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Thread: Neolithic mtdna from Greece

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    Regular Member kingjohn's Avatar
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    Neolithic mtdna from Greece

    Ancient mitochondrial diversity reveals population homogeneity in Neolithic Greece and identifies population dynamics along the Danubian expansion axis

    Abstract

    The aim of the study is to investigate mitochondrial diversity in Neolithic Greece and its relation to hunter-gatherers and farmers who populated the Danubian Neolithic expansion axis. We sequenced 42 mitochondrial palaeogenomes from Greece and analysed them together with European set of 328 mtDNA sequences dating from the Early to the Final Neolithic and 319 modern sequences. To test for population continuity through time in Greece, we use an original structured population continuity test that simulates DNA from different periods by explicitly considering the spatial and temporal dynamics of populations. We explore specific scenarios of the mode and tempo of the European Neolithic expansion along the Danubian axis applying spatially explicit simulations coupled with Approximate Bayesian Computation. We observe a striking genetic homogeneity for the maternal line throughout the Neolithic in Greece whereas population continuity is rejected between the Neolithic and present-day Greeks. Along the Danubian expansion axis, our best-fitting scenario supports a substantial decrease in mobility and an increasing local hunter-gatherer contribution to the gene-pool of farmers following the initial rapid Neolithic expansion. Οur original simulation approach models key demographic parameters rather than inferring them from fragmentary data leading to a better understanding of this important process in European prehistory.



    SOURCE:



    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-022-16745-8






    ancestery :
    mostly western jewish here is the overlapp with south europe[U]

    "Know where you came from and where you are going."

    Direct paternal line : mizrahi from damascus

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    1 members found this post helpful.
    Thanks for sharing, but I think it is likely they came from Central Anatolia, considering Greece_N has autosomal DNA from Anatolian_N plus a bit of CHG.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jovialis View Post
    Thanks for sharing, but I think it is likely they came from Central Anatolia, considering Greece_N has autosomal DNA from Anatolian_N plus a bit of CHG.



    (a) Haplogroup frequency at different Neolithic periods in Greece. (b) Haplogroup frequency at different Neolithic sites in Greece (EN: Early Neolithic n = 13, MN: Middle Neolithic, n = 5, LN: Late Neolithic n = 13, FN: Final Neolithic n = 11).






    red is early neolithic farmers
    blue is middle to late/ final neolithic farmers



    here are the mtdna types that been found:
    Rev 4- Revenia-Katerini,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- H
    Rev 6- Revenia-Katerini,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- H46

    Mau 1-Mavropigi,Filotsairi- Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- H5
    Mau 2-Mavropigi,Filotsairi- Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- T2b23
    Mau 4-Mavropigi,Filotsairi- Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- H46
    Mau 5-Mavropigi,Filotsairi- Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- T2f

    Xir 1-Xirolimni-Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- T2c1d1
    Xir 2-Xirolimni-Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- T1a5
    Xir 4a -Xirolimni-Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- K1a1
    Xir 5 -Xirolimni-Kozani,Macedonia-Early Neolithic- K1a24

    Nea 1-Nea Nikomideia-Imathia Macedonia-Early Neolithic-K1a4b
    Nea 4 -Nea Nikomideia-Imathia Macedonia-Early Neolithic-H
    Nea 5 -Nea Nikomideia-Imathia Macedonia-Early Neolithic-H

    NS 1-Makri-Alexandroupolis,Tharce- Middle Neolithic-H1
    NS 2-Makri-Alexandroupolis,Tharce- Middle Neolithic-J1c7

    St 2-Stavroupoli- Thessaloniki Macedonia- Middle Neolithic-N1a1a1a3
    St 3-Stavroupoli- Thessaloniki Macedonia- Middle Neolithic-K1a
    St 5-Stavroupoli- Thessaloniki Macedonia- Middle Neolithic-H

    Krk 1-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-K1a1
    Krk 2-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-H
    Krk 4-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-U8b1a1

    Krk 7-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-K1a3a3
    Krk 8-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-N1a1a1a
    Krk 9-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-H
    Krk 10-Toumba Kremastis Koiladas- Kozani Macedonia-Late Neolithic-K1a4a1

    Mkg 9-Makriyalos-Katerini Macedonia-Late Neolithic-T2b
    Mkg 10-Makriyalos-Katerini Macedonia-Late Neolithic-J1c3j
    Mkg 11-Makriyalos-Katerini Macedonia-Late Neolithic-K1a
    Mkg 12-Makriyalos-Katerini Macedonia-Late Neolithic-U7b
    Mkg 13-Makriyalos-Katerini Macedonia-Late Neolithic- K1a

    Fra 8-Franchthi Cave- Argolis Peloponnese-Late Neolithic-U3b3

    Pal 1-Paliambela Kolindrou- Katerini Macedonia-Final Neolithic-U4b3
    Pal 2-Paliambela Kolindrou- Katerini Macedonia-Final Neolithic-K1a7
    Pal 6-Paliambela Kolindrou- Katerini Macedonia-Final Neolithic-K1a7

    Klei 4-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-K1a4a1
    Klei 2-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-J1c1
    Klei 9-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-K1a4

    Klei 5-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-HV
    Klei 6-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-H29

    Klei 7-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-H29
    Klei 8-Kleitos- Kozani Macedonia-Final Neolithic-J1c2

    Tha 2- Tharrounia-Euboea island-Late/Final Neolithic-H5


    Last edited by kingjohn; 05-08-22 at 20:28.

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    4 members found this post helpful.
    Code:
    Greece_N:Klei10:Hofmanova_2016,0,0,2.1,0.17,46.06,0,0,0,14.18,0,35.73,1.76
    Greece_N:Pal7:Hofmanova_2016,0,0,4.41,0.01,47.42,0,0,0,13.07,0.67,32.97,1.44
    Greece_N:Rev5:Hofmanova_2016,0,0,4.74,0,48.42,0,0,0,12.15,0.13,33.21,1.35
    Greece_N:I2937:Lazaridis_2017,0,0,2.55,1.31,44.77,0,0,0,12.74,0,36.69,1.95
    Greece_N:I5427:Mathieson_2018,0,0,2.49,0,48.75,0,0,0,14.27,0,33.81,0.67
    Greece_N:I2318:Mathieson_2018,0,0,3.07,0,44.19,0,0,0,13.34,0,39.27,0.13
    Greece_N:I3708:Mathieson_2018,0,0.11,4.14,0,44.52,0,0,0.08,15.81,0,35.15,0.18
    Greece_N:I3709:Mathieson_2018,0,0,2.84,0.05,41.04,0,0,0,13.53,0,41.5,1.04
    Greece_N:I3920:Mathieson_2018,0.45,0,4.53,0.27,35.93,1.27,0,0,15.22,0,41.57,0.76
    Here are the samples we have processed thus far.

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    Since I am U7 myself, I am particularly interested in the „Mkg 12-Makriyalos-Katerini Macedonia-Late Neolithic-U7b“ sample. This lineage is without doubt a CHG/Iran derived haplogroup.

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    I'll have to read the paper, but I don't see how they conclude there's no continuity in mtdna if they're going by that graphic. T took a hit, it's true, and the J1 mtdna came in with later movements from Anatolia probably, and yes, a bit of U was added with incorporation of hg females, but there's still an awful lot of continuity from how it looks to me.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    I'll have to read the paper, but I don't see how they conclude there's no continuity in mtdna if they're going by that graphic. T took a hit, it's true, and the J1 mtdna came in with later movements from Anatolia probably, and yes, a bit of U was added with incorporation of hg females, but there's still an awful lot of continuity from how it looks to me.
    i am not a big fan of autosomal anlaysis
    but in order to understand the process we have to look at the late/ final neolithic genomes
    to see if there are influences from the east autosomaly speaking which the early neolithic samples from greece lack

    in the middle of the page there is this :
    The accession number for the bam files of the ancient mtDNA genomes reported in study is European Nucleotide Archive: PRJEB52148

    https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/PRJEB52148

    unfortantley i don't see the genomes bam yet
    that is what i see at the moment that might change in the future
    No records were found for PRJEB52148.



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    To me autosomal analysis is paramount because it constitutes 98% of your DNA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    i am not a big fan of autosomal anlaysis
    but in order to understand the process we have to look at the late/ final neolithic genomes
    to see if there are influences from the east autosomaly speaking which the early neolithic samples from greece lack

    in the middle of the page there is this :
    The accession number for the bam files of the ancient mtDNA genomes reported in study is European Nucleotide Archive: PRJEB52148

    https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/PRJEB52148

    unfortantley i don't see the genomes bam yet
    that is what i see at the moment that might change in the future
    No records were found for PRJEB52148.


    Do you mean to say that there is mtDna from the steppe? That seems possible given the "U" which shows up. I don't see how that means there's no continuity in mtDna.

    Let's assume a situation in which 30% of the uniparentals in an area, or the autosomal dna in an area change with a migration. Does that mean there's no "continuity"? What is the magic percentage which indicates no continuity?

    More importantly, do they give a percentage in the paper as to what percentage of the original mtDna was "replaced"?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela View Post
    Do you mean to say that there is mtDna from the steppe? That seems possible given the "U" which shows up. I don't see how that means there's no continuity in mtDna.

    Let's assume a situation in which 30% of the uniparentals in an area, or the autosomal dna in an area change with a migration. Does that mean there's no "continuity"? What is the magic percentage which indicates no continuity?

    More importantly, do they give a percentage in the paper as to what percentage of the original mtDna was "replaced"?

    honestly i also don't understand why the paper claim there is no continuity in the mtdna
    types from neolithic greek remains to present day modern greeks

    We observe a striking genetic homogeneity for the maternal line throughout the Neolithic in Greece whereas population continuity is rejected between the Neolithic and present-day Greeks
    Last edited by kingjohn; 06-08-22 at 15:50.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    honestly i also don't understand why the paper claim there is no continuity in the mtdna
    types from neolithic greek remains to present day modern greeks

    We observe a striking genetic homogeneity for the maternal line throughout the Neolithic in Greece whereas population continuity is rejected between the Neolithic and present-day Greeks
    My background is Peloponnesian Greek and my maternal line is U3a3a and from what I’ve learned (recently) is that my maternal grandmother’s village was settled by one of the Slavic tribes in the Peloponnese (always believed it was Tsakonian but recently learned otherwise) haven’t done a deep dive but that the mtdna line is more closely associated with Caucasus folks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matadworf View Post
    My background is Peloponnesian Greek and my maternal line is U3a3a and from what I’ve learned (recently) is that my maternal grandmother’s village was settled by one of the Slavic tribes in the Peloponnese (always believed it was Tsakonian but recently learned otherwise) haven’t done a deep dive but that the mtdna line is more closely associated with Caucasus folks.
    Well, being from the Caucasus could mean it went onto the steppe and then into Greece from the north, or it could mean it came into Greece from the east with the pulse of Iran Neo like ancestry.

    You'd have to do more research into it, imo

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