Eupedia Forums
Site NavigationEupedia Top > Eupedia Forum & Japan Forum
Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: New paper: Ancient Egypt 18th Dynasty R1b, mtDNA K

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    14-06-17
    Posts
    146


    Country: United Kingdom



    4 members found this post helpful.

    New paper: Ancient Egypt 18th Dynasty R1b, mtDNA K

    'Insights from ancient DNA analysis of Egyptian human mummies: clues to disease and kinship' (Gad et al. 2020)

    “An investigative study was carried out on the familial relationships of a number of late 18th dynasty mummies (ca. 1550–1295 B.C.), including that of Tutankhamen. The study was based on the analysis of the autosomal and Y-chromosome STR markers in addition to mitochondrial hypervariable region 1 sequences. A 4- generation pedigree of Tutankhamun’s immediate lineage and the identity of his ancestors were established. The Royal male lineage was the Y-chromosome haplogroup R1b that was passed from the grandparent [Amenhotep III] to the father [KV55, Akhenaten] to the grandchild [Tutankhamen]. The maternal lineage, the mitochondrial haplogroup K, extended from the great-grandmother [Thuya] to the grandmother [KV35 Elder lady, Queen Tiye] to the yet historically-unidentified mother [KV35 Younger lady] to Tutankhamen.”

    https://academic.oup.com/hmg/advance...rectedFrom=PDF

    (Published online 15th Oct 2020)

  2. #2
    Regular Member kingjohn's Avatar
    Join Date
    05-09-16
    Posts
    715

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    likely(E-Y125227)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    from plovdiv

    Country: Uruguay



    So Tutankhamen was truly r1b
    Amazing 😲🤔😎

    P.s
    There is no access to the pdf in this link though🤔
    known ancestery:
    Sefhardi/ aschenazi/ mizrahi/ bulgarian
    Eurogenes k13 updated closest:
    4.70345618 Greek_Andros_Island

    eurogenes k13 ancient closeset:
    4.86806943 R136_Lazio_Rome_italy_Late_Antiquity
    http://www.ianlogan.co.uk/sequences_by_group/h3aa-av_genbank_sequences.htm

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    14-06-17
    Posts
    146


    Country: United Kingdom



    1 members found this post helpful.
    I sent you a message.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Anfänger's Avatar
    Join Date
    07-04-18
    Posts
    167

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b-Z2103
    MtDNA haplogroup
    U7a4

    Ethnic group
    Iranian
    Country: Germany



    What sublcade of R1b does he have ?

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    14-06-17
    Posts
    146


    Country: United Kingdom



    It doesn't say. It refers to another study that hasn't been published yet:

    'Maternal and paternal lineages in King Tutankhamun’s family.' (Gad et al., 2020)

    In Kamrin et al. (eds.) 'Guardian of Ancient Egypt: Essays in Honor of Zahi Hawass', Czech Institute of Egyptology, Faculty of Arts, Charles University, Prague (in press).


    No doubt that paper will have all the info.

  6. #6
    Advisor Angela's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-01-11
    Posts
    18,415


    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: USA - New York



    2 members found this post helpful.
    Anyone for V88? :)


    Non si fa il proprio dovere perchè qualcuno ci dica grazie, lo si fa per principio, per se stessi, per la propria dignità. Oriana Fallaci

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    09-04-15
    Posts
    66


    Country: Portugal



    Taking into account what we know so far about R1b, the V-88 Subclade seems more likely in this context, though I would not be totally surprised if it is another branch that is now extinct.
    Supposedly the 18th dynasty is a native Egyptian dynasty, the founder of the dynasty Ahmose is the son of Seqenenre Tao and the brother of Khamose the two last kings of the 17th dynasty who are descended from the Intef Kings who probably form a genetic continuity with older egyptian dynastys though not necessarily by male line but by cognatic descendancy.
    Still let us postulate the hypothesys that a long extinct r1b m-269 lineage could have entered the ancient egyptian gene pool and have the good fortune of becoming of royal status.
    All things considered again I say that V-88 is much more probable but we should keep our eyes opened for other possibilities.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    14-06-17
    Posts
    146


    Country: United Kingdom



    R1b-M269 has been found in next door Israel around the same time. What if R1b-M269 is a Hyksos ruler lineage and R1b-V88 is Egyptian, two distantly related R1b lineages fighting over Egypt, epic!

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    25-02-10
    Posts
    157

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b1b2a1a
    MtDNA haplogroup
    J1c1

    Ethnic group
    Appalachian American
    Country: USA - West Virginia



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Anyone for V88? :)

    I believe he will be proven to be R1b-M269, Atlantic Modal Haplotype. This was extensively discussed at Family Tree DNA's forum and DNA Rootsweb Archiver, with screenshots and links to videos posted as originally aired. FTDNA revamped their message board, losing all their old message since then. Unfortunately, the relevant threads at DNA Rootsweb Archiver are not available any more either. For a while, there was also a Youtube video available that showed the brief shots of the Y-DNA STR reports as they were shown in the original airing. A lab technician was sitting in front of the computer monitor and the camera shot went in and out of focus but the sample labels and several STR markers identifiers and reported values were clearly visible for a moment, enough to give me a great deal of confidence of the claim. The episode was later reaired with stock footage, not shown in the original. In one article I read at that time, Zahi Hawass described Tut's haplotype as Greek. I don't recall the source, but with everything having gone down the memory hole, I'll just wait on the paper. I don't know what the upcoming paper will reveal. but if I was a betting person, I'd place a bet on R-M269.

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    11-11-19
    Posts
    280

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    E-V13

    Country: Albania



    1 members found this post helpful.
    I am becoming highly suspicious that there is a anti E-M78 agenda regarding ancient Egyptian samples.

    It's no wonder they are cherrypicking results and publishing with very suspicious low coverage samples.

  11. #11
    Regular Member kingjohn's Avatar
    Join Date
    05-09-16
    Posts
    715

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    likely(E-Y125227)
    MtDNA haplogroup
    from plovdiv

    Country: Uruguay



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Progon View Post
    I am becoming highly suspicious that there is a anti E-M78 agenda regarding ancient Egyptian samples.

    It's no wonder they are cherrypicking results and publishing with very suspicious low coverage samples.

    i don't see it here
    where do you feal it in anthrogenica ?
    speaking of e-m78
    there is a huge chance RamsessIII is realy e-m78-v22
    instead of the e1b1a that was asign to him


    p.s
    it is beyond me why egyptian labs
    don't anlayse those ancient samples again
    with all the progress been made in population genetics

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    04-09-16
    Posts
    527


    Country: Portugal



    Just to be out there again and again and again.
    Right or wrong (we will see) is in my shulaveri2bellbeaker on the African route chapter.
    Tut is m269 without downstream clades because (maybe L23) because Tut is the remaining genetic signature of the Merimde beni salama culture 4300bc that were R1b m269...
    No point on argue at this stage. We will See.

  13. #13
    Baron
    Join Date
    19-05-12
    Posts
    306


    Country: Canada



    Quote Originally Posted by Philjames100 View Post
    'Insights from ancient DNA analysis of Egyptian human mummies: clues to disease and kinship' (Gad et al. 2020)
    “An investigative study was carried out on the familial relationships of a number of late 18th dynasty mummies (ca. 1550–1295 B.C.), including that of Tutankhamen. The study was based on the analysis of the autosomal and Y-chromosome STR markers in addition to mitochondrial hypervariable region 1 sequences. A 4- generation pedigree of Tutankhamun’s immediate lineage and the identity of his ancestors were established. The Royal male lineage was the Y-chromosome haplogroup R1b that was passed from the grandparent [Amenhotep III] to the father [KV55, Akhenaten] to the grandchild [Tutankhamen]. The maternal lineage, the mitochondrial haplogroup K, extended from the great-grandmother [Thuya] to the grandmother [KV35 Elder lady, Queen Tiye] to the yet historically-unidentified mother [KV35 Younger lady] to Tutankhamen.”
    https://academic.oup.com/hmg/advance...rectedFrom=PDF
    (Published online 15th Oct 2020)
    The haplotype looked like it could have been related to the one found in Assyrians and the Alawites, R1b-L584.

  14. #14
    Baron
    Join Date
    19-05-12
    Posts
    306


    Country: Canada



    Perhaps the 18th dynasty was founded by the "Hyksos", who up until recently were thought to be invaders, but based on a recent paper are suggested to be a military elite of a non-Egyptian Near Eastern group. R1b-L584 could fit the bill here. This still reads as invaders to me, just that they were from the vicinity, not like NW Europe or East Asia for example.

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    09-04-15
    Posts
    66


    Country: Portugal



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Although I respect your opinion I might say that according to what we know about the period in question that is highly unlikely.
    First, the 18th dynasty was not really a new dynasty but a continuation of the 17th (Ahmose the first ruler of the 18th was a full brother of Khamose the last ruler of the 17th as well as a son of Seqenenre Tao and a grandson of Senakhtenre).
    Secondly, the 17th dynasty reigned from Thebes while the Hyksos were based in Memphis, and both considered themselves foreign to each other.
    Lastly, Khamose himself proclaimed his desire to expel the invaders from Egypt in a quite famous stella that survives to this day he says this : "what power can I claim to have when I am stuck between an Asiatic and a Nubian, each of them has a piece of Egypt too, and shares the land with me, my aim is to liberte Egypt and crush the Asiatics".
    Taking all this into account it would baffle me if the 17th dynasty of Egypt turned out to be asiatic or indeed "hyksian" in origin though it would not be impossible since what we are considering to be asiatic is just the male-line and a lot could occur in order for us to have a native Egyptian dynasty (who considered themselves so) with an asiatic male lineage (infidelity, rape of a noble woman during the Hyksos invasion, assimilation of an asiatic line into the egyptian gene pool etc.).

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •