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Thread: Y-chromosome variability and genetic history of Commons from Northern Italy

  1. #26
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2 - SK1480
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H12a

    Ethnic group
    Italian
    Country: United States



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    you would know that T was noted as K2 prior to 2008 ...........as it belongs to the K-M9 group with R1a, R1b, N, O, L ............all same family ...........some scholars still use K for T

    a Russian scholar 5 years ago was arguing that it belongs under R1b or R1a as there are only a few snp which seperates T from these

    another wanted to remove it, join it with LT and give LT a new mark .......I think he wanted it as a V

    but, both have also stated that it is 42000 years old .............and the T branch split into 4 group 13500 years ago .............the 4 groups is what we have currently ..............they also said it was initially a pure hunter group
    yes, … they should all pick a Letter and stick with it, …

    … y R is about 27,000 years old, … y T is way more ancient: 42,000 years old, so y T can’t be an R offshoot.

    … these smarty pants scientists should talk to each other more often and formulate a Universal Naming and Dating standard,
    and even if they did that already, we still have some who fly solo and make it confusing for everyone :)

    … and our terminal clade doesn’t show up on yfull

  2. #27
    Banned
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    R1b-Df27
    MtDNA haplogroup
    T2b3e

    Country: Spain



    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Duarte View Post
    I confess that I liked it when you said: I only know that I know nothing. I am in the same situation in relation to my Haplogroup (baseline R1b-L51+ and terminal R1b-DF27+). I am very interested in the controversies regarding my haplogroup too. If there is a chance that my haplogroup will not have a direct relationship with the great Yamna migration to the west, the truth is that I will be very satisfied with that, lol.
    R1b-Df27 did not participate in any migration from the steppes because it originates from the French-Cantabrian region.

  3. #28
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    H95a

    Ethnic group
    North Italian
    Country: Australia



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    yes, … they should all pick a Letter and stick with it, …

    … y R is about 27,000 years old, … y T is way more ancient: 42,000 years old, so y T can’t be an R offshoot.

    … these smarty pants scientists should talk to each other more often and formulate a Universal Naming and Dating standard,
    and even if they did that already, we still have some who fly solo and make it confusing for everyone :)

    … and our terminal clade doesn’t show up on yfull

    they know about SK1480 , but they do not use it ................see my positive below

    Fathers mtdna ... T2b17
    Grandfather mtdna ... T1a1e
    Sons mtdna ... K1a4p
    Mum paternal line ... R1b-S8172
    Grandmum paternal side ... I1-CTS6397
    Wife paternal line ... R1a-Z282

  4. #29
    Regular Member kingjohn's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    rare E-FGC7391
    MtDNA haplogroup
    h3ap

    Country: Uruguay



    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    Thanks Pax and Duarte :)

    @Duarte … the catastrophe inflicted to y T that I mentioned was the R1b (and others) / Yamnaya migration / invasion, … I was being polite to R1b members, … though I’m glad that your Tribe maybe wasn’t part of it :)

    … just theories

    likely
    probably also some other farmers suffered :
    G2 , h2 and some branches of C and j2 ( maybe even small number of some e-L618)
    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-FGC7391/

    https://yfull.com/mtree/H3ap/

  5. #30
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    they know about SK1480 , but they do not use it ................see my positive below

    @Torzio … does your BAM contain autosomal results too?

    … my y + and - … same Terminal SNP, same Tribe :)



  6. #31
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    MtDNA haplogroup
    H95a

    Ethnic group
    North Italian
    Country: Australia



    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    @Torzio … does your BAM contain autosomal results too?

    … my y + and - … same Terminal SNP, same Tribe :)



    i have the same as you............as well as

    BY32027 • Y70078

    level T-BY143483
    private


    and


    YP1866 which is 5 stars (max ) ......................this will either be = to Sk1480 or below it once yfull release it ......................i asked them about this 2 months ago and they say found with another on the austrian-italian border area

  7. #32
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by torzio View Post
    someone changed the page 12 days ago .................but chart still have T1a
    There have been hackers on the net changing all T ydna to be somali ....been going on for nearly 2 years


    By his side, I0795 showed higher autosomal admixture frequencies of surrounding populations like Hunter Gatherer Europeans I2a (West Hunter Gatherers) and Aegean-Anatolian Neolithics G2a and H2. However, I0795 have the highest frequency of shared DNA with Upper Paleolithic Neanderthals from Central Europe found in any Early Neolithic population. Further comparisons show that I0795 has similar frequencies like Oase-1 when compared with Vindija Neanderthals. When I0795 and I0797 are compared to Oase-1, they both share a very high percentage of DNA 34% and 18% respectively and I0795 12% with Ostuni1. This could mean that this T1a1 tribe from Karsdorf was closest to Upper Paleolithic Hunter-Gatherers than to Mesolithic haplogroups.

    charts still say T1a


    the third karsdorf T was found by Brandt and Haak



    KAR537

    T1a1- L162

    Brown hair
    Blue eyes
    Pale skin
    The investigated individual 537 is a 184 male with an age at death of around 25-30 years (figure supplementary S1), dated to 5056–185 4959 cal BC (KIA 40357 – 6116 ± 32 BP) (Brandt et al., 2014, Nicklisch, 2017)


    these karsdorf T1a samples along with the 2 x t1a bulgarians from Malek who are the same period could have links with the italians
    … liars on Wikipedia!

    out of curiosity, … I downloaded the Karsdorf I0795 bam, … and his Y Haplogroup is T and not R1b !!!

    General I0795 Y Haplogroup results:





    As of now the link below is still Compromised:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karsdorf_remains

  8. #33
    Regular Member Duarte's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    … liars on Wikipedia!

    out of curiosity, … I downloaded the Karsdorf I0795 bam, … and his Y Haplogroup is T and not R1b !!!

    General I0795 Y Haplogroup results:





    As of now the link below is still Compromised:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karsdorf_remains
    Agree.
    There is an inconsistency in the page, due to transcription error, or worse than that, in bad faith of the Wiki reviewer. The page itself gives reference to the article by Haak et al., 2015 which says that “This individual belonged to the haplogroup T1a (PF5604: 7890461C → T, M70: 21893881A → C). This is the first instance of this haplogroup in an ancient individual that we know and reinforces the case of the Neolithic origin of that lineage in modern Europeans, rather than a more recent introduction from the Near East, where it is more abundant today."

    These two informations, next, in the same page Wiki demonstrate the inconsistencies of the page:




  9. #34
    Regular Member torzio's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
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    H95a

    Ethnic group
    North Italian
    Country: Australia



    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Duarte View Post
    Agree.
    There is an inconsistency in the page, due to transcription error, or worse than that, in bad faith of the Wiki reviewer. The page itself gives reference to the article by Haak et al., 2015 which says that “This individual belonged to the haplogroup T1a (PF5604: 7890461C → T, M70: 21893881A → C). This is the first instance of this haplogroup in an ancient individual that we know and reinforces the case of the Neolithic origin of that lineage in modern Europeans, rather than a more recent introduction from the Near East, where it is more abundant today."

    These two informations, next, in the same page Wiki demonstrate the inconsistencies of the page:




    i spoke to the owner of the page yesterday......he will fix it soon......he states hackers have been trying to destroy/change all data of ancient T ydna

  10. #35
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    Y-DNA haplogroup
    T1a2 - SK1480
    MtDNA haplogroup
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    Italian
    Country: United States



    1 members found this post helpful.
    @Duarte there are 3 y T Neolithic Karsdorf samples I0795 Kar6, I0797 Kar16a, and Kars537 :)

    @Torzio … thanks for the info :)

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