Countries that believe their culture is superior to others

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I think you aren't speaking of the today's Greece, that chauvinistic feeling, i think is consecuence of a social crisis of these days, it is the only way they have to feel better, the fachas in Spain and the fachos in France have the same feeling of mitical superiority towards the others countries, a superiority that others countries fail to aknowledge which give to then reasons to be anti-europeans,

No we just want to maintain our culture as it was before the migrations. Now we also wanted cheap labor to clean our hotels and houses and to build our second homes which are conflicting aims. Just like the French and the Italians.
 
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I don't know, saying that one can be too proud of their culture, despite what you consider short comings/"unadvanced", seems just as subjective a considering one's culture to be superior. For example, I think the cuisine of my family's region of Italy is "superior" to anything from say India. But that is just a matter of taste, and in matters of taste, there can be no disputes. At the same time, I think things like yoga, are admirable cultural accomplishments. Of which the Barese have no equivalency of. Perhaps it is just a matter of being comfortable with what you are accustomed to. I think the question of the survey itself is too ridged.

Better than Yoga, the goal is mastering vision acuity, speed, coordination, anticipation, accuracy, balance, ... and to win :)

To awaken all senses, in the past, they did it with real knives:

 
No we just want to maintain our culture as it was before the migrations. Now we also wanted cheap labor to clean our hotels and houses and to build our second homes which are conflicting aims. Just like the French and the Italians.


but we still do not bear children, our tombstone

Μηδιζειν, το ζησαμε και το ζουμε ακομα,
 
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No we just want to maintain our culture as it was before the migrations. Now we also wanted cheap labor to clean our hotels and houses and to build our second homes which are conflicting aims. Just like the French and the Italians.

but why? did your culture change so drasitcally? a certain amount of change should be allowed.

if this conservativeness and in particular the opinion that the culture is superior, should be a defense mechanism then you still would have to answer why this defense mechanism starts so fast compared to other countries like for example france, which has way more foreign people.
FT_18.10.24_Greece.png
 
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did your culture change so drasitcally?
I think it is largely due to US, and Soviet influences. After the Second World War, these two super-powers were competing for blocs of allies, so they conducted influence campaigns primarily based on the virtues their economic systems. Moreover, ethno-nationalistic leanings, particularly for Europe was considered taboo, because of Nazism, and Fascism being their extreme. Moreover, during the Cold War, the Soviets put pressure on the USA to make social changes, because it pointed to inconsistencies in messages of equality, and the Jim Crow South. This was particularly problematic, when the US tried to court non-white countries. The widespread distribution of the television, putting light on lynchings and race laws, accelerated this. This in turn was projected to the rest of the world, under the influence of these super powers, and later just from the USA. Ironically, today, former-Soviet countries are far more ethno-nationalistic, than those that were part of NATO. I think this is because when governments try to socially engineer morality, to an unwilling populace, there is resentment, and a complete backlash against it. That is why I also think it is futile to "nation build" in the middle east.
 
you still defy me,

ok this a newspapper based on Statistics, of 2011
https://www.kathimerini.gr/782557/a...-ths-elladas-poy-proerxontai-apo-to-e3wteriko

at 2011 18,8% of Greek population were migrants and 1rst generation migrants
consider that devastation and illegal migration flows raise at 2014 just count,

"According to the 2011 census, 2,037,196 people (18.8% of the permanent residents) stated that they settled in Greece from a foreign country where they stayed for at least one year."

so that also include greeks who were born in greece then leave for at least a year and then come back, right?
 
"According to the 2011 census, 2,037,196 people (18.8% of the permanent residents) stated that they settled in Greece from a foreign country where they stayed for at least one year."

so that also include greeks who were born in greece then leave for at least a year and then come back, right?


Depends, and not exactly.

among these 2 M could be Greeks, but no nativity type A, and permanent recidence in Hellas

nativity type A = born in Greece, live until 18 + military obligations, and one parent at least must have nativity type A, and have only 1 citizenship.
EU forced us to change the nativity categories,

that is why title says they came/devastate from abroad,
 
Depends, and not exactly.

among these 2 M could be Greeks, but no nativity type A,

nativity type A = born in Greece, live until 18 + military obligations, and one parent at least must have nativity type A, and have only 1 citizenship.
EU forced us to change the nativity categories,

that is why title says 'with origin from abroad'

why no nativity A? if the requirement is just living abroad for 1 year to belong to those 2M then why should there not be type A people in there too. plus, someone who was born in greece lived in greece for let's say 12 years, so he is not type A native, then moves away for a few years and comes back doesn't really have an origin from abroad imo.
 
why no nativity A? if the requirement is just living abroad for 1 year to belong to those 2M then why should there not be type A people in there too. plus, someone who was born in greece lived in greece for let's say 12 years, so he is not type A native, then moves away for a few years and comes back doesn't really have an origin from abroad imo.

the nativty types are many,
nativity type A is considered as permanent Greek from Hellenic continuity, parental, educational, homeland.
anyway,
the article is clear, as it says,

we speak that 18.8% of Hellas were not permanent citizens before,

an example for instance, are the ones who live in Germany, and on Crimaia etc
in Germany there are 2 kinds of Greeks, the omogeneia, and the migrants, the first are considered permanent living abroad, the migrants who have work less time than the requested time still considered Greek, the migrants that work more time than requested are also considered permanent to abroad,
on the other side Crimaea, N Epirus, Greek omogeneia has citizenship , but permanent living abroad, so they are considered as migrants when come to Greece.
they have Greek citizenship but not measured as permanent Hellenic population

lets not mix Citizenship, nationality, with permanent population,

for example at Kazakstan there were 21 villages with Greek origins at 1980's, some went at 1870's and had primary Ottoman identity
the ones who ask from Greek state took citizenship, but when came to Greece are considered as migrants Greeks from abroad, no matter have the citizenship.

Students are always excluded, as special category,

it is not difficult to understand the diffference among permanent living abroad, and permanent living in state.

BTW
Nativity has nothing to do with nationality
and has many types, there were 4-5 types before 80's

the permanent, non permanent living abroad, has to do with many state issues etc etc, as if the other countryis in EU treaties or not etc etc
for example
I Have all Hellenic pappers, citizenship nationality nativity A, taxation number, health insurance number etc etc.
and at my 30 years I move abroad to work, or dwell,
I must inform state, military, etc etc etc so to have different obligations, taxation, health etc etc,
I am temporary resident of abroad,
after a time I must decide if I want to declare permanent recidence abroad or not,
so to avoid problems with law, taxation,obligations etc,
I am not allowed to live abroad and take for example public aid from Greece (although it happened until 2008 crisis) as I am allowed not to be present for my military obligations etc etc

the ones you see as 1 year at the article, are also citizens that come 1 month per year, so not to lose priviledges etc etc,
for example came to Hellas, worked, but permanent living abroad, so they came to take their retirements, or taxes etc etc
 
the nativty types are many,
nativity type A is considered as permanent Greek from Hellenic continuity, parental, educational, homeland.
anyway,
the article is clear, as it says,

we speak that 18.8% of Hellas were not permanent citizens before,

an example for instance, are the ones who live in Germany, and on Crimaia etc
in Germany there are 2 kinds of Greeks, the omogeneia, and the migrants, the first are considered permanent living abroad, the migrants who have work less time than the requested time still considered Greek, the migrants that work more time than requested are also considered permanent to abroad,
on the other side Crimaea, N Epirus, Greek omogeneia has citizenship , but permanent living abroad, so they are considered as migrants when come to Greece.
they have Greek citizenship but not measured as permanent Hellenic population

lets not mix Citizenship, nationality, with permanent population,

for example at Kazakstan there were 21 villages with Greek origins at 1980's, some went at 1870's and had primary Ottoman identity
the ones who ask from Greek state took citizenship, but when came to Greece are considered as migrants Greeks from abroad, no matter have the citizenship.

Students are always excluded, as special category,

it is not difficult to understand the diffference among permanent living abroad, and permanent living in state.

BTW
Nativity has nothing to do with nationality
and has many types, there were 4-5 types before 80's

the permanent, non permanent living abroad, has to do with many state issues etc etc, as if the other countryis in EU treaties or not etc etc
for example
I Have all Hellenic pappers, citizenship nationality nativity A, taxation number, health insurance number etc etc.
and at my 30 years I move abroad to work, or dwell,
I must inform state, military, etc etc etc so to have different obligations, taxation, health etc etc,
I am temporary resident of abroad,
after a time I must decide if I want to declare permanent recidence abroad or not,
so to avoid problems with law, taxation,obligations etc,
I am not allowed to live abroad and take for example public aid from Greece (although it happened until 2008 crisis) as I am allowed not to be present for my military obligations etc etc

the ones you see as 1 year at the article, are also citizens that come 1 month per year, so not to lose priviledges etc etc,
for example came to Hellas, worked, but permanent living abroad, so they came to take their retirements, or taxes etc etc

i don't get it honestly. the article says that people just need to have lived for 1 year abroad and that most people who belong to this group until 1996 were greek expatriates. in any case part of those 18% consists out of greek citizens with no migrant background. and there is still a discrepancy between greece and other european countries with a similar or higher amount of migrants or people with migrant background.
 
The survey question % who say they completely/mostly agree with the statement, "Our people are not perfect, but our culture is superior to others" is loaded or flawed, because it implies that anyone who answers negatively thinks their culture is either inferior to almost all others or the same in degree of quality to all others except one. Basically, it means that anyone who answers yes believes their culture is not the worst. From the results in the map therefore, four fifths of Spaniards would think their culture is one of the two worst in the world. Seeing all the problems in the world, it is very easy for many cultures to believe that they are not the worst.
 
i don't get it honestly. the article says that people just need to have lived for 1 year abroad and that most people who belong to this group until 1996 were greek expatriates. in any case part of those 18% consists out of greek citizens with no migrant background. and there is still a discrepancy between greece and other european countries with a similar or higher amount of migrants or people with migrant background.


Citizenship : Hellenic
Nationality : type A B
Nativity : type A D
Residence : country, abroad,


these that article say are permanent abroad, meaning
Citizenship : Another plus Hellenic
Nationality : other than type A
nativity : type B C D
Residence : Permanent abroad

so simple
 
Citizenship : Hellenic
Nationality : type A B
Nativity : type A D
Residence : country, abroad,


these that article say are permanent abroad, meaning
Citizenship : Another plus Hellenic
Nationality : other than type A
nativity : type B C D
Residence : Permanent abroad

so simple

then why is it nowhwere specified that only those greeks with 2 citizenships are countes as immigrants?

fro example here
https://www.statistics.gr/en/statis...ationsportlet_INSTANCE_qDQ8fBKKo4lN_locale=en


"Note: The number of immigrants includes both persons with Greek citizenship and persons with foreign, unknown or without citizenship."

if someone moves out of greece lives for a few years abroad so that he counts as someone with permanent residency abroad then moves back, why would you count him as a usual immigrant together with migrants with different citizenship?

and why would you fear that he is "devastating" your culture?


 
then why is it nowhwere specified that only those greeks with 2 citizenships are countes as immigrants?

fro example here
https://www.statistics.gr/en/statis...ationsportlet_INSTANCE_qDQ8fBKKo4lN_locale=en


"Note: The number of immigrants includes both persons with Greek citizenship and persons with foreign, unknown or without citizenship."

if someone moves out of greece lives for a few years abroad so that he counts as someone with permanent residency abroad then moves back, why would you count him as a usual immigrant together with migrants with different citizenship?

and why would you fear that he is "devastating" your culture?



the article says προερχονται, not ηλθαν, means abroad origin.

No permanent residence is different than residence abroad,

for example,
My friends father went to Germany at 1960's,
he had 3 sons,
the first born and grew with his grandparents and we were together at school,
he went to Germany every Christmas to meet parents,
he served full military etc etc,
he went to Germany for work for 15 years,
he is not considered as migrant when returns, no Deutsch citizenship, but a card to work and stay if he wants.

the second and 3rd went school at Germany,
have Deutsch citizenship, and only one has Greek
one served military at min time, and ask Greek citizenship, the other not, etc etc
the 3rd one is not even Greek citizen or nationality
while second is considered Greek but permanent residence abroad.

Now all are about 50 years old
No matter brothers, the last 2 return to Greece if happens it counts as migrant,
the father no matter how long lived in Germany is not considered as migrant when he returns.


as an aswer

Table 4. Immigrants who settled in Greece the last five years before the Census, by group ofcountries of origin, age group and place of their usual residence by urban or rural areas duringthe 2011 Census

329.556 people.
it is obvious that total could be 18,8% of population since in 5 only years is about 3%

I can not make it more simple.
 
the article says προερχονται, not ηλθαν, means abroad origin.

No permanent residence is different than residence abroad,

for example,

My friends father went to Germany at 1960's,
he had 3 sons,
the first grew with his grandparents and were together at school,
he went to Germany every Christmas to meet parents,
he served full military etc etc,

the second and 3rd went school at Germany,
have Deutsch citizenship
one served min time, and the other bought the obligations,
they came to Greece every summer for vacations,
even today.

Now all are about 50 years old
No matter brothers, the 2 last are considered permanent residence abroad,
and their return to Greece if happens it counts as migrant,
the father no matter how long lived in Germany is not considered as migrant when he returns


as an aswer

Table 4. Immigrants who settled in Greece the last five years before the Census, by group ofcountries of origin, age group and place of their usual residence by urban or rural areas duringthe 2011 Census

329.556 people.

it is obvious that total could be 18,8% of population since in 5 only years is about 3%

so why do the 2 brothers count as immigrants? do you have to spend a certain amount of time during your childhood in a foreign country? anyway i think we won't get further here. i still think you are splitting hairs if you count them as immigrants and if you think they drastically change your culture. the culture will change no matter what and a certain change and foreign influence should be allowed.
 
so why do the 2 brothers count as immigrants? do you have to spend a certain amount of time during your childhood in a foreign country? anyway i think we won't get further here. i still think you are splitting hairs if you count them as immigrants and if you think they drastically change your culture. the culture will change no matter what and a certain change and foreign influence should be allowed.

not me, the state,
because their residence is permanent abroad, and have no nativity type A

if they change my culture?
that depends,
 
I think it is largely due to US, and Soviet influences. After the Second World War, these two super-powers were competing for blocs of allies, so they conducted influence campaigns primarily based on the virtues their economic systems. Moreover, ethno-nationalistic leanings, particularly for Europe was considered taboo, because of Nazism, and Fascism being their extreme. Moreover, during the Cold War, the Soviets put pressure on the USA to make social changes, because it pointed to inconsistencies in messages of equality, and the Jim Crow South. This was particularly problematic, when the US tried to court non-white countries. The widespread distribution of the television, putting light on lynchings and race laws, accelerated this. This in turn was projected to the rest of the world, under the influence of these super powers, and later just from the USA. Ironically, today, former-Soviet countries are far more ethno-nationalistic, than those that were part of NATO. I think this is because when governments try to socially engineer morality, to an unwilling populace, there is resentment, and a complete backlash against it. That is why I also think it is futile to "nation build" in the middle east.

imo it needs just a certain amount of education and developement plus certainly also wealth to fight ethno-nationalism. poor and uneducated people tend to go for ethnonationalism faster because it gives them security and a feeling of superiority out of nothing. theres probably a direct correlation between ethno nationalism and social developement in many other aspects.
 

I can attest by the number of east European refugees (in particular from the Balkans) and/or immigrants living in Canada that East Europeans definitely have an air of ethnocentricity. So yeah, not a surprise, I believe it.
 
I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with being ethnocentric, or having a preference for your ethnicity. As long as it isn't brought to an irrational extreme, or results in others being treated unfairly.

However, I do think there is something wrong with people that don't have a sense of pride in who they are. Which is also extended to their ethnicity.
 
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