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Thread: J-L70 - a much needed update

  1. #76
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J-L70
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV1b2

    Country: South Africa



    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    There's a possibility the migration from the east was continuing into that time. EBA is speculated as the earliest possible time.
    J-L70's TMRCA is 1800 BCE, which is in the Middle Bronze Age. The main diversification of branches was between 1400 BCE and 1100 BCE. I don't understand the connection you're making.

  2. #77
    Regular Member Ralphie Boy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azzurro View Post
    Hope he changes his mind, I don't know if you saw the L70 thread on AG, several members are posting there, including me and Supreme. Does your relative have any other J-L70 matches? Perhaps one these cousins could have tested further on ftdna and the information is already available!
    Thank you, that’s a good idea, to check other blogs in hopes someone posted results. FTDNA has an L24 project with public results that I checked.

  3. #78
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphie Boy View Post
    Thank you, that’s a good idea, to check other blogs in hopes someone posted results. FTDNA has an L24 project with public results that I checked.
    Azzurro says if you need to contact him, you can do so on Anthrogenica.

  4. #79
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPREEEEEME View Post
    J-L70's TMRCA is 1800 BCE, which is in the Middle Bronze Age. The main diversification of branches was between 1400 BCE and 1100 BCE. I don't understand the connection you're making.
    What is the connection you are making, that Syrian Auxiliary are responsible for the majority of J-L70 in all of Europe? Even places outside of the Roman Empire?

  5. #80
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J-L70
    MtDNA haplogroup
    HV1b2

    Country: South Africa



    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    What is the connection you are making, that Syrian Auxiliary are responsible for the majority of J-L70 in all of Europe? Even places outside of the Roman Empire?
    Within the Empire. Many of the regions where we notice greater concentrations, I've noticed these units wound up.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but to my understanding, each Auxiliary unit had several thousand men, giving ample opportunity for many L70 men amongst them. This is the only explanation I've found that can explain J-L70's phylogeny (ignoring the evidence of J-L70's origin within the Levant).

    J-L70 was likely already present throughout the Levant, Anatolia, and Mesopotamia before Rome.

  6. #81
    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPREEEEEME View Post
    Within the Empire. Many of the regions where we notice greater concentrations, I've noticed these units wound up.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but to my understanding, each Auxiliary unit had several thousand men, giving ample opportunity for many L70 men amongst them. This is the only explanation I've found that can explain J-L70's phylogeny (ignoring the evidence of J-L70's origin within the Levant).
    J-L70 was likely already present throughout the Levant, Anatolia, and Mesopotamia before Rome.
    It is not impossible, but I think it is unlikely that it should account for the entirety of Europe. I only contend that it is within the realm of possibility that it could have spread from a source outside the levant, given that J1 groups likely come from the Caucasus. Moreover, it was in a time when there was significant CHG/IN ancestry coming to the Levant, as well as Anatolia, and Greece. Perhaps it was just more successful in the Levant.

  7. #82
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    MtDNA haplogroup
    J1c14

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    Afro,Euro,Amerind
    Country: United States



    My maternal grandmother’s father Harold George Walker’s ancestry was Colonial European American Colonial. A few years back, I found out that my maternal grandmother’s father Harold George Walker’s Y DNA haplogroup is J2a4h2 which is known as J-L25. A descendant of his 2nd Great Grandfather Peyton Walker, son of William Walker took the Y DNA test which resulted in finding out that he was J-L25. The haplogroup assignment has been refined, and it is now J-PH3125. There are six haplogroups in the branch before J-PH3125. In exact order, they are J-CTS1192>J-L70>J-Z435>J-CTS3601>J-PF5456>J-FGC54172.



    Both 5th Great Grandpa Peyton Walker and 6th Grandpa William Walker were born in Virginia.



    I am already around 1/8 Ashkenazi Jewish from my maternal grandmother’s mother Ruth Sarah Rosenthal who was a first generation American born to a father from Romania and a mother from Latvia.
    My maternal grandfather's father was the son of Cape Verdean immigrants. My maternal grandfather's maternal grandfather was Puerto Rican. My maternal grandfather's maternal grandmother was the Hawaiian born daughter of Madeiran immigrants, and her paternal grandfather was from the Azores. Therefore, I suspect some Sephardic Jewish on my maternal grandfather's side.

    My African American father was born and raised in New Orleans, and his paternal grandmother had some Acadian ancestry. One of her Acadian ancestors was Abraham Dugas who was suspected by some to be Sephardic Jewish, and his Y DNA haplogroup J-Y25793. His closest match is a Druze man in Lebanon.

  8. #83
    Regular Member Ralphie Boy's Avatar
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    There are many new L70 samples from Turkey in YFull, with old MRCA’s.

    https://yfull.com/tree/J-L70/

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphie Boy View Post
    There are many new L70 samples from Turkey in YFull, with old MRCA’s.
    Yes, they're all from a WGS study. Nothing too unexpected. The samples themselves appear to be a mixed bag (i.e. Balkan Turks, Anatolian Turks, Armenians, and the very first J-L70 Pontian). Regarding their MRCA's, these are of course subject to change over time - I can easily see them forming clades in the future that will not have such an old TMRCA. Two of these samples are reasonably close to Jewish branches, particularly in J-Y24651.

    One has already formed a clade with a Sephardic Jewish line, with the Turk most likely being a Jewish exit.

    Hopefully we'll get a similar study from the Levant at some point.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPREEEEEME View Post
    Yes, they're all from a WGS study. Nothing too unexpected. The samples themselves appear to be a mixed bag (i.e. Balkan Turks, Anatolian Turks, Armenians, and the very first J-L70 Pontian). Regarding their MRCA's, these are of course subject to change over time - I can easily see them forming clades in the future that will not have such an old TMRCA. Two of these samples are reasonably close to Jewish branches, particularly in J-Y24651.

    One has already formed a clade with a Sephardic Jewish line, with the Turk most likely being a Jewish exit.

    Hopefully we'll get a similar study from the Levant at some point.
    Good points


    according to Jewish Virtual Library


    Turkey has a Jewish history dating back possibly to the 4th century B.C.E.


    The history of the Jews in Anatolia, however, started many centuries before the migration of Sephardic Jews. Remnants of Jewish settlement from the 4th century B.C.E. have been uncovered in the Aegean region, where Jews lived and traded in the ancient cities of Ephesus, Sardis, Pergamon, and Smyrna (renamed Izmir by the Turks). The historian Josephus Flavius relates that Aristotle "met Jewish people with whom he had an exchange of views during his trip across Asia Minor."


    Second and third century Greek inscriptions tell of a flourishing Jewish community in Smyrna. Ancient synagogue ruins have also been found in Sardis, near Izmir, dating from 220 B.C.E. and traces of other Jewish settlements have been discovered near Bursa, in the southeast and along the Aegean, Mediterranean and Black Sea coasts. A bronze column found in Ankara confirms the rights the Emperor Augustus accorded the Jews of Asia Minor.

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