Anthropometric Data from the Western Balkans Reveal Extraordinary Physical Stature

mount123 said:
To summarize everything regarding the misdated Slavic sample I18719:


• Obvious Slavic uniparentals as already pointed out I-Y3120 and HV0a1a1b

• Late formed Slavic mtDNA:

https://www.yfull.com/mtree/HV0a1a1b/

Actual dating: formed 600 ybp, TMRCA 275 ybp

The wrong non radiocarbon dating is: 2950-3450 ypb


• Strong Slavic autosomal profile

Distance: I18719_Slavic1.5181% / 0.01518087 | ADC: 0.25x RC
32.6 KAZ_Golden_Horde_Euro
24.0 BGR_Beli_Breyag_EBA
20.4 SVK_Poprad_MA
11.0 Ostrogothic_Crimea_ACD
9.4 DEU_MA_o
2.6 HUN_Avar_Period

Can also be modeled as 76% Avar_Slav_Szolad and 24% Eastern Balkan Native which makes it South Slavic-like


Distance to: I18719_Slavic
0.02650526 Romanian:G408
0.02680971 Montenegrin:Montenegro6
0.02720836 Serbian:717
0.02749230 Serbian:729
0.02775372 Serbian:726
0.02815494 Montenegrin:Montenegro4


• I18719_Slavic does not plot near actual radiocarbon dated Bronze Age Dalmatian samples who have a North Italian-like autosomal profile


• Judging on what the authors have provided about the findings of Bezdanjaca cave, this non radiocarbon misdated Slavic sample might be as young as from World War II.
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I-M170 is a macro haplogroup designation. And as we have seen from multiple papers and more to come it is already proven that I-Y3120
came with the early medieval Slavic migration into the Balkans.
 
Centrum99 said:
The intellectual horizons of your minds are seriously blocked by Y haplogroups E, J, and G. And we won't get over these genetic limitations, obviously. What's the point of posting dozens of graphs with correlations above r = 0.70 (and not rarely above r = 0.80) and p-values of 0.000000000000001, when you continue to babble that it cannot be true and everybody can just reach such a probability to break the bank in Monte Carlo? I will be happy to explain it to anyone who will be interested. But the audience on this forum really isn't worthy of the slightest effort.
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This is the kind of "intellect" repeating the same non sense such as a major Slavic haplogroup being native to the Balkans.
 
You obviously want to believe what you want to believe. You will be disappointed.
 
Centrum99 said:
You obviously want to believe what you want to believe. You will be disappointed.
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You’re back after 1 month? Did you do some reading and learn anything new?

Or still think that the Medieval I-Y3120 is from the Bronze Age Balkans and brought the tall genes in there?
 
The data on ancient genetic ancestries provided by Allentoft et al. show that there is a very good reason why the Balkan lineages of I-M170 cannot be of Eastern European origin. But since you do not resemble a scientist even remotely, do not expect that I would share this information with you. I would recommend you to move to some hot nationalist forum because you would enjoy it much more than some boring scientific discussions.
 
O.K. You disagree. Move on.
 
Angela said:
O.K. You disagree. Move on.
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I thought people here were banning Nazis as opposed to big bad anthrogenica. (sarcasm)

Centrum99 said:
The intellectual horizons of your minds are seriously blocked by Y haplogroups E, J, and G. And we won't get over these genetic limitations, obviously. What's the point of posting dozens of graphs with correlations above r = 0.70 (and not rarely above r = 0.80) and p-values of 0.000000000000001, when you continue to babble that it cannot be true and everybody can just reach such a probability to break the bank in Monte Carlo? I will be happy to explain it to anyone who will be interested. But the audience on this forum really isn't worthy of the slightest effort.
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Yet here we have charlaGoebbels spewing eugenics all over the thread but... its a matter of: "OK you disagree move on". Shame with a capital S.
Angela spare me the excuse of you have no time to read garbage threads, this crap is too appalling to be excused. You would think at least someone would be moderating eugenics out of serious discussions, the worst part is this guy is an author. Hope people reading this thread are not as appalled as me. *pukes*
 
Archetype0ne said:
I thought people here were banning Nazis as opposed to big bad anthrogenica. (sarcasm)



Yet here we have charlaGoebbels spewing eugenics all over the thread but... its a matter of: "OK you disagree move on". Shame with a capital S.
Angela spare me the excuse of you have no time to read garbage threads, this crap is too appalling to be excused. You would think at least someone would be moderating eugenics out of serious discussions, the worst part is this guy is an author. Hope people reading this thread are not as appalled as me. *pukes*
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Archetype, please calm down.

Mount posted concerns about Dushman with links to specific remarks. That I couldn't miss. I couldn't and don't act on my own. The moderators have to agree and so it took some time. He was then banned.

I'm sorry; I'm not calling this a garbage thread, but I haven't read all of it, I confess.

What I read was a dispute as to whether a certain yDna was "indigenous" to the Balkans or brought by Slavic speaking people. If someone refuses to accept the scientific evidence that it was brought by Slavic speaking people, what should one do? A constant back and forth only escalates into insults. Hence my response.

I have no idea as to anyone other than Dushman making racist comments. If complaints aren't raised, of course nothing is going to be done, because no one can read every post in every thread.

Please post in the section about the site links to the statements made by this person which rise to the level of racism, and the matter will be dealt with.
 
Fair enough Angela. Not sure how reports are processed, but I make sure to not just complain and try to report all the nonsense I see. IIRC I reported that one.

Also, did you read what I just quoted from the guy? Guy was claiming in this very thread, people with E, J and G haplogroups are subhuman, then posting a paper that didn't even back his claim. Not sure if I have to quote it again, in case you misread it.
 
Jovialis said:
Reason for ban of Dushman

Threatening to rape and kill people.

I'd say that's grounds for a permanent ban.
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I completely agree. I don't think Centrum's comment is completely reprehensible, but not on the save level.

I think the moderators should discuss whether an infraction and a warning are sufficient for a first go round.

Ed. I meant his comments were reprehensible.
 
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Sums up why this forum isn't worth two pence even when there is no alternative.
 
Archetype0ne said:
Sums up why this forum isn't worth two pence even when there is no alternative.
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I'm sorry, but I fail to see your point. Banning someone that threatens rape and violence vs someone that says something dumb are way different. E, J, and G are present where my family is from, and I am sure some of them may carry those lines. But I'm not getting bent out of shape. Hell, I'm sure he has people in his family with those lines as well. Why not combat his stupidity by pointing to the fact that it has nothing to do with intelligence, and there is nothing that shows that it does. We can't just ban everyone that says something stupid, otherwise more than half of all people will be gone.




What about all the intelligent people in the world that probably carry those lines? Einstein is allegedly haplogroup E. His name is synonymous with high intelligence.


It is easy to refute this member's claims about those haplogroups.
 
Where did I even mention Dushmans ban? Why would I care?

If you do not see the problem with eugenics that's not on me. Stupidity is no excuse for eugenics. The very source he claims refutes the correlation for J but that's not even the point... the point is the whole premise is flawed, and using such a bs argument to support ones flawed conclusion by attacking millions of people after getting owned on ones own paper, and sayin "And we won't get over these genetic limitations, obviously" is Goebbels level talk. Me getting "bent out of shape" over such remarks is an indication of scruples, something not everyone is self conscious enough to have.
 
Centrum99 said:
After a long bureaucratic process, the article was eventually corrected and a press release was issued. It's a pity that it was not possible to add new information that became available thanks to the preprint by Allentoft et al. (https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2022/05/05/2022.05.04.490594.full.pdf) and that moved the topic several big steps forward.
In the near future, you will see that we were right and I-M170 is autochthonous in the Balkans. And there were actually two founder effects positively affecting height: The second one was associated with E1b-V13 in northern Albania/Kosovo.
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E-V13 is actually strong throughout albania, 31% in berat, 30% gjirokaster etc but yeah some regions a bit more than others. It may be possible that v13 played a secondary role due to it having good frequency in montenegro though not sure how relevant it is in bosnia. With the great frequency of i2a and the heights in bosnia/montenegro we have to say that i2a has definitely played a bigger role.

But dont forget that consumption of milk (and food in general) is also a major factor if we leave genetics to one side. For example nigerian men are 164cm on average but african americans and those born in uk/france are taller
 
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Archetype0ne said:
Where did I even mention Dushmans ban? Why would I care?

If you do not see the problem with eugenics that's not on me. Stupidity is no excuse for eugenics. The very source he claims refutes the correlation for J but that's not even the point... the point is the whole premise is flawed, and using such a bs argument to support ones flawed conclusion by attacking millions of people after getting owned on ones own paper, and sayin "And we won't get over these genetic limitations, obviously" is Goebbels level talk. Me getting "bent out of shape" over such remarks is an indication of scruples, something not everyone is self conscious enough to have.
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I sincerely think you are over reacting.
 
I have given Centrum an infraction and issued a warning.

"You say you've written a population genetics paper? Who the heck would publish it if it contained such nonsense? Haplogroups don't determine intelligence.

However, while we debate people who post pseudo-science, certain behaviors are not permitted.

You insulted some of our members because of their majority haplogroup designations. That comes dangerously close to hate speech, which is absolutely not allowed here.

You have been warned. Any more of that and there will be serious consequences.
 
@arch0type A big chunck of those highly intelligent jewish accounts, lawyers, doctors, etc probably have J1, so I fail to see how what he is saying makes sense. You can't change people. While you are getting mad, he is sitting back picking his nose, unbothered. Don't let it get to you. More than half of people are mentally inferior. If the medium is 100, than a quarter of the population is literally mentally challenged high risk people. But it clearly has nothing to do with haplogroups.
 
The worst part is such idiots do real damage. Even if the fella is on the left side of the curve, one academic title and a platform, and you get real psychopaths reading this thinking its ok since obviously he is one of the authors and just got off scot free, so why not parrot his talking points. Banality of evil comes to mind. Seems harmless until you get people pushing people in front of trains because God knows what they read on social media.

Just elaborated on why I got mad @Job ;)
 
^^It infuriates me too. It's just that I can't control what idiot papers get published. All you can do is refute it, refute it, and refute it with better science and analysis.
 
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