Is anthrogenica.com gone?

[Palermo Trapani]

Don't waste your time with this... Dinaric Superman , I think that says it all.

Yes, I noticed that screen name as well. Must be a Friedrich Nietzsche "ubermensch" and Carleton Cooon "Dinaric" (Nordid, Alpine, Atlantid, Med) fan. I find these 2 are the intellectual heroes of many over at Apricity in the Anthropology forum there which when I lurk every now and then, has about 1800 to 2000 participants. The Genetics Research Paper forum there 1/9 to 1/10 of that amount. I guess they are well followed by certain segments of the Anthrogenica crowd as well.

I guess since I would be more of a Med in the Coon lexicon (which I think is Bull Sh..), I rate as Lex Luthor to them.

 

[Palermo Trapani]

David Anthony is an anthropologist, not an archaeologist. And he talks about genetics, archaeology, linguistics. Certainly not an expert on these fields.

Reich and those around him can and should form a hypothesis. Now they don't even have one.

Fair enough, he is an Anthropologist by training, but most of his work relates to linguistics and archeology. But his intellectual mentor or who he followed was Marija Gimbutas who was a UCLA professor of Archeology. So while he did his PhD in Anthropology, in practice he is more of a Archeologist. But point taken, he was in fact trained as an Anthropologist.

 

[Jovialis]

It takes a lot of mental gymnastics to be a geneticist, especially one from a prestigious Ivy-league university. Even more so one who is the head of the research laboratory.


The problem with "popular" forums is that it attracts people from all parts of the bell curve. It dilutes the quality of discussion. They can't help themselves, not to be cruel, but they are like dumb animals. They are completely oblivious to their own stupidity. Which is why they argue like we are talking about a sports rather than an inter-disciplinary subject like archeogenetics. Frankly, you need to at least have an IQ of 115 to gather and infer data properly. Which is about 14% of the population. The average doctor has an IQ of 120-130, so now we are in single digits.

The fact that people who likely have lower-IQs than those they are raging against is outrageous, and also somewhat amusing, yet sad.

 

[Palermo Trapani]

David Anthony is an anthropologist, not an archaeologist. And he talks about genetics, archaeology, linguistics. Certainly not an expert on these fields.

Reich and those around him can and should form a hypothesis. Now they don't even have one.

They may have one, they may not. How many different hypotheses over the last 100 plus years have been put forth regarding PIE. The early proto Nazis like Kossina argued for a Northern European homeland, Northern Germany (total Nordicist nonsense and totally rejected). There is the Anatolian Hypothesis (no longer plausible), the Kurgan (Plausible, maybe still most likely), now an Armenian/Georgian from the Southern Caucuses (Plausible given some DNA evidence).

Now from my point of view, I don't give a "hoot in hell" (to quote George C Scott's Patton speech from the 1970 movie) if it is North of the Caucus Mountains or South of them. Makes no difference to me. However, it does seem a significant number of Northern European ethnic groups do have a significant amount of emotional energy invested along with years of posts on various blogs and genetics forums that the PIE being North of the Caucus Mountains.

 

[Dinaric Superman]

Jovialis

Yes I have a MD, MSc, PhD, and am in expert in the field and understand everything better that Reich.
And who are you exactly ? obviously not smart enough to understand sarcastic bend on a name . So drop the virtue signalling & sit down pal

 

[Dinaric Superman]

Palermo -

Reich publishing is hardly a bid deal, especially given the echo chamber approach within academia. Who is going to hold Reich to accountability when he is the ''expert'' ? Only real people from the real world, not so-called 'academics''.




I can verify all my claims on Reich


(a) Reich's models are false constructs based on coarse-grained genome-wide analysis . They lack basic sanity checks and constraints from uniparental data & archaeology.
This is not even about PIE , this is about his entire approach. He also generated a false narrative about the Neolithic in northern & western Europe based on the same ex oriente Lux model which he blanket applies to all of Europe, instead of limiting it to southern Europe where it would actually be correct. This same for the western steppe - Reich & other academics from the Echo Chamber invent an Asian migration to propel said narrative.
But it's bogus


the qpADM best model for Yamnaya is
Russia_Steppe_Eneolithic ; Russia_Khvalynsk_Eneolithic ; Ukraine_Globular_Amphora
% coefficient 0.604 0.287 0.110


In Turn, Progress (Steppe Enolithic) is CHG + EHG + WSHG


There is no migration from an imaginary ''southern Arc' to the steppe, and certainly nothing to do with PIEs.
The CHG arrived 6000 bc & even earlier, and related to fisher-hunter-gatherers from the Volga.
Majkop was ousted from the region, and are a cultural dead-end & have no relevance to the debate
The entire Asian homeland is based on fudged stats and dubious word-statistics by some ''linguists"' who insist on claiming PIE is 9000 years old


- fudging sample attribution
For ex: Reich and his team presented an entire cohort of Iberian data as "Bell Beaker'', when they have absolutely no association with bell Beaker artefacts. This inturn generated a false narrative which supported the broken ''out of Iberia'' model.
I can provide a detailed breakdown if req.


- political pressures
refer to pp 135-136 in his book. mass migration is ok as long as it comes from outside of Europe & points to consistent turnovers in Europe, esp central Europe.......because Nazis & central Europeans are bad. Rather than sticking to science, Reich is virtue signalling & has taking it upon himself to ride the white horse of political correctness

 

[Palermo Trapani]

Jovialis

And who are you exactly ? a mod in a silo ?
obviously not smart enough to understand sarcastic bend on a name . So drop the virtue signalling & sit down




Yes I have a PhD and understand everything better that Reich

Wow that sounds like a little bit of hubris. I guess I am going to have to pay careful attention to the author affiliations on publications in journals like Nature and Science Advances, etc. to look for Australian Geneticist who know more than Reich.

 

[Dinaric Superman]

Palermo


Yeah, not everyone can be a sicophant, some people can think critically & analyse the data for themselves.
Australians keep it real.

 

[Jovialis]

Jovialis

Yes I have a MD, MSc, PhD, and am in expert in the field and understand everything better that Reich.
And who are you exactly ? obviously not smart enough to understand sarcastic bend on a name . So drop the virtue signalling & sit down pal

Are you sure this isn't the true sarcasm? Where did you get those from, clown college? There's no way in hell an academic would hold your views. Clearly you're a t-roll, first you have a Ph.D. then you have these other degrees after editing your post. You're not very smart at deception, are you? Correction, you are not very smart. Period.


Disrespect for fellow members and moderation has gone on far enough. If you people are going to act like thugs, I am going to hit you with the ban hammer.

 

[Jovialis]

Many of you are already persona non grata interlopers on our website. Keep in mind, anthrogenica is gone, so all you have left is apricity as an alternative if you are booted from here.

 

[Ghani]

Ok dude. Let's take what academics say at face value.

David Anthony in 2019 "PIE originated in EHGs"

David Reich in 2022 "No"

Who am I supposed to believe? These people change their minds every 3 years.

Reich is not an amateur or genome blogger that would assert something on a whim. Like a true scientist he requires big evidence to make big claims. EHG still has a big role in Yamnaya ethnogenesis

Anyways, there will be hundreds of new ancient samples many of them being high coverage. I noticed there’s additional information posted at www.eurasiandna.com

 

[Ghani]

Are you sure this isn't the true sarcasm? Where did you get those from, clown college? There's no way in hell an academic would hold your views. Clearly you're a t-roll, first you have a Ph.D. then you have these other degrees after editing your post. You're not very smart at deception, are you? Correction, you are not very smart. Period.
Disrespect for fellow members and moderation has gone on far enough. If you people are going to act like thugs, I am going to hit you with the ban hammer.

Sadly hobbyists who don’t know better pay attention to nonsensical claims like his even if he has no real evidence to back his position . Also Slandering scientists does not seem to be an issue for people like him

 

[enter_tain]

David Anthony agrees with David Reich, dude. Yes, minds change with new data, that's how science works.


Again, you think the head of the archaeogenetics Department at Harvard would assert such a claim without evidence to back it up? You people are basing your beliefs on already published data, when he has over 700+ new samples we haven't even seen yet. Are you going to discount new and undisputable information when it comes out?


This is what is going to happen, the field will move forward with these new discoveries, and you will ultimately become a hyper-minority.

Except I never disagreed with David Reich, did I? You are having arguments in your head with imaginary people.

All I said, is I don't take what these people say as dogma, as archeogenetics is a new field and there is a lot of trial and error. You turned it into some "high iq" nonsense arguments, without even knowing who the people commenting on it are, how much time they've spent looking at problems, what their educational background is, etc... All it is, is academics = good, everyone else = bad. That's not how reality works.

 

[Frenchguy]

Many of you are already persona non grata interlopers on our website. Keep in mind, anthrogenica is gone, so all you have left is apricity as an alternative if you are booted from here.

Well, the problem with anthrogenica was his stupid moderation, don't act as they did, don't become an anthrogenica bis but with a different agenda. There were many valuables members in here. Hope they don't get restricted to the mike discord where only one agenda is allowed because else you're obviously a troll and where 5 stars self sucking skill is mandatory to express how your theories were spot-on all along even if on 200 theories you made, only 1 was approximately right.

 

[Er Monnezza]

I don't think so, but this is my assumption of their origins:

Maybe I am wrong, but if I am, I am happy to know the truth.

Am I misremembering or did Lazaridis model them as Minoans + Steppe + Anatolia? The results show them entirely as Greece + Steppe.

Target: GRC_Mycenaean
Distance: 0.0139% / 0.01394717 | R5P
43.5 GRC_Minoan_Lassithi:I0070___BC_2050___Coverage_53.10%
29.3 GRC_Koufonisi_Cycladic_EBA:Kou01___BC_2300___Coverage_89.18%
12.9 Bell_Beaker_HUN:I7045___BC_2281___Coverage_65.58%
11.9 KAZ_Taldysay_MLBA2:I4794___BC_1500___Coverage_31.55%
2.4 KEN_Pastoral_N:I8874___BC_1337___Coverage_75.85%

Target: Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2
Distance: 0.0134% / 0.01338843 | R3P
47.5 GRC_Manika_Helladic_EBA:Mik15___BC_2300___Coverage_94.19%
37.7 GRC_Minoan_Lassithi:I0070___BC_2050___Coverage_53.10%
14.8 RUS_Catacomb:RK4001___BC_2288___Coverage_46.84%

Target: Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2
Distance: 0.0110% / 0.01104775 | R4P
30.1 GRC_Manika_Helladic_EBA:Mik15___BC_2300___Coverage_94.19%
30.1 GRC_Minoan_Lassithi:I0070___BC_2050___Coverage_53.10%
25.2 GRC_Minoan_Kephala_Petrasta08___BC_2300___Coverage_97.98%
14.6 RUS_Catacomb:RK4001___BC_2288___Coverage_46.84%

 

[Jovialis]

Well, the problem with anthrogenica was his stupid moderation, don't act as they did, don't become an anthrogenica bis but with a different agenda. There were many valuables members in here. Hope they don't get restricted to the mike discord where only one agenda is allowed because else you're obviously a troll and where 5 stars self sucking skill is mandatory to express how your theories were spot-on all along even if on 200 theories you made, only 1 was approximately right.

That's the ploy now isn't it? Create a bunch of socks that overtly misbehave and try to paint moderators as hypocritical? I think it falls pretty flat when you see what length he had to go to, outright insults.

 

[Jovialis]

One of the two scenarios should them as Minoan + about 15% steppe. That's basically the "Northern model". If I recall, that's the one eurogenes thinks is correct as well. So me and him actually do agree on a key issue. The difference is that he thought the steppe would be much higher in Myceneans. I think it is possible that proto-Greeks were higher in steppe, but it was quickly diluted overtime. Or that it was never a big component on to begin with.

 

[howard23]

This website responds faster than Anthrogenica. Every time I open AG's page, I have to wait for about half a minute. AG seems to be running out of money.

 

[Jovialis]

Except I never disagreed with David Reich, did I? You are having arguments in your head with imaginary people.
All I said, is I don't take what these people say as dogma, as archeogenetics is a new field and there is a lot of trial and error. You turned it into some "high iq" nonsense arguments, without even knowing who the people commenting on it are, how much time they've spent looking at problems, what their educational background is, etc... All it is, is academics = good, everyone else = bad. That's not how reality works.

Obviously I don't think in black and white. Like I said, I came to my theory about minoans before I saw it published in academic papers, by collecting information and collaboration with Maciamo. However, academic papers affirmed the theory. Had overwhelming evidence come out that said otherwise, the theory would be untenable. Hobbyists are indeed valuable, but they do not trump academic consensus by the leading authorities.

 

[matadworf]

One of the two scenarios should them as Minoan + about 15% steppe. That's basically the "Northern model". If I recall, that's the one eurogenes thinks is correct as well. So me and him actually do agree on a key issue. The difference is that he thought the steppe would be much higher in Myceneans. I think it is possible that proto-Greeks were higher in steppe, but it was quickly diluted overtime. Or that it was never a big component on to begin with.

Realize those Helladic samples had higher Steppe particularly the ones from Northeast Greece where there was close proximity to Balkan Bronze age populations. I actually plot really close to one of the Logkas samples (55-33 EEF/IE minor CHG) as would most modern mainlanders (for different reasons) so possibly the Steppe element may not have made it that far South during the Bronze Age. It would make more sense to me (novice op) that the proto Greeks (Pelasgians or whatever) who were most likely centered in the more remote areas of the Peloponnese were harboring high EEF (leftover from the Neolithic).