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Thread: Genomic analysis of two Pompeians that died during the eruption of Vesuvius in 79 AD

  1. #1
    Regular Member kingjohn's Avatar
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    Genomic analysis of two Pompeians that died during the eruption of Vesuvius in 79 AD

    The archaeological site of Pompeii is one of the 54 UNESCO World Heritage sites in Italy, thanks to its uniqueness: the town was completely destroyed and buried by a Vesuvius’ eruption in 79 AD. In this work, we present a multidisciplinary approach with bioarchaeological and palaeogenomic analyses of two Pompeian human remains from the Casa del Fabbro. We have been able to characterize the genetic profile of the first Pompeian’ genome, which has strong affinities with the surrounding central Italian population from the Roman Imperial Age. Our findings suggest that, despite the extensive connection between Rome and other Mediterranean populations, a noticeable degree of genetic homogeneity exists in the Italian peninsula at that time. Moreover, palaeopathological analyses identified the presence of spinal tuberculosis and we further investigated the presence of ancient DNA from Mycobacterium tuberculosis. In conclusion, our study demonstrates the power of a combined approach to investigate ancient humans and confirms the possibility to retrieve ancient DNA from Pompeii human remains. Our initial findings provide a foundation to promote an intensive and extensive paleogenetic analysis in order to reconstruct the genetic history of population from Pompeii, a unique archaeological site.





    source:

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-022-10899-1


    p.s
    fascinating the male carried y haplogroup A-M13

    Sex determination and uniparental genetic markers

    The genetic sex determination (estimated by RY parameter26, and by the X chromosome coverage) confirmed the morphological determination that individual A was a male (Table 1).
    The mitochondrial DNA haplogroup was identified using HaploGrep227,28 (Table 1), and revealed that the individual belongs to the haplogroup clade HV0a, the main monophyletic branch of HV0 and subclade of haplogroup HV. This mitochondrial lineage is absent among published Roman Imperial individuals from Italy29. In Europe, the first evidence of the HV haplogroup is from a Magdalenian period individual from Spain30 while in Italy from a Mesolithic individual from Sicily (Favignana)31. The HV haplogroup is actually associated with the early human dispersal in Eurasia after the Last Glacial Maximum (LGM)32. It is unevenly spread across Europe with highest frequencies in the Near East (~11%)33, in south Europe (from ~4% to ~11%)34 and in the Balkan peninsula (~8%)35. HV0a coalesces around 12.5–11.0 kya ago34 and, among the extant populations, is common in Sardinia36.
    Individual A, albeit at low coverage (Table 1), was found to belong to the Y-chromosome lineage A-M13 (A1b1b2b), a rare lineage absent among ancient individuals from the Italian Peninsula29, mainly found in Eastern Africa (~ 40%), but with known occurrences, at much lower frequencies, in the Near East (Turkey, Yemen, Egypt, Palestine, Jordan, Oman and Saudi Arabia) and the Mediterranean islands of Sardinia, Cyprus and Lesbos37,38,39,40. Downstream of A-M13 and restricting the analysis to transversions polymorphisms, the individual can be placed at A-V5880, a sub-haplogroup that contains all A-M13 positive Sardinians from past studies39,40, and that has been dated to coalesce around 7.62 (± 0.92) thousands of years ago, using Bayesian analysis40.


    according to user teenpean47 from anthrogenica
    he was here in the A-m13 tree:


    Yleaf 3.0:

    Code:
    A-V6275


    Snipsa:

    Code:
    Result (40.0% 344 -5 +479): A-V3663



    thats the european branch that was found in sardinians

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/A-V6275*/
    ancestery :
    mostly western jewish here is the overlapp with south europe[U]

    "Know where you came from and where you are going."

    Direct paternal line : mizrahi from damascus

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Very Interesting indeed. It also has the mtdna of HV0a

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shuzam87 View Post
    Very Interesting indeed. It also has the mtdna of HV0a
    indeed thats what so cool in ancient dna
    we can find branches who are pretty rare nowdays
    any way his autosomal from the paper






    his
    eurogenes k15:

    f1R,2.85,12.49,3.85,0,15.79,21.28,31.41,9.93,0.53,0,0 ,0,0,0.99,0.88

    Distance to: f1R
    8.94930724 Sephardic_Jewish
    9.21028773 Italy_East_Sicily
    9.25833138 Italy_Calabria


    he is close to imperial roman averege in his k15 values ( user ajeje from anthrogenica run)



    Sample North_Sea Atlantic Baltic Eastern_Euro West_Med West_Asian East_Med Red_Sea South_Asian Southeast_Asian Siberian Amerindian Oceanian Northeast_African Sub-Saharan
    Rome_Imperial_proxy 4,80 13,48 3,11 0,92 17,40 19,20 31,99 6,98 0,63 0,10 0,05 0,08 0,30 0,75 0,23
    Pompeian f1R 2,85 12,49 3,85 0 15,79 21,28 31,41 9,93 0,53 0 0 0 0 0,99 0,88


  4. #4
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    5 members found this post helpful.
    thanks KingJohn :)

    Code:
    f1R_Pompeii_Dodecad_K12b,9.89,0.00,7.71,2.10,21.94,4.65,0.00,0.00,16.49,0.00,36.41,0.81

    Distance to: f1R_Pompeii
    4.06247462 C4-ANAS_Imperial_Rome:R73:Antonio_2019
    6.07334340 C5-Marcellino_&_Pietro_Imperial_Rome:R134:Antonio_201 9
    6.20552173 C5-Necropolis_of_Monte_Agnese_Imperial_Rome:R1543:Ant onio_2019
    6.43018662 C5-Mausole_di_Augusto_Late_Antiquity:R34:Antonio_2019
    6.48233754 C4-Isola_Sacra_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R41:Antonio_2 019
    6.82000000 Collegno30:Amorim_2018
    7.26622323 C5-Marcellino_&_Pietro_Imperial_Rome:R130:Antonio_201 9
    7.41182164 MAS002:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021
    7.50069997 C5-Viale_Rossini_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R81:Antonio _2019
    7.62155496 Ashkelon_IA1:ASH067:Feldman_2019_(Jul.)
    7.75602347 C5-Via_Paisiello_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R115:Antoni o_2019
    8.39610624 Latini_o:R850:Antonio_2019
    8.47413712 C5-Isola_Sacra_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R39:Antonio_2 019
    8.66876000 C4-Viale_Rossini_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R75:Antonio _2019
    8.79847714 Collegno38:Amorim_2018
    8.85150835 C5-Marcellino_&_Pietro_Imperial_Rome:R133:Antonio_201 9
    9.26573257 C5-Isola_Sacra_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R45:Antonio_2 019
    9.46565898 C5-Mausole_di_Augusto_Late_Antiquity:R30:Antonio_2019
    9.47827516 C4-ANAS_Imperial_Rome:R70:Antonio_2019
    10.15801654 Collegno25:Amorim_2018
    10.17498403 C5-Monterotondo_Imperial_Rome:R1548:Antonio_2019
    10.26901164 C6-Centocelle_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R51:Antonio_20 19
    10.37483976 C5-Casale_del_Dolce_Imperial_Rome:R123:Antonio_2019
    10.42934801 C5-Centocelle_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R50:Antonio_20 19
    10.46644161 C5-ANAS_Imperial_Rome:R66:Antonio_2019
    🕷️

  5. #5
    Regular Member Duarte's Avatar
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    Very cool Kingjohn and Salento. When I got to know ancient Pompeii together with my wife, I realized a youthful dream. A magical place. Out of curiosity, I used the coordinates of the ancient Pompeian to compare it with the modern Italians whose coordinates were presented by Salento in the thread https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...samples/page33

    Distance to: f1R_Pompeii_Dodecad_K12b
    9.16212857 NaN275IS_Campania
    9.32100316 Pu8_Apulia
    9.92619766 ALP582_Calabria
    9.95910137 NaN65DFG_Campania
    11.31461002 NaN77FAM_Campania
    11.63029664 W-Sicily21
    11.95650032 ALP596_Calabria
    12.09518499 PG16_Basilicata
    12.34910523 Pu7_Apulia
    12.64443356 W-Sicily3
    12.64869163 TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014
    12.84183787 W-Sicily5a
    12.86452098 NaN58AC_Campania
    13.00637536 NaN195ST_Campania
    13.03057942 NaN128LA_Campania
    13.06731036 Ag-Sicily8
    13.12561999 NaN207MM_Campania
    13.15046387 Ag-Sicily5
    13.33566646 W-Sicily1
    13.37872939 Pu3_Apulia
    13.44177444 W-Sicily9
    13.54138472 NaN46TC_Campania
    13.69120886 TP05_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014
    13.77893320 PG20_Basilicata
    13.85775956 PG25_Basilicata

    Distance to: f1R_Pompeii_Dodecad_K12b
    9.07423165 37.20% Pu8_Apulia + 62.80% NaN275IS_Campania
    9.30739864 87.20% Pu8_Apulia + 12.80% ALP582_Calabria
    9.85526867 54.80% ALP582_Calabria + 45.20% NaN65DFG_Campania
    11.16664781 23.40% TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 76.60% NaN77FAM_Campania
    11.20839837 33.20% W-Sicily21 + 66.80% NaN77FAM_Campania
    11.26452146 14.60% NaN58AC_Campania + 85.40% NaN77FAM_Campania
    11.29006940 8.80% TP05_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 91.20% NaN77FAM_Campania
    11.31286203 2.60% W-Sicily9 + 97.40% NaN77FAM_Campania
    11.58057248 73.40% W-Sicily21 + 26.60% ALP596_Calabria
    11.62816327 95.00% W-Sicily21 + 5.00% Pu7_Apulia
    11.63029285 99.80% W-Sicily21 + 0.20% Pu3_Apulia
    11.81560774 28.80% TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 71.20% ALP596_Calabria
    11.90681889 81.80% ALP596_Calabria + 18.20% NaN58AC_Campania
    11.94698926 6.60% TP05_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 93.40% ALP596_Calabria
    11.94892539 18.40% PG16_Basilicata + 81.60% ALP596_Calabria
    11.95338999 95.00% ALP596_Calabria + 5.00% NaN195ST_Campania
    11.95596703 42.80% TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 57.20% Pu7_Apulia
    11.99774918 27.60% TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 72.40% PG16_Basilicata
    12.07929477 87.80% PG16_Basilicata + 12.20% NaN58AC_Campania
    12.09469156 1.80% W-Sicily9 + 98.20% PG16_Basilicata
    12.14739156 61.40% TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 38.60% Pu3_Apulia
    12.22971132 70.00% Pu7_Apulia + 30.00% NaN58AC_Campania
    12.26351216 20.80% W-Sicily9 + 79.20% Pu7_Apulia
    12.29010162 58.80% TP07_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 41.20% NaN195ST_Campania
    12.30432010 14.80% TP05_Trapani_LazaridisNat2014 + 85.20% Pu7_Apulia

  6. #6
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    … nice Duarte, … too bad there’s only one Pompeii sample, … is not close to modern Italians, … maybe f1R is only half Italian, or … :)

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    Despite this high genetic variability in the Imperial period29 the Pompeian individual A shows a higher level of shared genetic drift with the central Italy Roman Imperial Age group. This result strongly suggests that the individual that we have analysed should come from the Italian peninsula. Whether this individual belongs to the local population of Pompeii or is part of the 5% of the internal migrants characterizing the imperial population of Italy85 is difficult to address, but very likely he is not part of the large external migrations related to the practice of enslavement.



    p.s
    in other words
    the reserchers think he was native to italy not a slave
    could be from pompeii or internal immigrant from south



  8. #8
    Regular Member Salento's Avatar
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    3 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    Despite this high genetic variability in the Imperial period29 the Pompeian individual A shows a higher level of shared genetic drift with the central Italy Roman Imperial Age group. This result strongly suggests that the individual that we have analysed should come from the Italian peninsula. Whether this individual belongs to the local population of Pompeii or is part of the 5% of the internal migrants characterizing the imperial population of Italy85 is difficult to address, but very likely he is not part of the large external migrations related to the practice of enslavement.



    p.s
    in other words
    the reserchers think he was native to italy not a slave
    could be from pompeii or internal immigrant from south


    I said half Italian, … According to their PCA, f1R is to the right of most imperial Romans:



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    Quote Originally Posted by Salento View Post
    I said half Italian, … According to their PCA, f1R is to the right of most imperial Romans:


    ok,
    in your opinion was he half levnatine ?



    We extracted and sequenced DNA from a petrous bone from each Pompeian individual with identical procedures (see “Materials and methods”) and obtained 0.4 X (individual A) and 0.0013 X (individual B) average genome-wide depth of coverage (Table 1). Both individuals displayed typical signatures of aDNA25 (Supplementary Fig. S2). Low rates of contamination with modern human DNA (0.8% for the mtDNA and between 0.6 and 0.8% for the X chromosome, Table 1 and Supplementary Figs. S2, S3) for individual A confirmed the authenticity of the aDNA. The low coverage obtained for individual B prevented us from reaching any further assessments of quality parameters. Herein, we report the details of the analyses only for individual A.





    p.s
    to bad that the female individual_B was in low coverage
    would have been interesting to see her autosomal profile

  10. #10
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    I guess I could say that f1R is almost a C4, but C5 shifted :)

  11. #11
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    Despite this high genetic variability in the Imperial period29 the Pompeian individual A shows a higher level of shared genetic drift with the central Italy Roman Imperial Age group. This result strongly suggests that the individual that we have analysed should come from the Italian peninsula. Whether this individual belongs to the local population of Pompeii or is part of the 5% of the internal migrants characterizing the imperial population of Italy85 is difficult to address, but very likely he is not part of the large external migrations related to the practice of enslavement.



    p.s
    in other words
    the reserchers think he was native to italy not a slave
    could be from pompeii or internal immigrant from south


    Pretty much in line with the stance I have been holding last few years. Can't say I am surprised, but might blindside some others.
    “Man cannot live without a permanent trust in something indestructible in himself, and at the same time that indestructible something as well as his trust in it may remain permanently concealed from him.”

    Franz Kafka

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    "The position of the Pompeian individual A in the PCA falls also close to the distribution of modern Mediterranean and Near Eastern populations, such as Greeks, Maltese, Cypriots, and Turks. Such a result allowed us to hypothesize a genetic contribution from the Near East. This hypothesis can be also supported by a cline from Neolithic Iran (Iran_N) to Italy Imperial Roman Age (Italy_IRA, including the Pompeian individual) passing through Chalcolithic Iran (Iran_CA) and Iron Age Iran (Iran_IA)."

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    ok,
    in your opinion was he half levnatine ?

    It doesn't look so, the study characterises him as:
    1)"positioned close to the well-documented Neolithic cline of Anatolians to European populations"
    2)We further attempted to investigate if the fit could be improved by including Morocco_Iberomaurusian as a fifth source, but no three-, four- or five-way mixture with this last component produced significant results"

    Basically he is described like an European with heavy caucasus-related ancestry, in my opinion the best bet is to think he was from (western, at least) Anatolia, whose genetic gene pool has been tentatively modelled as half Balkan_IA and half Anatolian_BA; also the autosomal modelling seems to me compatible with Anatolian origins.

    Furthermore, historically one would expect that the bulk of the greek-speaking foreigners in the empire came from Anatolia, since it was by far the most populous greek-speaking region.

    Anyway let's keep in mind that the coverage isn't great, though so far it does suggest he is compatible with previous samples from the imperial era.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Archetype0ne's Avatar
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    Someone ran the coordinates over at the other forum.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michalis Moriopoulos View Post
    Thanks!


    Italy_Roman_Empire_Pompeii:f1r_K13_sim,0.0921,0.15 2,-0.0282,-0.0622,-0.0013,-0.0224,-0.0031,-0.0036,0.0074,0.0238,0.0022,0.0039,-0.01,0.0028,-0.0067,-0.006,-0.0085,-0.0056,-0.0029,0.0016,0.0044,0.0033,0.0049,-0.0095,0.0039


    Distance to: f1r_K13_sim
    0.02499165 Romaniote_Jew
    0.02578224 Sephardic_Jew_Turkey
    0.02606108 Sephardic_Jew_Bulgaria
    0.02813043 Italy_Roman_Empire_Isola_Sacra_(East_Med_Profile)
    0.02983147 Italian_Jew
    0.03068052 Syrian_Jew
    0.03075081 Turkish_Cyprus
    0.03118686 Greek_Dodecanese_Kastellorizo
    0.03120488 Greek_Cyprus
    0.03221559 Italy_Roman_Empire_Mazzano_Romano_(East_Med_Profil e)
    0.03303802 Italy_Medieval_Lombard_Period_Collegno_(East_Med_P rofile)
    0.03379413 Italy_Late_Antiquity_Rome_(Anatolian_Profile)
    0.03428852 Italy_Late_Antiquity_Rome_(East_Med_Profile)
    0.03429758 Israel_IAI_Ashkelon_Philistine_(Mixed_East_Med/Near_East_Profile)
    0.03467091 Ashkenazi_Jew_France
    0.03516780 Greek_Dodecanese_Rhodes
    0.03539949 Italy_Roman_Empire_Isola_Sacra_(Anatolian_Profile)
    0.03548958 Italy_Roman_Empire_Rome_(East_Med_Profile)
    0.03550317 Iberia_Catalonia_Empuries_Roman_Empire_(East_Med_P rofile)_(low_res)
    0.03614354 Greek_Dodecanese_Symi
    0.03638095 Greek_Dodecanese_Karpathos
    0.03650923 Algerian_Jew
    0.03661224 Ashkenazi_Jew_Germany

    To think people used to get banned from this forum for even mentioning Cyprus or Anatolia.
    Shoutout to dosas.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michalis Moriopoulos View Post
    Anybody have K13 coords for it yet? Since there's a K15 version, here's a K15-to-G25 sim for F1R:


    Code:
    Italy_Roman_Empire_Pompeii:f1r_K15_sim,0.0926,0.15,-0.0292,-0.0607,-0.0016,-0.0204,-0.0018,-0.0023,0.0066,0.0215,0.0037,0.0028,-0.0072,0.0039,-0.0041,-0.0071,-0.0088,-0.004,-0.0024,-0.0005,0.0029,0.0006,0.0055,-0.0099,0.0023

    Distance to: Italy_Roman_Empire_Pompeii:f1r_K15_sim
    0.02290785 Sephardic_Jew_Bulgaria
    0.02309899 Sephardic_Jew_Turkey
    0.02350077 Romaniote_Jew
    0.02707769 Turkish_Cyprus
    0.02783179 Italy_Roman_Empire_Isola_Sacra_(East_Med_Profile)
    0.02825899 Syrian_Jew
    0.02853540 Italian_Jew
    0.02879994 Italy_Roman_Empire_Mazzano_Romano_(East_Med_Profil e)
    0.02930734 Greek_Dodecanese_Kastellorizo
    0.02988457 Greek_Cyprus
    0.03160058 Italy_Medieval_Lombard_Period_Collegno_(East_Med_P rofile)
    0.03232923 Ashkenazi_Jew_France
    0.03310888 Greek_Dodecanese_Rhodes
    0.03318322 Italy_Late_Antiquity_Rome_(East_Med_Profile)
    0.03434856 Italy_Roman_Empire_Rome_(East_Med_Profile)
    0.03435879 Ashkenazi_Jew_Germany
    0.03459865 Italy_Late_Antiquity_Rome_(Anatolian_Profile)
    0.03463475 Greek_Dodecanese_Symi
    0.03469388 Greek_Dodecanese_Nisyros
    0.03471493 Greek_Dodecanese_Karpathos
    0.03483847 Turkish_Cyprus_(Levant-Shifted_Profile)
    0.03502949 Iberia_Catalonia_Empuries_Roman_Empire_(East_Med_P rofile)_(low_res)
    0.03543995 Italy_Late_Antiquity_Marsiliana_d'Albegna_(East_Me d_Profile)


    Basic components:
    0.4% Iberomaurusian
    0.6% WHG
    49.6% ANF
    14.8% CHG
    10.8% Iran Neo
    15.4% Natufian
    8.4% Yamnaya


    Extremely East Med, more on the hither-Cypriot end of the continuum, probably very similar to Vranas Marathon.

    I mean with all the rumors going around, and the marathon sample being part of the Danubian Limes paper as a placeholder for East Med admixture composition, one would think the writing was on the wall.
    From what I gather more samples are probably going to be published from Pompei, so talking about outliers might be a faux pas.

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    2 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    Someone ran the coordinates over at the other forum.




    To think people used to get banned from this forum for even mentioning Cyprus or Anatolia.
    Shoutout to dosas.
    It is simulated coordinates though

    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    I mean with all the rumors going around, and the marathon sample being part of the Danubian Limes paper as a placeholder for East Med admixture composition, one would think the writing was on the wall
    The same paper argued that so far the data suggested that the near eastern foreigners did not contribute to the subsequent gene pool of the Balkans, and this very recent paper does the same https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1...rticle-metrics, though I see how one can argue for a partial Anatolian input in south east Europe and south Italy.

    There's no such thing as an "east med" genetic component, it is either Levantine or Anatolian, since the latter virtually lacked (was extremely low compared to Anatolian_N) the natufian present in the former, and indeed the Daunubian limes paper showed that even using the least natufian-like and most anatolian-like Levantine (Alalakh samples) provided bad fits when modelling the near eastern (Anatolian) samples and the only near eastern outlier was easily told apart because he was genetically like a northern Levantine.

    Thus, the only thing faintly written on the wall is a partial Anatolian contributio, maybe.

  17. #17
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    True. Do you think the actual ones will be much different though?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    True. Do you think the actual ones will be much different though?

    Though it can be that the Iberomaurasian could be too low to detect in formal stats if the sample was half Levantine, the fact that the tests showed this sample showed no significant affinities is a hint that he was not, furthermore he is described as "positioned close to the documented Neolithic cline of Anatolians to European populations", though with a considerable caucasus-related gene flow ("Iran_N" here).
    In the Danubian limes paper Anatolians were modelled as half Balkan_IA and half Anatolian_BA, he looks like more consistent with such an analysis rather than with a Levantine-Italic combination

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    Regular Member Archetype0ne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leopoldo Leone View Post
    Though it can be that the Iberomaurasian could be too low to detect in formal stats if the sample was half Levantine, the fact that the tests showed this sample showed no significant affinities is a hint that he was not, furthermore he is described as "positioned close to the documented Neolithic cline of Anatolians to European populations", though with a considerable caucasus-related gene flow ("Iran_N" here).
    In the Danubian limes paper Anatolians were modelled as half Balkan_IA and half Anatolian_BA, he looks like more consistent with such an analysis rather than with a Levantine-Italic combination
    Fair enough. What are your thoughts on some of the Croatian samples from the recent paper showing the same Anatolian/Levantine, or whatever one wants to call the East-Med shift?

    I mean, there is a less than 0 chance, and by rumors quite possible, that such a population was prevalent in the Balkans, just look at the Marathon sample. For all we know populations that were not usually associated with the east might turn up east shifted well into the BCs, and might have been in Italy earlier than Imperial period, as we already have had a couple of late republic samples showing such autosomal admixture. Maybe the Balkan_IA, Anatolian_Ba holds the key, but I still have to see what Balkan IA they are talking about, since there might have been a couple of profiles... As for Anatolian BA, which sample do they mean?

    Edit: In fact I am really interested in this Anatolian_BA profile... is it some yet unpublished Western Anatolian sample? Troy or whatever was supposedly coming out some time ago? Also, I am not really talking about Iberomaurusian here, talking about Greek Islander like profile.

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    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    This guy was probably just a Near eastern immigrant (C4). He doesn't actually look like the average central Italian from the Imperial age (i.e. C6):


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    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    2 members found this post helpful.
    Maciamo's average of the two imperial samples from Marche are a good standard for the Imperial Roman C6 cluster that came to be the predominant genetic group in Rome. This is what the standard of Imperial Roman central Italian ancestry that should be applied:

    This person is more than 16 distant (nearly 17) from it! No way is this person a native to Italy:

    Distance to: f1R_Pompeii_Dodecad_K12b
    16.86065835 Imperial-age_Marche_(n=2)

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    Regular Member Archetype0ne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    This guy was probably just a Near eastern immigrant (C4). He doesn't actually look like the average central Italian from the Imperial age (i.e. C6):

    "Despite this high genetic variability in the Imperial period29 the Pompeian individual A shows a higher level of shared genetic drift with the central Italy Roman Imperial Age group. This result strongly suggests that the individual that we have analysed should come from the Italian peninsula. Whether this individual belongs to the local population of Pompeii or is part of the 5% of the internal migrants characterizing the imperial population of Italy85 is difficult to address, but very likely he is not part of the large external migrations related to the practice of enslavement."

    Supposedly there was some leaked PCA.

    "The fact Imperial era Pompeiian samples (there are more to come, at least from what we know based on leaked PCAs etc.) are much more Cypriot-like than most Imperial Romans are"

    I mean, it was an attractive hypothesis for this particular profile in the two Rome papers, and Danubian limes paper to be attributed to Imperial Roman Era slaves, migrants etc... But when they show up for many studies in a row, maybe there is more to it. I just wish there was less talk of leaks, and more actual publishing going on.

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    Advisor Jovialis's Avatar
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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    "Despite this high genetic variability in the Imperial period29 the Pompeian individual A shows a higher level of shared genetic drift with the central Italy Roman Imperial Age group. This result strongly suggests that the individual that we have analysed should come from the Italian peninsula. Whether this individual belongs to the local population of Pompeii or is part of the 5% of the internal migrants characterizing the imperial population of Italy85 is difficult to address, but very likely he is not part of the large external migrations related to the practice of enslavement."

    Supposedly there was some leaked PCA.

    "The fact Imperial era Pompeiian samples (there are more to come, at least from what we know based on leaked PCAs etc.) are much more Cypriot-like than most Imperial Romans are"

    I mean, it was an attractive hypothesis for this particular profile in the two Rome papers, and Danubian limes paper to be attributed to Imperial Roman Era slaves, migrants etc... But when they show up for many studies in a row, maybe there is more to it. I just wish there was less talk of leaks, and more actual publishing going on.
    I think the researchers are wrong to state he is from Italy, here is the same model applied to other Ancient Italian samples. He actually looks more like a Eastern Med immigrant:


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    Regular Member Archetype0ne's Avatar
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    Quite a few of them match, or am I trippin?

    Edit: If I am reading the legend right, over 20 of n-sample size you used seem to have similar makeup. And those seem to be labeled Imperial. So not sure what is wrong with what the authors stated. I could have misread the legend though.

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    Regular Member kingjohn's Avatar
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    His k13
    Component %
    North_Atlantic 13.12%
    Baltic 1.18%
    West_Med 20.43%
    West_Asian 20.51%
    East_Med 32.30%
    Red_Sea 9.85%
    South_Asian 0.82%
    Northeast_African 1.17%
    Sub-Saharan 0.60%

    P.s
    The north atlantic is to high
    For an immigrant from anatolia
    I do agree the other components values
    Can fit a cypriot though

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