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Thread: Most WHG guy ever?

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    Most WHG guy ever?

    I don't know if this the appropriate subsection for this.

    This Sardinian fellow strikes me alot for being atypical. But he carries traits you'd might consider to be neither Anatolian Neolithic or Steppe but might consider natively "European" but more so on the radical side like Udmurts and Sardinians. Relatively darkskin, light eyes, and "Cro-Magnon" features.

    j1jpTCB.jpgolh8Ong.jpg4GnBch4.jpg
    Who knows he might be a WHG survivor. How much WHG would he be?



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    I have a cousin like this. Looks straight up whg.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    I don't know if this the appropriate subsection for this.
    This Sardinian fellow strikes me alot for being atypical. But he carries traits you'd might consider to be neither Anatolian Neolithic or Steppe but might consider natively "European" but more so on the radical side like Udmurts and Sardinians. Relatively darkskin, light eyes, and "Cro-Magnon" features.
    j1jpTCB.jpgolh8Ong.jpg4GnBch4.jpg
    Who knows he might be a WHG survivor. How much WHG would he be?
    I think he is some kind of E
    Jeremey meeks vibe
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Meeks
    ancestery :
    mostly western jewish here is the overlapp with south europe[U]

    "Know where you came from and where you are going."

    Direct paternal line : mizrahi from damascus

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    I think he is some kind of E
    Jeremey meeks vibe
    Perhaps, but he could also be C if not I, the most likely (for Sardinia) and if not more evidence that ydna is not solely responsible for phenotype.
    Yes, I can see the similarities. Lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    I don't know if this the appropriate subsection for this.

    This Sardinian fellow strikes me alot for being atypical. But he carries traits you'd might consider to be neither Anatolian Neolithic or Steppe but might consider natively "European" but more so on the radical side like Udmurts and Sardinians. Relatively darkskin, light eyes, and "Cro-Magnon" features.

    j1jpTCB.jpgolh8Ong.jpg4GnBch4.jpg
    Who knows he might be a WHG survivor. How much WHG would he be?


    I see you have not too much clues about what could pass for 'cromagnon'-like! Too narrow jaw, too thick lips.
    Sure, he isn't typical for a typical 'mediter' of any sort or for a 'steppic'mix; for 'anatolian-mediter' It's not too evident and we lack the top part of his head to juge acutely. That said, he surely has some heritage of one kind of WHG in his traits.

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    Do we have whg skulls to know they were very cromagnid like? It was always the assumption but I wqnna know if it reigns true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    I see you have not too much clues about what could pass for 'cromagnon'-like! Too narrow jaw, too thick lips.
    Sure, he isn't typical for a typical 'mediter' of any sort or for a 'steppic'mix; for 'anatolian-mediter' It's not too evident and we lack the top part of his head to juge acutely. That said, he surely has some heritage of one kind of WHG in his traits.
    "Cro-Magnon" in my opinion is anything archaic-like. Besides, I'm not too convinced(or at the most speculative of it) in the whole label. Also, "narrow jaw"? You are serious? Anyways, what is that "one kind of WHG"?

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    "Cro-Magnon" in my opinion is anything archaic-like. Besides, I'm not too convinced(or at the most speculative of it) in the whole label. Also, "narrow jaw"? You are serious? Anyways, what is that "one kind of WHG"?

    "too narrow jaw"? YES! and too narrow face as a whole, if you refer to some 'cromagnon-like' (well defined type, and not a vaguely chronologic step in Human evolution: it's always the same question of labelling).
    We have diverse WHG of Mesolithical times and this place them very later than the 'croma' patterns. So I use the term of "...-like" and not "..." to mark this reality. They were variable in features, but the most often two (or even three) types seems emerging:
    - a 'cromagnon-like' one (subdolichocephalic skull, low linear profile of skull measured to the ears holes, "evolved" frontal, short an broad face with broad inferior jaw, rather projecting chin.
    - a 'brünn-like' one (dolichocephalic skull, rather high arched profile of skull, very brutal receding frontal, stronger browridges, longer face with broad cheebones BUT rather narrow inferior jaw. Almost the contrary to 'croma'.
    - a for very close to 'brünn', but with higher faced, with the same tendencies concerning the contraste between cheekbones and lower jaw; someones called it 'capelloid' on the model of 'Combe-Capelle' man (more recent than both types above, and considered by others as a more recent variant of 'brünn' types);
    At mesolithic intermediary forms were common, and statures were become very variable from a group to another with some kind of irregular gradiant between SW (shortest) and NE (highest). In the Iron Gate at Mesolithic the HG's people presented the two former types, the input of every type being stronger or weaker according to groups, all this before the crossings with EEF of Anatolian origin.
    Concerning the Sardinian posted here, I wrote he had some input of these WHG types but in a slight way only; but he cannot be taken as a model for 'croma' in the sensu strictu, concerning face.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    I don't know if this the appropriate subsection for this.

    This Sardinian fellow strikes me alot for being atypical. But he carries traits you'd might consider to be neither Anatolian Neolithic or Steppe but might consider natively "European" but more so on the radical side like Udmurts and Sardinians. Relatively darkskin, light eyes, and "Cro-Magnon" features.

    j1jpTCB.jpgolh8Ong.jpg4GnBch4.jpg
    Who knows he might be a WHG survivor. How much WHG would he be?


    Don't get distracted or even hypnotised by those blue eyes... His bone structure looks quite steppe or Asian influenced.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    "Cro-Magnon" in my opinion is anything archaic-like. Besides, I'm not too convinced(or at the most speculative of it) in the whole label. Also, "narrow jaw"? You are serious? Anyways, what is that "one kind of WHG"?
    Amazing how in four very short sentences you reveal that you know nothing of physical anthropology. So why express opinions about it?


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    he definitely could be a model
    but as a representive of whg face no i dont think so sorry :)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rico33 View Post
    Don't get distracted or even hypnotised by those blue eyes... His bone structure looks quite steppe or Asian influenced.
    Really? You don't say.

    You mean like him?

    Steppe men-Corded Ware.PNG

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rico33 View Post
    Don't get distracted or even hypnotised by those blue eyes... His bone structure looks quite steppe or Asian influenced.
    Baloney. Sardinia has litterally next to no steppe admixture, and.. asian admixture? Haha. Delusional.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Amazing how in four very short sentences you reveal that you know nothing of physical anthropology. So why express opinions about it?
    Whatevs, physical anthropology is not science anyways and I didn't say I was an expert. Also, this is just a question. You can answer it or not. I'm just looking at his phenotype and what I depict would be some hypothetical cm traits, just my opinion.

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    Can anyone explain why he looks the way he does then? Why is he so atypical?

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    Baloney. Sardinia has litterally next to no steppe admixture, and.. asian admixture? Haha. Delusional.
    You just said he looks atypical.
    Make up your mind.
    I asume the more typical Sardinians do no have those features. His bone structure looks Central European.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Really? You don't say.

    You mean like him?

    Steppe men-Corded Ware.PNG
    I don't see (much) influence of the Asian steppes here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rico33 View Post
    Don't get distracted or even hypnotised by those blue eyes... His bone structure looks quite steppe or Asian influenced.
    'steppe': what sort? 'Asian'??? what meaning, indeed?!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    Whatevs, physical anthropology is not science anyways and I didn't say I was an expert. Also, this is just a question. You can answer it or not. I'm just looking at his phenotype and what I depict would be some hypothetical cm traits, just my opinion.
    Physical anthropology is not a hard science, OK., but is still some kind of science trying to link some phoenotypes to some human groups or to evaluate the proximity of these groups based on their respective distribution; (in fact this is typology as opposed to metrics which works more on means and whose results can be very weird sometimes if not helped by a taste of typology). Phoenotypes depends on genetical traits for the most, besides mesologic influences, spite the difficulty is that it is not easy to link these traits to specific genes or loci and to evaluate global autosomal proximity based only on these external traits which can drive very quickly in small pop's or under strong survival pressure so selection.

    That said you 're legid to say what you think, and yes, this man's face is not typical of the diverse classical 'mediter' types. But a pure "WHG" face of any sort?. I doubt. No offense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rico33 View Post
    I don't see (much) influence of the Asian steppes here.
    Nevertheless it was the kind of face (bones) that was the more often found among the first Corded Ware. A maybe a more northern selected kit of features among Steppics who were a bit more massive and broad faced as a whole, and more variated concerning facial look, if I read well.
    Currently the input of this "type" or of the principal features attached to this "type" is still visible among Scandinavian pop's and at a lesser level in other pop's of Germanic or even Slavic, Baltic, Finnic origin, spite not typical of the most of these last pop's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    'steppe': what sort? 'Asian'??? what meaning, indeed?!?
    His eyes are relatively almond shaped, his cheekbones. I don't think this is a good example of WHG at all, his bone structure is way off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saraman View Post
    Can anyone explain why he looks the way he does then? Why is he so atypical?
    Because phenotype is complex relative to genetic footprint. There is never a certain correlation between someones genetic profile and how the traits they inherit that makes them look the way they are. Even in the most homogenis populations (especially in south europe), ie. Portuguese, you'll find many different types of looks with people with the same genetic footprints. To pull this point further, im sure people can agree... in families alone (at least southern europeans) have a complexity of looks. In my own I have blue eyed, blonde haired germanic looking people, then you got atlantid-looking portuguese, mediterranid looking, and then even middle-eastern, north african looking, all in the same family.

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    The typical portuguese look like you
    Atlantid ? ( not anthropology expert)
    Just asking because soon when i will visit
    Portugal the place i would be is porto
    It is more in the north of portugal no ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Luso View Post
    Because phenotype is complex relative to genetic footprint. There is never a certain correlation between someones genetic profile and how the traits they inherit that makes them look the way they are. Even in the most homogenis populations (especially in south europe), ie. Portuguese, you'll find many different types of looks with people with the same genetic footprints. To pull this point further, im sure people can agree... in families alone (at least southern europeans) have a complexity of looks. In my own I have blue eyed, blonde haired germanic looking people, then you got atlantid-looking portuguese, mediterranid looking, and then even middle-eastern, north african looking, all in the same family.
    I don't think that quite answers it. Those populations (ie portuguese) have Steppe ancestry relative to NF ancestry. That being said what's the fellow's who looks like neither compared relatively to his NF ancestry? Not steppe that's for sure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    Nevertheless it was the kind of face (bones) that was the more often found among the first Corded Ware. A maybe a more northern selected kit of features among Steppics who were a bit more massive and broad faced as a whole, and more variated concerning facial look, if I read well.
    Currently the input of this "type" or of the principal features attached to this "type" is still visible among Scandinavian pop's and at a lesser level in other pop's of Germanic or even Slavic, Baltic, Finnic origin, spite not typical of the most of these last pop's.
    I take you consider some of his features are present in these populations? That's what I thought too. I've even seen some in the British Isles like Ireland and Spain.

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