A to appear in the results is to run it against Karelia HG / Pinarbasi / WHG, ie, populations twice (or thrice) as old as K-A, which greatly discredits the validity of the model. K-A then only serves as a proxy for CHG - probably the CHG share in Yamnayans.

    I'm sceptical much of the CHG in Bosnians came via the southern route. It might be a different story in Crete or the Peloponnese, though.

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