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Thread: Place and classify this Greek family - Individually and as a whole

  1. #1
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    Place and classify this Greek family - Individually and as a whole



    Please classify them and tell the top 5 countries ,or even Greek areas, where they could pass.

    The following couple were the parents of my friend's maternal grandmother. All the photos are enhanced and one colorized.
    The man was a Sfakiot Cretan and the woman was half western anatolian greek from Erythrea ,modern day Karaburun in Turkey, from her father's side and half from the island of Milos from her mother's .












    These were their children, my friend's maternal grandmother and her siblings

    Son 1




    Son 2



    Son 3



    Daughter




    My friend is mentioned,though not shown, in the following thread
    https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...reek-regions-)

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    I’m inclined to say Armenian but he’s got some East Asian mix which kinda makes him look like an Afghani or some Pathans from Pakistan due to their Mongoloid mix.

    Or he’s simply a typical Turk with mostly Anatolid looking plus the slight Mongoloid admix.

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    the grand grand ones, are typical of their origin,.

    the man has typical of his origin, the man probably had red or brown-red hair, right?
    what bothers me is the eyes, they do not seem so sfakiotika.
    the woman is of SE Greece and minor Asia looking
    But bothers me the nose, of a sibling
    the nose especially at photo 9 looks more central east European, it is like having a cresent inwards. possibly dark-dark brown or black hair.
    Erythraia ancient city was founded by Cretans.

    women from Erythraia.

    ΟΘΕΝ ΑΙΔΩΣ OY EINAI
    ΑΤΗ ΛΑΜΒΑΝΕΙΝ ΑΥΤΟΙΣ
    ΥΒΡΙΣ ΓΕΝΝΑΤΑΙ
    ΝΕΜΕΣΙΣ ΚΑΙ ΤΙΣΗ ΑΚΟΛΟΥΘΟΥΣΙ ΔΕ

    When there is no shame
    Divine blindness conquers them
    Hybris (abuse, opprombium) is born
    Nemesis and punishment follows.

    Εχε υπομονη Ηρωα
    Η τιμωρια δεν αργει.

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    Well, the sfakiot great-grandfather really has something off about his eyes,mostly on the first photo. Sfakia though is one of the "drifted" regions of Crete in comparison with the rest of the island if I recall correctly from a recent study, like Mani in comparison with the rest of the Peloponnese so... Could it be that an "atypical" phenotype persisted due to this ? I personally have gone for vacation in the area and have seen some atypical people.

    In which countries could each one pass ? What about phenotypes ?


    About the settlements of Erythraia, they were a mix of Cretans from before but mostly after the ottoman occupation of the island along with other islanders and mainlanders
    https://www.mixanitouxronou.gr/voyrl...-karampoyrnoy/

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    the great grand father in photo 2 looks very Cretan.
    photo 1 looks strange, possibly the light or makeup for photo of that era, or something else.
    Sfakia is a mix of 2 population and is obvious to those who know, he is also missing the blue spots at the eyes, or technical methods of that era could not catch.
    hm, surely has Crete inside him, but something extra.
    have seen such eyes but in East Crete,


    the great grand mana, seems of the type that exists from Near East to S Italy. Her origin is included,
    from my second view. she propably has green eyes also.
    hm she has something Central European,

    do you know the colours (hair eyes skin) of great grand mana?

    btw
    from where is that emblem ethnosemon on the beret?
    Is it the old crown? (κορωνα), or a foreign one?
    seems strange?
    Last edited by Yetos; 25-10-20 at 04:48.

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    Son 1 looks quite Eastern European, the eyes and lips.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yetos View Post
    the great grand father in photo 2 looks very Cretan.
    photo 1 looks strange, possibly the light or makeup for photo of that era, or something else.
    Sfakia is a mix of 2 population and is obvious to those who know, he is also missing the blue spots at the eyes, or technical methods of that era could not catch.
    hm, surely has Crete inside him, but something extra.
    have seen such eyes but in East Crete,


    the great grand mana, seems of the type that exists from Near East to S Italy. Her origin is included,
    from my second view. she propably has green eyes also.
    hm she has something Central European,

    do you know the colours (hair eyes skin) of great grand mana?

    btw
    from where is that emblem ethnosemon on the beret?
    Is it the old crown? (κορωνα), or a foreign one?
    seems strange?
    Characteristics of each one

    Father:
    Hair dark brown, Eyes light brown/honey coloured, Skin tone olive in the typical range

    Mother:
    Hair dark blonde, Eyes blue, Skin tone fair

    Son 1:
    Hair blonde to dark blonde, Eyes blue, Skin tone olive in the typical range

    Son 2:
    Hair dark brown, Eyes dark brown, Skin tone olive maybe on the darker end

    Son 3:
    Hair dark brown, Eyes blue, Skin tone olive maybe on the darker end

    Daughter:
    Hair dark blonde, Eyes green, Skin tone fair olive in the typical range

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    Just a Bump.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dushman View Post
    I’m inclined to say Armenian but he’s got some East Asian mix which kinda makes him look like an Afghani or some Pathans from Pakistan due to their Mongoloid mix.

    Or he’s simply a typical Turk with mostly Anatolid looking plus the slight Mongoloid admix.
    What is a typical Turk?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dushman View Post
    I’m inclined to say Armenian but he’s got some East Asian mix which kinda makes him look like an Afghani or some Pathans from Pakistan due to their Mongoloid mix.

    Or he’s simply a typical Turk with mostly Anatolid looking plus the slight Mongoloid admix.
    I read this superficially. Just some thoughts.
    The supposedly 'east-asian' input n this man is rather due to the kind of pictures made at old times: every European had a slightly 'mongoloid' aspect!
    &: Afghani are far to be have all of them a visible 'est-asian' phenotypic input, very far. Only Hazara's show an (strong) 'east-asian' input, IMO. The non-typically 'europoid' traits in some of them (very slight, BTW) are more due to non-differentiation than to real evolved 'east-asian' input.

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    If you weren't telling me they're all Greeks I would have guessed sons 1 and 2 to be Ashkenazi Jews, maybe even the mother in the picture of her alone.

    I see nothing "Mongoloid" in them.

    I also think there's a hell of a lot of variation in Turkey depending on the area.


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    If you weren't telling me they're all Greeks I would have guessed sons 1 and 2 to be Ashkenazi Jews, maybe even the mother in the picture of her alone.

    I see nothing "Mongoloid" in them.

    I also think there's a hell of a lot of variation in Turkey depending on the area.
    I would not be as affirmative as you, but your statement is not totally unbased concerning two sons and mother.
    Concerning Turkey, you're right, but it's true for a lot of countries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    I would not be as affirmative as you, but your statement is not totally unbased concerning two sons and mother.
    Concerning Turkey, you're right, but it's true for a lot of countries.
    Well, probably 1/3 of the people with whom you come into daily contact aren't Ashkenazim. :)

    They look so "Jewish" to me (The mother in the single photo where you can see she's fair eyed looks extraordinarily like one of my Jewish friends...well, with a modern haircut, clothes, and make-up) that I'd almost think we were being trolled.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    If you weren't telling me they're all Greeks I would have guessed sons 1 and 2 to be Ashkenazi Jews, maybe even the mother in the picture of her alone.

    I see nothing "Mongoloid" in them.

    I also think there's a hell of a lot of variation in Turkey depending on the area.
    Turkey is a pretty mountainous country except for the coastal areas. The isolation caused genetic drift.
    Last edited by bigsnake49; 04-12-20 at 03:07.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Well, probably 1/3 of the people with whom you come into daily contact aren't Ashkenazim. :)


    They look so "Jewish" to me (The mother in the single photo where you can see she's fair eyed looks extraordinarily like one of my Jewish friends...well, with a modern haircut, clothes, and make-up) that I'd almost think we were being trolled.

    In the time since I made this thread my friend's mother received her genetic results (tested through myheritage). She's the grand daughter of the couple on the photo. On gedmatch she doesn't have any strong matches with people of jewish ancestry so for her grandmother to have jewish looks as you said it's most probably coincidental.


    Here are her g25 coordinates and some gedmatch calcs. As I don't want to derail the thread though, I will probably open a thread specifically for her


    Code:
    G25 coordinates
    
    Code:
    ChrisMom_scaled,0.110408,0.14319,-0.013953,-0.039406,0.003077,-0.010877,-0.002585,0.003,-0.002863,0.008747,0.002111,0.01154,0.000595,0.003853,-0.0095,-0.012861,-0.007171,0.001774,0.002388,-0.007504,-0.010232,-0.00136,-0.000493,0.002892,-0.001557
    
    
    
    
    ChrisMom,0.0097,0.0141,-0.0037,-0.0122,0.001,-0.0039,-0.0011,0.0013,-0.0014,0.0048,0.0013,0.0077,0.0004,0.0028,-0.007,-0.0097,-0.0055,0.0014,0.0019,-0.006,-0.0082,-0.0011,-0.0004,0.0024,-0.0013
    Her ancient model provided by David Wesolowski Target: ChrisMom_scaled Distance: 2.8335% / 0.02833476 58.8 Anatolia_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N 23.6 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara 14.4 Kura-Araxes_ARM_Kaps 1.4 MAR_Taforalt 1.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N 0.8 IRN_Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA2 Her modern model
    Code:
    Distance: 1.7538% / 0.01753841
    Target: ChrisMom_scaled
    64.0    Greek_Crete
    13.6    Sephardic_Jew
    10.6    Italian_Lombardy
    6.0    Kaitag
    4.0    Azeri_Turkey
    1.5    Lithuanian_VZ
    0.3    Georgian_Imer
    Eurogenes K13
    Code:
    Eurogenes K13 Oracle results:
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    East_Med    29.86
    2    West_Asian    21.24
    3    West_Med    18.38
    4    North_Atlantic    13.79
    5    Baltic    9.91
    6    Red_Sea    4.43
    7    Oceanian    0.88
    8    Northeast_African    0.78
    9    East_Asian    0.45
    10    South_Asian    0.19
    11    Siberian    0.08
    12    Amerindian    0.01
    
    
    Single Population Sharing:
    
    
    #    Population (source)    Distance
    1    Central_Greek    6.44
    2    East_Sicilian    7.61
    3    South_Italian    8.27
    4    Italian_Abruzzo    9.56
    5    Ashkenazi    10.58
    6    Greek_Thessaly    11.85
    7    West_Sicilian    11.95
    8    Sephardic_Jewish    12.7
    9    Italian_Jewish    13.74
    10    Turkish    13.79
    11    Algerian_Jewish    13.86
    12    Cyprian    14.02
    13    Tunisian_Jewish    15.62
    14    Lebanese_Muslim    15.95
    15    Libyan_Jewish    16.35
    16    Tuscan    17.14
    17    Syrian    17.55
    18    Bulgarian    18.58
    19    Azeri    19.22
    20    Assyrian    19.8
    
    
    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:
    
    
    #         Primary Population (source)    Secondary Population (source)    Distance
    1         84.2%    Central_Greek    +    15.8%    Abhkasian    @    2.22
    2         79.5%    Central_Greek    +    20.5%    Kurdish    @    2.25
    3         83.4%    Central_Greek    +    16.6%    Georgian    @    2.38
    4         77.6%    Central_Greek    +    22.4%    Armenian    @    2.4
    5         64.2%    Greek_Thessaly    +    35.8%    Armenian    @    2.47
    6         81.8%    East_Sicilian    +    18.2%    Abhkasian    @    2.47
    7         77.6%    Central_Greek    +    22.4%    Georgian_Jewish    @    2.53
    8         76.3%    Central_Greek    +    23.7%    Azeri    @    2.58
    9         80.8%    East_Sicilian    +    19.2%    Georgian    @    2.6
    10         69.7%    Central_Greek    +    30.3%    Turkish    @    2.62
    11         80.8%    Central_Greek    +    19.2%    Iranian    @    2.8
    12         79.7%    East_Sicilian    +    20.3%    Adygei    @    2.86
    13         83%    Central_Greek    +    17%    Adygei    @    3.03
    14         77.5%    East_Sicilian    +    22.5%    Kumyk    @    3.09
    15         81.2%    East_Sicilian    +    18.8%    North_Ossetian    @    3.1
    16         80.9%    Central_Greek    +    19.1%    Kumyk    @    3.12
    17         64.1%    Greek_Thessaly    +    35.9%    Georgian_Jewish    @    3.17
    18         79.9%    South_Italian    +    20.1%    Lezgin    @    3.18
    19         75.8%    South_Italian    +    24.2%    Kumyk    @    3.18
    20         77.8%    Central_Greek    +    22.2%    Assyrian    @    3.2
    
    
    Eurogenes K13 4-Ancestors Oracle
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    East_Med    29.86
    2    West_Asian    21.24
    3    West_Med    18.38
    4    North_Atlantic    13.79
    5    Baltic    9.91
    6    Red_Sea    4.43
    
    
    Least-squares method.
    
    
    Using 1 population approximation:
    1 Central_Greek @ 7.368545
    2 East_Sicilian @ 8.698989
    3 South_Italian @ 9.395629
    4 Italian_Abruzzo @ 11.010869
    5 Ashkenazi @ 12.235921
    6 Greek_Thessaly @ 13.612007
    7 West_Sicilian @ 13.748034
    8 Sephardic_Jewish @ 14.474957
    9 Turkish @ 15.553708
    10 Algerian_Jewish @ 15.793295
    11 Italian_Jewish @ 15.819071
    12 Cyprian @ 16.121948
    13 Tunisian_Jewish @ 17.699650
    14 Lebanese_Muslim @ 18.093914
    15 Libyan_Jewish @ 18.353344
    16 Syrian @ 19.625025
    17 Tuscan @ 19.774071
    18 Bulgarian @ 21.281013
    19 Azeri @ 21.776447
    20 Assyrian @ 22.716997
    
    
    Using 2 populations approximation:
    1 50% Georgian_Jewish +50% North_Italian @ 4.378345
    
    
    
    
    Using 3 populations approximation:
    1 50% Algerian_Jewish +25% Bulgarian +25% Georgian @ 2.240195
    
    
    
    
    Using 4 populations approximation:
    1 Bulgarian + Georgian + Italian_Jewish + Italian_Jewish @ 1.565589
    2 Algerian_Jewish + Bulgarian + Georgian + Italian_Jewish @ 1.613589
    3 Armenian + Cyprian + Italian_Abruzzo + Romanian @ 1.871550
    4 Armenian + Central_Greek + Cyprian + Serbian @ 1.890242
    5 Algerian_Jewish + Georgian + Italian_Jewish + Romanian @ 1.900835
    6 Abhkasian + Bulgarian + Italian_Jewish + Italian_Jewish @ 1.925646
    7 Armenian + Central_Greek + Central_Greek + Greek_Thessaly @ 1.928672
    8 Abhkasian + Algerian_Jewish + Italian_Jewish + Romanian @ 1.944499
    9 Armenian + Cyprian + Italian_Abruzzo + Serbian @ 1.949692
    10 Armenian + Bulgarian + Cyprian + Tuscan @ 1.951809
    11 Ashkenazi + Georgian + Greek_Thessaly + Italian_Jewish @ 1.976125
    12 Abhkasian + Algerian_Jewish + Bulgarian + Italian_Jewish @ 1.983620
    13 Armenian + Bulgarian + Central_Greek + South_Italian @ 2.018606
    14 Georgian + Italian_Jewish + Italian_Jewish + Romanian @ 2.043825
    15 Abhkasian + Italian_Jewish + Italian_Jewish + Romanian @ 2.049648
    16 Armenian + Bulgarian + Cyprian + Italian_Abruzzo @ 2.081330
    17 Armenian + Bulgarian + East_Sicilian + South_Italian @ 2.095779
    18 Abhkasian + Algerian_Jewish + Italian_Jewish + Serbian @ 2.106808
    19 Armenian + Bulgarian + South_Italian + South_Italian @ 2.127578
    20 Armenian + Cyprian + Serbian + West_Sicilian @ 2.143631
    Eurogenes K15
    Code:
    Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 Oracle results:
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    East_Med    28.39
    2    West_Asian    20.81
    3    West_Med    15.17
    4    Atlantic    14.34
    5    Eastern_Euro    6.76
    6    Baltic    5.95
    7    Red_Sea    3.93
    8    North_Sea    2.98
    9    Oceanian    0.82
    10    Northeast_African    0.67
    11    South_Asian    0.17
    
    
    Single Population Sharing:
    
    
    #    Population (source)    Distance
    1    Central_Greek    8.55
    2    South_Italian    9.07
    3    East_Sicilian    9.64
    4    Italian_Abruzzo    10.29
    5    Ashkenazi    10.58
    6    Greek    11.01
    7    Sephardic_Jewish    11.29
    8    West_Sicilian    11.88
    9    Italian_Jewish    12.53
    10    Algerian_Jewish    13.2
    11    Turkish    13.45
    12    Cyprian    13.47
    13    Greek_Thessaly    14.45
    14    Tunisian_Jewish    14.55
    15    Lebanese_Muslim    16.02
    16    Tuscan    16.51
    17    Syrian    17.84
    18    Azeri    18.13
    19    Bulgarian    18.14
    20    Libyan_Jewish    18.16
    
    
    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:
    
    
    #         Primary Population (source)    Secondary Population (source)    Distance
    1         66.5%    Greek    +    33.5%    Georgian_Jewish    @    5.12
    2         67.2%    Greek    +    32.8%    Armenian    @    5.42
    3         66.1%    Greek    +    33.9%    Assyrian    @    5.57
    4         56.4%    Greek    +    43.6%    Turkish    @    5.69
    5         69.6%    Greek    +    30.4%    Kurdish_Jewish    @    6.04
    6         54%    West_Sicilian    +    46%    Turkish    @    6.09
    7         68.5%    Greek    +    31.5%    Kurdish    @    6.12
    8         69.3%    Greek    +    30.7%    Iranian_Jewish    @    6.19
    9         71.6%    Algerian_Jewish    +    28.4%    Kabardin    @    6.23
    10         67.1%    Central_Greek    +    32.9%    Turkish    @    6.24
    11         71.9%    Algerian_Jewish    +    28.1%    Adygei    @    6.27
    12         73.3%    Algerian_Jewish    +    26.7%    Chechen    @    6.3
    13         66.4%    West_Sicilian    +    33.6%    Kurdish    @    6.32
    14         62%    Greek    +    38%    Lebanese_Muslim    @    6.33
    15         65.4%    West_Sicilian    +    34.6%    Georgian_Jewish    @    6.33
    16         65.8%    West_Sicilian    +    34.2%    Armenian    @    6.35
    17         82.1%    South_Italian    +    17.9%    Adygei    @    6.35
    18         77.8%    Central_Greek    +    22.2%    Kurdish    @    6.39
    19         82.1%    South_Italian    +    17.9%    Kabardin    @    6.44
    20         72%    Algerian_Jewish    +    28%    Balkar    @    6.44
    
    
    Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 4-Ancestors Oracle
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    East_Med    28.39
    2    West_Asian    20.81
    3    West_Med    15.17
    4    Atlantic    14.34
    5    Eastern_Euro    6.76
    6    Baltic    5.95
    7    Red_Sea    3.93
    8    North_Sea    2.98
    
    
    Least-squares method.
    
    
    Using 1 population approximation:
    1 Central_Greek @ 9.961138
    2 South_Italian @ 10.525737
    3 East_Sicilian @ 11.158066
    4 Italian_Abruzzo @ 12.036484
    5 Ashkenazi @ 12.172205
    6 Greek @ 12.802573
    7 Sephardic_Jewish @ 12.900311
    8 West_Sicilian @ 13.845321
    9 Italian_Jewish @ 14.466788
    10 Algerian_Jewish @ 15.134150
    11 Turkish @ 15.157998
    12 Cyprian @ 15.721894
    13 Tunisian_Jewish @ 16.522459
    14 Greek_Thessaly @ 16.881918
    15 Lebanese_Muslim @ 18.389133
    16 Tuscan @ 19.314936
    17 Syrian @ 20.146688
    18 Azeri @ 20.513281
    19 Libyan_Jewish @ 20.635105
    20 Bulgarian @ 21.167122
    
    
    Using 2 populations approximation:
    1 50% Greek +50% Turkish @ 6.552390
    
    
    
    
    Using 3 populations approximation:
    1 50% Greek +25% Kurdish +25% Sephardic_Jewish @ 5.910145
    
    
    
    
    Using 4 populations approximation:
    1 Adygei + Algerian_Jewish + Algerian_Jewish + Greek @ 5.605893
    2 Cyprian + Greek + Greek + Turkish @ 5.609314
    3 Adygei + Algerian_Jewish + Greek + Sephardic_Jewish @ 5.750937
    4 Armenian + Greek + Greek + Sephardic_Jewish @ 5.767347
    5 Georgian_Jewish + Greek + Greek + Sephardic_Jewish @ 5.832431
    6 Adygei + Algerian_Jewish + Greek + Tunisian_Jewish @ 5.842780
    7 Greek + Greek + Kurdish + Sephardic_Jewish @ 5.910145
    8 Algerian_Jewish + Algerian_Jewish + Greek + Kabardin @ 5.916052
    9 Algerian_Jewish + Greek + Kabardin + Tunisian_Jewish @ 5.957953
    10 Azeri + Cyprian + Greek + Greek @ 5.977612
    11 Algerian_Jewish + Greek + Kabardin + Sephardic_Jewish @ 5.991188
    12 Algerian_Jewish + Algerian_Jewish + Balkar + Greek @ 5.994613
    13 Cyprian + Greek + Italian_Abruzzo + Turkish @ 6.008957
    14 Algerian_Jewish + Balkar + Greek + Tunisian_Jewish @ 6.036027
    15 Algerian_Jewish + Balkar + Greek + Sephardic_Jewish @ 6.041082
    16 Georgian_Jewish + Greek + Greek + South_Italian @ 6.046682
    17 Algerian_Jewish + Cyprian + Greek + Kabardin @ 6.067661
    18 Cyprian + Greek + Turkish + West_Sicilian @ 6.087693
    19 Adygei + Algerian_Jewish + Greek + Italian_Jewish @ 6.109005
    20 Adygei + Greek + Sephardic_Jewish + Sephardic_Jewish @ 6.112390
    Eurogenes K36
    Code:
    Amerindian    -    
    Arabian    -    
    Armenian    6.62 Pct
    Basque    -    
    Central_African    -    
    Central_Euro    2.86 Pct
    East_African    -    
    East_Asian    -    
    East_Balkan    3.04 Pct
    East_Central_Asian    -    
    East_Central_Euro    0.68 Pct
    East_Med    17.93 Pct
    Eastern_Euro    0.22 Pct
    Fennoscandian    -    
    French    -    
    Iberian    9.5 Pct
    Indo-Chinese    -    
    Italian    14.53 Pct
    Malayan    -    
    Near_Eastern    13.38 Pct
    North_African    0.1 Pct
    North_Atlantic    1.57 Pct
    North_Caucasian    11.81 Pct
    North_Sea    4.98 Pct
    Northeast_African    -    
    Oceanian    -    
    Omotic    -    
    Pygmy    -    
    Siberian    -    
    South_Asian    -    
    South_Central_Asian    1.89 Pct
    South_Chinese    -    
    Volga-Ural    -    
    West_African    -    
    West_Caucasian    4.38 Pct
    West_Med    6.53 Pct
    Dodecad K12b
    Code:
    Dodecad K12b Oracle results:
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    Caucasus    38.51
    2    Atlantic_Med    21.95
    3    North_European    15.07
    4    Southwest_Asian    10.31
    5    Gedrosia    10.03
    6    Northwest_African    1.86
    7    East_African    1.1
    8    East_Asian    0.69
    9    South_Asian    0.46
    10    Southeast_Asian    0.02
    
    
    Single Population Sharing:
    
    
    #    Population (source)    Distance
    1    Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar)    8.22
    2    S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad)    9.47
    3    Ashkenazi (Dodecad)    9.47
    4    Greek (Dodecad)    9.82
    5    Sicilian (Dodecad)    10.06
    6    Sephardic_Jews (Behar)    12.21
    7    Turkish (Dodecad)    13.1
    8    C_Italian (Dodecad)    14.4
    9    Turks (Behar)    15.56
    10    Morocco_Jews (Behar)    15.74
    11    Cypriots (Behar)    15.94
    12    O_Italian (Dodecad)    15.94
    13    Tuscan (HGDP)    17.83
    14    TSI30 (Metspalu)    19.24
    15    Lebanese (Behar)    19.29
    16    Bulgarian (Dodecad)    20.98
    17    Uzbekistan_Jews (Behar)    21.48
    18    Bulgarians (Yunusbayev)    21.72
    19    Druze (HGDP)    22.17
    20    Syrians (Behar)    22.6
    
    
    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:
    
    
    #         Primary Population (source)    Secondary Population (source)    Distance
    1         75.9%    S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    24.1%    Lezgins (Behar)    @    1.68
    2         74.9%    Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    25.1%    Lezgins (Behar)    @    2.08
    3         71.2%    S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    28.8%    Kumyks (Yunusbayev)    @    2.1
    4         72%    Greek (Dodecad)    +    28%    Kurd (Dodecad)    @    2.2
    5         75.7%    S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    24.3%    Chechens (Yunusbayev)    @    2.2
    6         72.3%    Greek (Dodecad)    +    27.7%    Iranian (Dodecad)    @    2.46
    7         71.6%    Greek (Dodecad)    +    28.4%    Kurds (Yunusbayev)    @    2.48
    8         73.8%    Greek (Dodecad)    +    26.2%    Iranians (Behar)    @    2.49
    9         70.1%    Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    29.9%    Kumyks (Yunusbayev)    @    2.53
    10         60.1%    O_Italian (Dodecad)    +    39.9%    Armenians_15 (Yunusbayev)    @    2.72
    11         59.7%    O_Italian (Dodecad)    +    40.3%    Georgia_Jews (Behar)    @    2.81
    12         74.8%    Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    25.2%    Chechens (Yunusbayev)    @    2.88
    13         55.1%    Turkish (Dodecad)    +    44.9%    O_Italian (Dodecad)    @    2.93
    14         59.4%    O_Italian (Dodecad)    +    40.6%    Armenian (Dodecad)    @    3.04
    15         50.6%    Turks (Behar)    +    49.4%    O_Italian (Dodecad)    @    3.08
    16         52%    C_Italian (Dodecad)    +    48%    Turks (Behar)    @    3.21
    17         60.4%    O_Italian (Dodecad)    +    39.6%    Azerbaijan_Jews (Behar)    @    3.39
    18         69.7%    Greek (Dodecad)    +    30.3%    Uzbekistan_Jews (Behar)    @    3.39
    19         52.5%    Turkish (Dodecad)    +    47.5%    C_Italian (Dodecad)    @    3.58
    20         75.9%    S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad)    +    24.1%    Adygei (HGDP)    @    3.59
    
    
    Dodecad K12b 4-Ancestors Oracle
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    Caucasus    38.51
    2    Atlantic_Med    21.95
    3    North_European    15.07
    4    Southwest_Asian    10.31
    5    Gedrosia    10.03
    6    Northwest_African    1.86
    7    East_African    1.10
    
    
    Least-squares method.
    
    
    Using 1 population approximation:
    1 Ashkenazy_Jews_Behar @ 8.911816
    2 S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 10.212852
    3 Ashkenazi_Dodecad @ 10.249156
    4 Greek_Dodecad @ 10.626523
    5 Sicilian_Dodecad @ 10.866275
    6 Sephardic_Jews_Behar @ 13.191711
    7 Turkish_Dodecad @ 14.143388
    8 C_Italian_Dodecad @ 15.579577
    9 Turks_Behar @ 16.749475
    10 Morocco_Jews_Behar @ 17.057165
    11 O_Italian_Dodecad @ 17.404438
    12 Cypriots_Behar @ 17.488953
    13 Tuscan_HGDP @ 19.302769
    14 Lebanese_Behar @ 20.652575
    15 TSI30_Metspalu @ 20.868277
    16 Bulgarian_Dodecad @ 22.952658
    17 Uzbekistan_Jews_Behar @ 23.246414
    18 Bulgarians_Yunusbayev @ 23.726151
    19 Druze_HGDP @ 24.058651
    20 Syrians_Behar @ 24.083488
    
    
    Using 2 populations approximation:
    1 50% O_Italian_Dodecad +50% Turks_Behar @ 3.065196
    
    
    
    
    Using 3 populations approximation:
    1 50% Armenians_15_Yunusbayev +25% Bulgarians_Yunusbayev +25% Canarias_1000Genomes @ 1.905169
    
    
    
    
    Using 4 populations approximation:
    1 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + French_HGDP + Sicilian_Dodecad + Syrians_Behar @ 1.183163
    2 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + French_HGDP + Jordanians_Behar + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.257407
    3 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + French_Dodecad + Sicilian_Dodecad + Syrians_Behar @ 1.291031
    4 Adygei_HGDP + Jordanians_Behar + TSI30_Metspalu + Tuscan_HGDP @ 1.348310
    5 French_Dodecad + Georgians_Behar + Sicilian_Dodecad + Syrians_Behar @ 1.352812
    6 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + French_HGDP + Jordanians_Behar + Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.359106
    7 French_HGDP + Georgians_Behar + Sicilian_Dodecad + Syrians_Behar @ 1.387283
    8 Adygei_HGDP + Lebanese_Behar + N_Italian_Dodecad + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.389649
    9 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + French_Dodecad + Jordanians_Behar + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.422228
    10 Chechens_Yunusbayev + Jordanians_Behar + Tuscan_HGDP + Tuscan_HGDP @ 1.438866
    11 Chechens_Yunusbayev + Lebanese_Behar + North_Italian_HGDP + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.444003
    12 Druze_HGDP + Kumyks_Yunusbayev + O_Italian_Dodecad + TSI30_Metspalu @ 1.445124
    13 Chechens_Yunusbayev + Lebanese_Behar + North_Italian_HGDP + Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.462009
    14 Adygei_HGDP + Jordanians_Behar + Tuscan_HGDP + Tuscan_HGDP @ 1.469890
    15 Ashkenazy_Jews_Behar + Baleares_1000Genomes + Chechens_Yunusbayev + Druze_HGDP @ 1.472891
    16 Abhkasians_Yunusbayev + French_HGDP + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad + Syrians_Behar @ 1.476182
    17 Adygei_HGDP + Lebanese_Behar + North_Italian_HGDP + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.480511
    18 French_HGDP + Georgians_Behar + Jordanians_Behar + S_Italian_Sicilian_Dodecad @ 1.506606
    19 Adygei_HGDP + C_Italian_Dodecad + Syrians_Behar + TSI30_Metspalu @ 1.507195
    20 C_Italian_Dodecad + French_HGDP + Georgians_Behar + Jordanians_Behar @ 1.511317
    MDLP K23b
    Code:
    MDLP K23b Oracle results:
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    Caucasian    36.43
    2    European_Early_Farmers    23.05
    3    European_Hunters_Gatherers    13.63
    4    Near_East    9.66
    5    South_Central_Asian    7.12
    6    North_African    4.23
    7    Ancestral_Altaic    3.57
    8    Melano_Polynesian    0.94
    9    Tungus-Altaic    0.48
    10    Paleo_Siberian    0.35
    11    Archaic_African    0.29
    12    Austronesian    0.25
    
    
    Single Population Sharing:
    
    
    #    Population (source)    Distance
    1    Ashkenazi_Jew ( )    4.23
    2    Greek_Northwest ( )    4.65
    3    Sicilian_West ( )    4.74
    4    Greek_Peloponnesos ( )    5.19
    5    Sicilian_Siracusa ( )    5.21
    6    Sicilian_Agrigento ( )    5.66
    7    Sicilian_Trapani ( )    6.2
    8    Greek_Thessaly ( )    6.34
    9    French_Jew ( )    6.42
    10    Greek_Thessaloniki ( )    6.62
    11    Sicilian_East ( )    6.71
    12    Kosovar ( )    6.73
    13    Albanian_Tirana ( )    7.02
    14    Ashkenazi ( )    7.12
    15    Maltese ( )    7.15
    16    Sephardic_Jew ( )    7.52
    17    Bulgarian ( )    7.57
    18    Italian_Jew ( )    8
    19    Turk_Jew ( )    8.08
    20    Central_Greek ( )    8.25
    
    
    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:
    
    
    #         Primary Population (source)    Secondary Population (source)    Distance
    1         77.6%    Cretan ( )    +    22.4%    English_Cornwall_GBR ( )    @    1.96
    2         61%    Cretan ( )    +    39%    Italian_North ( )    @    1.97
    3         64%    Cypriot ( )    +    36%    English_Cornwall_GBR ( )    @    1.98
    4         55.4%    Italian_North ( )    +    44.6%    Cypriot ( )    @    2
    5         59.8%    Cypriot ( )    +    40.2%    Frisian ( )    @    2.02
    6         78.4%    Cretan ( )    +    21.6%    British ( )    @    2.04
    7         76.9%    Cretan ( )    +    23.1%    English_Kent_GBR ( )    @    2.04
    8         65%    Cypriot ( )    +    35%    British ( )    @    2.11
    9         78.3%    Cretan ( )    +    21.7%    Welsh ( )    @    2.15
    10         63.1%    Cypriot ( )    +    36.9%    English_Kent_GBR ( )    @    2.15
    11         74.5%    Cretan ( )    +    25.5%    Belgian ( )    @    2.16
    12         74.4%    Cretan ( )    +    25.6%    Frisian ( )    @    2.19
    13         78.2%    Cretan ( )    +    21.8%    CEU ( )    @    2.2
    14         77.8%    Cretan ( )    +    22.2%    French ( )    @    2.21
    15         59.9%    Cypriot ( )    +    40.1%    Belgian ( )    @    2.21
    16         80.2%    Cretan ( )    +    19.8%    Orcadian ( )    @    2.25
    17         76.1%    Cretan ( )    +    23.9%    English ( )    @    2.31
    18         64.9%    Cypriot ( )    +    35.1%    Welsh ( )    @    2.32
    19         89.3%    Sicilian_Siracusa ( )    +    10.7%    Tajik_Yagnobi ( )    @    2.33
    20         61.4%    Cypriot ( )    +    38.6%    Irish ( )    @    2.36
    
    
    MDLP K23b 4-Ancestors Oracle
    
    
    Admix Results (sorted):
    
    
    #    Population    Percent
    1    Caucasian    36.43
    2    European_Early_Farmers    23.05
    3    European_Hunters_Gatherers    13.63
    4    Near_East    9.66
    5    South_Central_Asian    7.12
    6    North_African    4.23
    7    Ancestral_Altaic    3.57
    
    
    Least-squares method.
    
    
    Using 1 population approximation:
    1 Sicilian_West_ @ 4.416378
    2 Ashkenazi_Jew_ @ 4.498880
    3 Sicilian_Siracusa_ @ 5.512610
    4 Sicilian_Trapani_ @ 6.290894
    5 Ashkenazi_ @ 6.335898
    6 Sicilian_East_ @ 6.703057
    7 Romanian_Jew_ @ 6.754878
    8 Sicilian_Agrigento_ @ 6.962825
    9 Central_Greek_ @ 7.522666
    10 Greek_Athens_ @ 7.539959
    11 Cretan_ @ 7.566172
    12 Greek_ @ 7.829031
    13 Maltese_ @ 8.058283
    14 Greek_Peloponnesos_ @ 8.098638
    15 Italian_Abruzzo_ @ 8.212624
    16 Italian_South_ @ 8.286612
    17 Greek_Phokaia_ @ 8.345196
    18 Sicilian_Center_ @ 8.888746
    19 Greek_Northwest_ @ 8.929196
    20 French_Jew_ @ 9.296935
    
    
    Using 2 populations approximation:
    1 50% Cypriot_ +50% Italian_North_ @ 2.549259
    
    
    
    
    Using 3 populations approximation:
    1 50% Greek_Islands_ +25% Orcadian_ +25% Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.555858
    
    
    
    
    Using 4 populations approximation:
    1 Greek_Islands_ + Greek_Islands_ + Orcadian_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.555858
    2 British_ + Greek_Islands_ + Greek_Islands_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.665377
    3 Greek_Islands_ + Greek_Islands_ + Scottish_Argyll_Bute_GBR_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.745009
    4 British_ + Greek_Islands_ + Greek_Smyrna_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.747217
    5 English_Cornwall_GBR_ + Greek_Islands_ + Romanian_Jew_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.757729
    6 Iraqi_Chaldean_ + Italian_North_ + Italian_Piedmont_ + Romanian_Jew_ @ 1.769295
    7 Assyrian_Iraqi_ + Italian_North_ + Italian_Piedmont_ + Romanian_Jew_ @ 1.769866
    8 German-Volga_ + Greek_Islands_ + Italian_Abruzzo_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.776920
    9 Christian_Arabs_Israel_ + English_Cornwall_GBR_ + Italian_Piedmont_ + Turk_Kayseri_ @ 1.780310
    10 Assyrian_Iraqi_ + Italian_North_ + Italian_Tuscan_ + Romanian_Jew_ @ 1.784263
    11 French_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Jew_Tat_ + Sicilian_Trapani_ @ 1.800098
    12 Assyrian_Arzni_ + French_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Sicilian_Trapani_ @ 1.803618
    13 English_Cornwall_GBR_ + Greek_Smyrna_ + Italian_South_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.805926
    14 English_Cornwall_GBR_ + Greek_Islands_ + Italian_South_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.811399
    15 Georgian_Jew_ + Greek_Athens_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Spanish_Extremadura_IBS_ @ 1.812500
    16 Iraqi_Chaldean_ + Italian_North_ + Italian_Tuscan_ + Romanian_Jew_ @ 1.813295
    17 French_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Italian_Jew_ + Turk_Kayseri_ @ 1.815222
    18 English_Cornwall_GBR_ + Greek_Smyrna_ + Romanian_Jew_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.818436
    19 English_Cornwall_GBR_ + Greek_Athens_ + Greek_Islands_ + Syrian_Jew_ @ 1.823348
    20 Greek_Macedonia_ + Greek_Phokaia_ + Spanish_Valencia_IBS_ + Uzbekistani_Jew_ @ 1.823427

  16. #16
    Elite member
    Join Date
    25-10-11
    Location
    Brittany
    Age
    71
    Posts
    4,742

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b - L21/S145*
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H3c

    Ethnic group
    more celtic
    Country: France



    No contradiction here. We can share some phenotypical traits without too much autosomes similarities (and the contrary: see some brothers and sisters. And even if these traits are inherited from a remote common ancestry, more recent shifts can make the autosomes sketch distinct even if not truly opposed.

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