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Thread: Origin of Bulgarians

  1. #1
    Regular Member Kristiyan's Avatar
    Join Date
    12-06-21
    Location
    Sofia
    Posts
    13

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I1a3a1a1/I-Y2245.2
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H65

    Ethnic group
    Bulgarians
    Country: Bulgaria



    2 members found this post helpful.

    Post Origin of Bulgarians

    What is the origin of ancient Bulgarians? Are they of turic origin?

    Тhe hypothesis that the Bulgarians are of Turkic origin is a very outdated concept that has been rejected by modern archeology, linguistics, anthropology, ethnography and genetics. The Bulgarians, like the Goths, in the 5th century AD were simply allies and federates of the Huns, who were also of obscure origin. Later, in the late 6th and early 7th centuries, they were part of the West Turkic Haganate. This is the reason why at the end of the 19th century and the beginning of the 20th century historians considered them Turks. After rejecting the rule of Turkic Haganate, at the beginning of the 7th century AD, Bulgarians created an independent state on the territory of today's Southern Russia and Ukraine - Old Greate Bulgaria. Recent research shows that the Bulgarians are of Scythian-Sarmatian origin, and as it is known, the Sarmatians are an Indo-Iranian people. They were close to the Caucasian peoples, and one of the closest to them and related tribes are the Alans. They had been formed as a people around 2d century AD, alongside the Kuban River as part of the Saltovo-Majaki culture and people, where for their presence there are a huge amount of archaeological evidence such as graves and pottery, typical only for them. The first information about Bulgarians dates back in Armenian historical sources 2-3d century AD. 4th century they became allies of Byzantin Empire in their struggle against the Goths. This is long before the formation of the Turks as a people 6th century AD! Modern genetic research of Bulgarians shows that they have no or almost no East or Central Asian genes, which could show some close kinship with the Turkic peoples. Moreover, the genetic heritage of the ancient Bulgarians makes up to 30% of the genetics of modern Bulgarians.

    main-qimg-f9d14b626e1a93b14a9aa6527d313257.jpg1920px-Old_Geat_Bulgaria.svg.jpg

    Modern genetic studies

    Here it is what genetic researches shows for modern Bulgarians according to mytrueancestry.com:

    How do modern populations relate to modern Bulgarians?
    (Тhe number in parentheses indicates the distance of a population. Тhe smaller the number, the closer this population is to the studied population.)

    Autosomal DNA

    1. Romanian (4.028)
    2. Bosnian (4.770)
    3. Macedonian (4.990)
    4. Kosovar (6.429)
    5. Albanian_Tosk (8.670)
    6. Serbian (9.143)
    7. Greek (10.44)
    8. Greek_Thessaly (10.71)

    Male Y-DNA

    1. Macedonian (5.545)
    2. Greek_Thessaly (7.778)
    3. Romanian (13.76)
    4. Central_Greek (17.05)
    5. Serbian (17.26)
    6. Greek (18.26)
    7. Moldavian (19.39)
    8. Greek_Islands (22.41)

    Female MtDNA

    1. Greek (6.593)
    2. Ukrainian (7.088)
    3. Kargopol_Russian (7.994)
    4. Belorussian (8.120)
    5. Slovakian (8.141)
    6. Polish (8.452)
    7. Czech (8.809)

    Closest to modern Bulgarians Ancient groups

    1. *Byzantine (5.846)
    2. *Gaul (5.846)
    3. Byzantine + Gaul (5.846)
    4. Byzantine + Gallo-Roman (7.299)
    5. Byzantine + Roman (8.816)
    6. Seleucid + Gaul (10.29)
    7. Seleucid + Gallo-Roman (10.81)
    8. Roman (13.58)
    9. Gaul (15.57)
    10. Byzantine (16.69)
    11. Gallo-Roman (17.69)
    12. Seleucid (18.25)

    You can also visit the page of Bulgarian Genetic Genealogy Project of FamilyTreeDNA site:

    familytreedna.com/groups/bulgariandna/dna-results

    As pure Bulgarian with predecessors from West and Central Bulgaria I can provide my personal DNA test result as well as my daughter's one here:

    eupedia.com/forum/threads/33878-Share-your-updated-MyOrigins-results/page4?p=625919&viewfull=1#post625919

    N.B. My daughter has a Greek great-great-grandmother, by her grandfather side, from today's Bulgarian town of Sozopol, which in the late 19th century and early 20th was inhabited mainly by Greeks.

    If there are other Bulgarians here in this forum please, if you want do the same, so the others can compare our results and to see what our origina are?

    Thank you!
    Last edited by Kristiyan; 14-06-21 at 10:20.

  2. #2
    Regular Member Archetype0ne's Avatar
    Join Date
    11-06-18
    Posts
    715

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    J2b2-L283/FT29003

    Country: Albania



    Great summary!

    What I found surprising is the lower distance to Kosovars than Tosks autosomally. It must be some ancient Thraco-Illyrian connection. Since one would expect Tosks to be closer, if there was any admixture in South Albania during Samoils reign. But it seems the connection was more political, under same administration, than blood related.
    “Man cannot live without a permanent trust in something indestructible in himself, and at the same time that indestructible something as well as his trust in it may remain permanently concealed from him.”

    Franz Kafka

  3. #3
    Regular Member Kristiyan's Avatar
    Join Date
    12-06-21
    Location
    Sofia
    Posts
    13

    Y-DNA haplogroup
    I1a3a1a1/I-Y2245.2
    MtDNA haplogroup
    H65

    Ethnic group
    Bulgarians
    Country: Bulgaria



    1 members found this post helpful.

    Arrow

    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    Great summary!

    What I found surprising is the lower distance to Kosovars than Tosks autosomally. It must be some ancient Thraco-Illyrian connection. Since one would expect Tosks to be closer, if there was any admixture in South Albania during Samoils reign. But it seems the connection was more political, under same administration, than blood related.
    Thank you!

    I just want to clarify and show our origin, as well as the connection of the modern Bulgarian population with the other Balkan peoples. It is obvious that in the Balkans we are fraternal peoples and our mixing with peoples who came from outside is insignificant or very little and it is mostly with other peoples who used to lived near us or not so far from us such as Scythians, Goths, Slavs and Sarmatians.

    And yes, we are also very close to you Albanians. You can see that after the Greeks, your distance to other people on the Balkans is smallest to us Bulgarians. At once we were part of First bulgarian Empire and even today in Albania, Golloborda are living ethnic Bulgarians.


    How do modern populations relate to modern Albanians?
    (mytrueancestry.com)


    Autosomal DNA

    1. Greek_Thessaly (5.721)
    2. Greek (6.065)
    3. Kosovar (6.307)
    4. Bulgarian (8.670)
    5. Tuscan (9.063)
    6. Italian_Abruzzo (9.667)
    7. Central_Greek (10.36)
    8. Macedonian (11.14)

    Regards!

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