hello from a Han Chinese R1b

[abcd]

my Y-DNA haplogroup is R1b y20753 , a subclade of y13200(old m73). Can someone give me some information about this haplogroup，thanks！

[Maciamo]

Your branch descend from R1b-M73 on this chart.



R1b-M73 expanded eastward from the Volga-Ural region in the Late Copper and Early Bronze Age. It is associated with the Repin culture (3700-3300 BCE) and subsequent Afanasievo culture (3300 to 2500 BCE), which brought horses and metallurgy to the Altai region. Your branch is still present in the Altai region in southern Siberia today, as well as in Mongolia and northern China.

[abcd]

ok，thank you！

[Eochaidh]

YSEQ has Y20747 and Y20750 tests.

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a
SNP Names M73
Reference SNP cluster ID
Build 37 address 21888874
Build 38 address 19726988
Mutation Info ins->del
Number of children: 2

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a1
SNP Names M478;
Reference SNP cluster ID rs868722731
Build 37 address 23444054
Build 38 address 21282168
Mutation Info T->C
Number of children: 2

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a1a
SNP Names L1432
Reference SNP cluster ID
Build 37 address 15642157
Build 38 address 13530277
Mutation Info C->G
Number of children: 0
==

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a1b
SNP Names Y20750;
Reference SNP cluster ID
Build 37 address 7084905
Build 38 address 7216864
Mutation Info G->C
Number of children: 1

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a1b1
SNP Names Y20747;
Reference SNP cluster ID
Build 37 address 2722972
Build 38 address 2854931
Mutation Info G->A
Number of children: 1

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a1b1a
SNP Names Y22195
Reference SNP cluster ID
Build 37 address 14374204
Build 38 address 12253500
Mutation Info A->T
Number of children: 0

Haplogroup Name: R1b1a1a2
SNP Names BY15590;
Reference SNP cluster ID rs892612443
Build 37 address 6996525
Build 38 address 7128484
Mutation Info A->G
Number of children: 0

[abcd]

Thanks! So mine is R1b1a1a1b. How about yours, descended from m269?

[abcd]

Totally, there are around 1.5% Chinese(not necessarily Han Chinese) have haplogroup R.
R1a about 1% R1b less than 0.5%, because there are some R2 which are the rarest among the haplogroup R in China, and to be more specific, the percentage of R1b-m269 is about 0.3%.
So that means, R1b-m73 is only around 0.1%, maybe even less than that.

[Eochaidh]

Thanks! So mine is R1b1a1a1b. How about yours, descended from m269?

M269 ==> R1b1a1b
A725 ==> R1b1a1b1a1a2c1a1a1a1a1b1

[Papajoe]

Totally, there are around 1.5% Chinese(not necessarily Han Chinese) have haplogroup R.
R1a about 1% R1b less than 0.5%, because there are some R2 which are the rarest among the haplogroup R in China, and to be more specific, the percentage of R1b-m269 is about 0.3%.
So that means, R1b-m73 is only around 0.1%, maybe even less than that.

I'm y-haplogroup R (R-M207). My Dad's folks came from NE Poland.

[abcd]

Ok，interesting，but is it just R-m207?What's your subclade? I guess it's maybe R1a since your dad came from Poland which has the highest percentage of R1a in the world.

[Papajoe]

Ok，interesting，but is it just R-m207?What's your subclade? I guess it's maybe R1a since your dad came from Poland which has the highest percentage of R1a in the world.

Sorry, I should have added that. To make things a little more interesting, I'm R-Z92. There are many R1a-Z92 folks, not so many R-Z92, and no R1b-Z92 or R1-Z92.

Since I was looking around and saw a lot of R1a-Z92 but not much R-Z92 I asked the experts at 23&me what marker they were using for my designation as R and they verified they looked at R-M207.

Per the folks at 23&Me, the Z92 clade is identical in both R and R1a, but my R is indeed R-M207, and R1a is R-M420.

Looking at the heat map 23&me provides for recent relatives, the area around Warsaw, and to the north east still have heavy R-Z92. My Grandparents were from the village of Charubin. Web searches show R-Z92 samples in Estonia and Russia. Other web data suggests R-Z92 may have originated in Tajikistan.

It'll be interesting to figure out why the only two haplogroups where Z92 is found is R and a grandchild branch R1a.

I also have 0.2% Ancient Persian/Caucasian/Mesopotamian, but that could have come from either or both parents.


My mtDNA is equally rare, but this is the wrong group for that :)

[abcd]

Yeah this is indeed interesting, cause your haplogroup is just R, that means you are a living Mal'ta boy lol. Although you said it is the wrong group but still what's your mt haplogroup?

[Papajoe]

Yeah this is indeed interesting, cause your haplogroup is just R, that means you are a living Mal'ta boy lol. Although you said it is the wrong group but still what's your mt haplogroup?

K1b1b - per 23&me Ancient Irish/Welsh/Scot/Brit - maybe pre-Celtic, maybe indigenous. They may have ended up in the British Isles through the Alps (Otzi, the frozen caveman), or may have moved up the European coast in ships. Possibly Scythian.

In any case, the mtDNA K1b1b line has survived the Celts(?), the Normans, the Angles, the Saxons, the Romans, the Vikings, probably did NOT survive Oliver Cromwell, but came to America.

Then, since my Mom's family moved to America around 1640, K1b1b survived almost 400 years in south-central Virginia, and north-central North Carolina. That's some serious inbreeding, on both sides of the family A serious case of Hide the women! Hide the beer!

Interestingly enough, my Mom's family were all short, stocky, black hair, olive skin. I believe that the true meaning of Black Irish may be the ancient indigenous lines of DNA which had more Mediterranean-like phenotypical features.

I posted in the K mtdna group about it, so that's where I'll pursue information on that branch.

[abcd]

Lucky for you, cause mine is R2-a, it's also rare and I can't even find the section of it.
"Subclade R2 was observed in the remains of a Neolithic human from western Iran in Tepe Abdul Hosein."according to Wikipedia

[Papajoe]

That's a good area to be from, I think :)

I am lucky to have some resources for my stuff.

[Silesian]

my Y-DNA haplogroup is R1b y20753 , a subclade of y13200(old m73). Can someone give me some information about this haplogroup，thanks！

There was an interesting sample put out a little while back with high status R1b burial and speculation R1a slave sacrificed.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5023095/

[abcd]

I read it, it is interesting, but I think Genghis Khan more likely belongs to haplogroup C2/C3 or even O2, since last year scholars in Iran tested his great grandson Ghazan Khan belongs to O-M175, in addition, it says Hazaras have high percentage of R1b yet I remember their percentage of haplogroup C is much higher.

[Aaron1981]

I read it, it is interesting, but I think Genghis Khan more likely belongs to haplogroup C2/C3 or even O2, since last year scholars in Iran tested his great grandson Ghazan Khan belongs to O-M175, in addition, it says Hazaras have high percentage of R1b yet I remember their percentage of haplogroup C is much higher.

Regardless, the agreement is that the Tavan Tolgoi burial is linked as high status burial possibly linked with the Genghis Khan family due to the presence of the falcon rings. This is actually a critical piece of evidence, directly from the grave which is more valuable than shaky geneaological trees filled with lies and NPEs.

That said, it is possible that the rings were inherited by the elite female's family via her father. Otherwise, it was likely gifted from the husband who was the R1b fellow. The latter would suggest he was a descendant of Genghis Khan. I am not familiar enough with Mongol traditions to know which is more likely to be true. In the worst case scenario, it suggests that there was a tribe with a R1b ruler or ruling elite who was a valuable ally of the Borjigin clan.

[Ozzie]

Rarity is relative, you are talking about the male population of China, many millions of men, so even a tiny percentage in China can be a large number of men who are R1b.

[abcd]

Ok, thanks for your information, there's a lot of them I didn't know before.

[abcd]

Rarity is relative, you are talking about the male population of China, many millions of men, so even a tiny percentage in China can be a large number of men who are R1b.

That's so true, R1b's population in China may very likely larger than a small country's total population.