Countries that believe their culture is superior to others

Status
Not open for further replies.

Jovialis

Advisor
Messages
9,276
Reaction score
5,843
Points
113
Ethnic group
Italian
Y-DNA haplogroup
R-PF7566 (R-Y227216)
mtDNA haplogroup
H6a1b7
x2lfHdK.png
 
Wow, please everyone forgive my words, but I'm increasingly surprised and disappointed by the positions of Greece in these opinion surveys about morals, religion and societal values. I thought being so much wealthier and more cosmopolitan (a lot of international tourism and trade) than other parts of the Balkans it'd be more progressive and liberal.
 
I think that this survey gives the measure of people's open-mindedness vs narrow-mindedness. People in Western Europe are less jingoistic and more open-minded about other cultures because:

1) these societies are more multicultural (not just immigrants, but also foreign workers, expats and students from abroad)
2) Western Europeans travel more and are therefore more familiar with other cultures too.

It's ironic that the poorest and least developed countries tend to think of themselves the most highly, while countries that are cultural leaders such as the UK (music, fashion, cinema, education), France (fashion, cuisine), Belgium/Netherlands (liberal laws), Sweden (egalitarianism, sustainability, social progress) are far more humble.
 
I think that this survey gives the measure of people's open-mindedness vs narrow-mindedness. People in Western Europe are less jingoistic and more open-minded about other cultures because:

1) these societies are more multicultural (not just immigrants, but also foreign workers, expats and students from abroad)
2) Western Europeans travel more and are therefore more familiar with other cultures too.

It's ironic that the poorest and least developed countries tend to think of themselves the most highly, while countries that are cultural leaders such as the UK (music, fashion, cinema, education), France (fashion, cuisine), Belgium/Netherlands (liberal laws), Sweden (egalitarianism, sustainability, social progress) are far more humble.

Surprisingly, that open mindedness is what allows exceptionalism and avant-garde thinking in sciences, culture etc.
Most golden era empires in the world were open, synchretic, synthesizing the best traits of its diverse sub cultures and populations.

Take Hellenism as a cultural movement that spread far and wide. Now compare and contrast that forward thinking Hellenism (for the time) with 21st century opinions Greek people from this survey show. Whereas the ancients would look back only as far as to create art, narrative and to pave a way for the future... today it is enough to have pride in something that happened 2600 years ago, with no coherent plan for the future. Took Hellenism and Greece as an example only cause it was the low hanging fruit. But the Balkans and Eastern Europe have similar issues. Deriving self worth from the past.

It is funny most of these cultures are Christian... and religious. I thought pride was the cardinal sin...
 
It's a pitty they don't give the figure for Turkey, I'm curious
I think their rating is pretty high allthough they seem less inspired by the Erdogan propaganda lately.

France used to be quite chauvinistic, but this has eased.

The U.K. still remembers all the propaganda made by the Brexiteers.
 
Surprisingly, that open mindedness is what allows exceptionalism and avant-garde thinking in sciences, culture etc.
Most golden era empires in the world were open, synchretic, synthesizing the best traits of its diverse sub cultures and populations.

Take Hellenism as a cultural movement that spread far and wide. Now compare and contrast that forward thinking Hellenism (for the time) with 21st century opinions Greek people from this survey show. Whereas the ancients would look back only as far as to create art, narrative and to pave a way for the future... today it is enough to have pride in something that happened 2600 years ago, with no coherent plan for the future. Took Hellenism and Greece as an example only cause it was the low hanging fruit. But the Balkans and Eastern Europe have similar issues. Deriving self worth from the past.

It is funny most of these cultures are Christian... and religious. I thought pride was the cardinal sin...

Azerbaijan is 97% Muslim, and has a very high percentage on that map. Pride is a sin in Islam as well.

@Bicicleur, it would be great to see a survey of the whole world. I'm sure Europe as a whole would average out to be among the lowest.

However, I do think it is perfectly healthy to have pride in your culture. But not to a narrow-minded or chauvinistic degree. Nevertheless, aspects of some cultures are better than others, imo. I think at least Greeks have good reason to be proud of Greek culture, given the legacy. I'm not culturally Greek, and I recognize it. As did other Greco-philes throughout history. That being said, I don't think it is the be all end all.
 
Azerbaijan is 97% Muslim, and has a very high percentage on that map. Pride is a sin in Islam as well.

@Bicicleur, it would be great to see a survey of the whole world. I'm sure Europe as a whole would average out to be among the lowest.

However, I do think it is perfectly healthy to have pride in your culture. But not to a narrow-minded or chauvinistic degree. Nevertheless, aspects of some cultures are better than others, imo. I think at least Greeks have good reason to be proud of Greek culture, given the legacy. I'm not culturally Greek, and I recognize it. As did other Greco-philes throughout history. That being said, I don't think it is the be all end all.

Pride is good as long as it doesn't get in the way of intelligence, which happens all to soon.
 
As a Greek, I think that having pride in one's distant past is all good but it should not blind one to the problems of the present. Now I do think that we have plenty of accomplishments to be proud of in the current era and plenty of things to fix, such as endemic corruption. We need to strengthen our democratic institutions, learn to live within our means, quit blaming others for self inflicted wounds, encourage European & American companies to invest in Greece so we can keep highly educated Greeks from seeking employment elsewhere. We need to decide on a set of guiding principles going forward.
Also I would take these surveys with a grain of salt. If you ask a greek whether he's religious 90% would answer yes. Just go to any church on any given Sunday and they are empty except for some old ladies and an occasional old man.
 
Azerbaijan is 97% Muslim, and has a very high percentage on that map. Pride is a sin in Islam as well.

@Bicicleur, it would be great to see a survey of the whole world. I'm sure Europe as a whole would average out to be among the lowest.

However, I do think it is perfectly healthy to have pride in your culture. But not to a narrow-minded or chauvinistic degree. Nevertheless, aspects of some cultures are better than others, imo. I think at least Greeks have good reason to be proud of Greek culture, given the legacy. I'm not culturally Greek, and I recognize it. As did other Greco-philes throughout history. That being said, I don't think it is the be all end all.

That was not my point Jovialis. Just a general observation from looking at the map. As there seems to be a correlation between countries that declare themselves as religious and regarding ones culture as superior.

Excessive Pride is indeed a sin in Islam. Just mentioned Christianity because from my familiarity with it, it is considered the original sin and the source of other sins.

I do not doubt that there might be a correlation between religiosity and regarding ones culture as superior in Islamic countries as well, in fact I would not be surprised. However, from this map of Europe it is hard to make that conclusion as there is no/few predominantly Islamic countries.

As for Azerbaijan... I do not see it in the map. I mean it looks uncolored, meaning it was not surveyed. Maybe you have a source I do not see.
 
That was not my point Jovialis. Just a general observation from looking at the map. As there seems to be a correlation between countries that declare themselves as religious and regarding ones culture as superior.

Excessive Pride is indeed a sin in Islam. Just mentioned Christianity because from my familiarity with it, it is considered the original sin and the source of other sins.

I do not doubt that there might be a correlation between religiosity and regarding ones culture as superior in Islamic countries as well, in fact I would not be surprised. However, from this map of Europe it is hard to make that conclusion as there is no/few predominantly Islamic countries.

As for Azerbaijan... I do not see it in the map. I mean it looks uncolored, meaning it was not surveyed. Maybe you have a source I do not see.

I was mistaken on that last point, Azerbaijan was not surveyed.
 
I think some cultures are objectively more advanced and refined than others in some particular aspects. The fact that other Western countries emulate Ancient Greece, would inspire people there to feel that way I guess.

Modern Greek culture is very different from the ancient one.
 
Modern Greek culture is very different from the ancient one.

Having to survive 2000+ years of Roman/Byzantine/Ottoman empires, innumerable wars, plagues, natural disasters, plundering, etc will do that for you. Not to mention having to absorb populations that don't share your culture, a religion that is not friendly to your culture (Christianity). But we are still friendly to strangers, we still have filotimo (love of honor) we still love to dance and have a good time and occasionally we work hard (when we own the business). We are passionate about our soccer teams and our politics (a little too much). We are very family oriented (multi-generational families live under one roof) and will do anything for our kids to the point of babying them and spoiling them. We have world renown poets and novelists, musicians, and scientists. Imagine if instead of an 2000 years of no major accomplishments the Greek culture kept on going unperturbed.
 
Modern Greek culture is very different from the ancient one.

true,
but there is continuity,
an evolution to survive thrue global changes

culture has a lot to do with public believes, religion, science, economy,
 
Wow, please everyone forgive my words, but I'm increasingly surprised and disappointed by the positions of Greece in these opinion surveys about morals, religion and societal values. I thought being so much wealthier and more cosmopolitan (a lot of international tourism and trade) than other parts of the Balkans it'd be more progressive and liberal.


allow me to add this,
If Greeks did not have this believe
then centuries of Roman and Ottoman occupation Greek culture would not survive.

it is a natural defence to keep alive your culture

Except Greece and Israel, can you find another nation or country,
with so many invasions, occupations etc etc
 
Last edited:
I think that this survey gives the measure of people's open-mindedness vs narrow-mindedness. People in Western Europe are less jingoistic and more open-minded about other cultures because:

1) these societies are more multicultural (not just immigrants, but also foreign workers, expats and students from abroad)
2) Western Europeans travel more and are therefore more familiar with other cultures too.

It's ironic that the poorest and least developed countries tend to think of themselves the most highly, while countries that are cultural leaders such as the UK (music, fashion, cinema, education), France (fashion, cuisine), Belgium/Netherlands (liberal laws), Sweden (egalitarianism, sustainability, social progress) are far more humble.


Don't forget Spain, please.
 
It is important to know how they translate these questions.

In modern Greek, for example, there is no exact translation for the English word culture.
The word 'koultoura' (a loan from Latin) is often used for 'high culture' almost like afaiu German Kultur.
Likely they used the word 'politismos' which is a 19th century neologism used originally to translate French civilization, which has a range of meanings: civilization ~ culture ~ way of life.
Different people would understand different things.

Smart people (the minority in every countrty) would refuse to answer. To me, a 'no' answer makes a more negative impression.
 
Azerbaijan is 97% Muslim, and has a very high percentage on that map. Pride is a sin in Islam as well.

@Bicicleur, it would be great to see a survey of the whole world. I'm sure Europe as a whole would average out to be among the lowest.

However, I do think it is perfectly healthy to have pride in your culture. But not to a narrow-minded or chauvinistic degree. Nevertheless, aspects of some cultures are better than others, imo. I think at least Greeks have good reason to be proud of Greek culture, given the legacy. I'm not culturally Greek, and I recognize it. As did other Greco-philes throughout history. That being said, I don't think it is the be all end all.

I completely agree.

Also, while many Northern and Western Europeans might respond like this on a survey, some of that might be them trying to give the politically correct answer. Also, from things I see people from those areas say on the internet they might not think their “country” is superior, but
they certainly think their “region” of Europe or their general ethnicity is superior to, say, other regions, like Southern Europe. Some of them even claim to be enlightened European leftists without a racist bone in their bodies. :) Hypocrisy and self delusion reign everywhere. Of course, people on these kinds of sites might not be typical.

So, maybe the Greeks are just more honest. :) Although I have to say that here in the US they admix less than any other group I can think of....less than Jews even.

As pertains to France, or even Germany or Britain, one quarter or more of the population is of “foreign” extraction. I would wager a large sum that if you asked descendants of “locals”you’d get a different answer.

It’s all just part of the relativism in all matters which has so permeated a lot of western thought. I’m not a fan.

Do I think western countries are superior to countries where they marry off pre-pubescent girls, don’t educate women, cut off their clitoris so they can’t experience sexual satisfaction, and force them to wear chadors? Yes, I do.
 
Others does not mean just Middle Easterns or Africans.

I don't see how can those countries scoring over 60% (and the rest of Eastern Europe too) compete culturally with countries like France or Italy but that is just me and my taste.
 
I’d also point out to some posters upthread that in the supposedly enlightened and progressive Norway, almost 60 percent of the population thinks their culture is superior. I wonder what the real total for Sweden would be if immigrants and descendants of immigrants were not included.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

This thread has been viewed 59562 times.

Back
Top