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Thread: The Blood Groups of the Yamnaya

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    The Blood Groups of the Yamnaya

    According to Mathieson, 40% of the Steppe was Rh(D) negative.
    I have yet to see how he came up with such data.
    I am not necessarily disagreeing with it as it would make sense, but am interested if anyone here can help enlighten me in terms of how he came to such conclusion.
    Thank you in advance.

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    Well, 1 way would be that the places that have the most Steppe because they were isolated from further invasions(particularly Roman), are the Basque Country and the Scottish Highlands.

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    Quote Originally Posted by firetown View Post
    According to Mathieson, 40% of the Steppe was Rh(D) negative.
    I have yet to see how he came up with such data.
    I am not necessarily disagreeing with it as it would make sense, but am interested if anyone here can help enlighten me in terms of how he came to such conclusion.
    Thank you in advance.
    Have you noticed Yamnaya remains are found coincidentally by extremely old earlier human/Neaderthal sites and migration route/remains? Neaderthals migrated (East from Europe) to the Altai a very long time ago 100k-400K+/- years ago. What took Neaderthal perhaps thousands or 10 tens of thousands of years, Yamnaya achieved quickly, with the use of oxen/(and or horse-Dom2?)and wagons.





    A/B/AB/O rh- Blood types pre-Yamnaya migration in Neaderthals-
    Steppe Altai(Afanasievo)Chagyrskya (130-90k+/- YBP) blood type phenotype A --partial-Rhce.
    Vindija phenotype B partial Rhce(Yamnaya- Vucedol region)
    Mezmaiskaya Cave in the Caucasus
    Shanidar 1 (Yamnaya Hajji Firuzz)



    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0254175

    Blood groups of Neandertals and Denisova decrypted


    Thus, a Neanderthal mother with partial RhD, Rhc, and Rhe phenotypes and sometimes RH:-18, carrying a Denisovan foetus expressing complete forms of RhD, Rhc and Rhe antigens and expressing the RH18 antigen, would have been prone to be immune to missing epitopes and synthesize anti-RhD, anti-Rhc, anti-Rhe and even anti-RH18 antibodies. These antibodies are known to have an important clinical significance in terms of HDFN [32]. These elements could have contributed to weakening the descendants to the point of leading to their demise especially combined with the competition with Homo sapiens for the same ecological niche......An additional contribution is the reduced variability of many alleles and the possible presence of haemolytic disease of the foetus and new-born, which reinforces the notion of high inbreeding, weak demography and endangered reproductive success of the late Neanderthals, giving to our species the great opportunity to spread throughout the world.
    In ABO hemolytic disease of the newborn (also known as ABO HDN) maternal IgG antibodies with specificity for the ABO blood group system pass through the placenta to the fetal circulation where they can cause hemolysis of fetal red blood cells which can lead to fetal anemia and HDN. In contrast to Rh disease, about half of the cases of ABO HDN occur in a firstborn baby and ABO HDN does not become more severe after further pregnancies.

    Suum cuique-ancient ochre elite burial cultures in Seredny Stih phase II, Yamnaya
    - ochre burials with wagons, copper cudgel ,tanged daggers,iron-powder, beads, iron tools -weapons. Turganik Dom2 -horses; horse head shaped scepters, Kernosovkiy idol horse .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mmiikkii View Post
    Well, 1 way would be that the places that have the most Steppe because they were isolated from further invasions(particularly Roman), are the Basque Country and the Scottish Highlands.
    Follow-up question: What were the Basque's Rh- frequencies before the Yamnaya invasions?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silesian View Post
    Have you noticed Yamnaya remains are found coincidentally by extremely old earlier human/Neaderthal sites and migration route/remains? Neaderthals migrated (East from Europe) to the Altai a very long time ago 100k-400K+/- years ago. What took Neaderthal perhaps thousands or 10 tens of thousands of years, Yamnaya achieved quickly, with the use of oxen/(and or horse-Dom2?)and wagons.





    A/B/AB/O rh- Blood types pre-Yamnaya migration in Neaderthals-
    Steppe Altai(Afanasievo)Chagyrskya (130-90k+/- YBP) blood type phenotype A --partial-Rhce.
    Vindija phenotype B partial Rhce(Yamnaya- Vucedol region)
    Mezmaiskaya Cave in the Caucasus
    Shanidar 1 (Yamnaya Hajji Firuzz)



    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0254175

    Blood groups of Neandertals and Denisova decrypted
    Many years ago I saw a chart of populations highest in Neanderthal DNA and remember Basques and Berbers being among the top 5.

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    Quote Originally Posted by firetown View Post
    Follow-up question: What were the Basque's Rh- frequencies before the Yamnaya invasions?
    The highlanders and Basques don't share that much in common except more or less isolations since several millenia.

    So I guess as long we don't get D antigen studies on ancient samples we have to think is because of Yamnaya.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mmiikkii View Post
    The highlanders and Basques don't share that much in common except more or less isolations since several millenia.

    So I guess as long we don't get D antigen studies on ancient samples we have to think is because of Yamnaya.
    From one of A.E. Mourant's papers:
    We were interested in discovering where Rh-negative may have originated. We therefore drew up a “weather-map” of the genic distribution of Rhnegative. The resulting isogenic map led us to conclude that Rh-negative originated in Southwestern France. We conjectured the period at about 50,000 years, and the population probably a Neanderthaloid-like (!) one.


    THE BLOOD GROUPS OF FHE PEOPLES OF THE MEDITERRANEAN AREA by A.E. MOURANT

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    It is also important to note that Neanderthal remains have been located in the underwater region of what was once Doggerland.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silesian View Post
    Have you noticed Yamnaya remains are found coincidentally by extremely old earlier human/Neaderthal sites and migration route/remains? Neaderthals migrated (East from Europe) to the Altai a very long time ago 100k-400K+/- years ago. What took Neaderthal perhaps thousands or 10 tens of thousands of years, Yamnaya achieved quickly, with the use of oxen/(and or horse-Dom2?)and wagons.





    A/B/AB/O rh- Blood types pre-Yamnaya migration in Neaderthals-
    Steppe Altai(Afanasievo)Chagyrskya (130-90k+/- YBP) blood type phenotype A --partial-Rhce.
    Vindija phenotype B partial Rhce(Yamnaya- Vucedol region)
    Mezmaiskaya Cave in the Caucasus
    Shanidar 1 (Yamnaya Hajji Firuzz)



    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0254175

    Blood groups of Neandertals and Denisova decrypted
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/art...ort=objectonly

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    Thinking twice about this.
    There's the possibility that Rh- is a trait native to Europe that survived in isolated places.

    Maybe dating back to the Megalithic/Mesolithic cultures.

    Haplogroup I of Megalithic (previously from Mesolithic Natives) made a resurgence in Spain and Britain.
    So it's possible that Rh- is a WHG trait that got diluted with incoming conquests...

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    New info coming up...
    Last edited by firetown; 11-09-22 at 08:10.

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    Meanwhile here is a random question: Is it possible that red hair in modern humans stems from Neanderthals?

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    Maybe, I am convinced that Europeans are the best representations of the original Culturally Modern Humo Sapiens. Those who expanded all over the world about 50,000 years ago.

    Basically because we know Asians are mixed with the population of haplogroup M, and Africans are the result of populations from before that.

    So, I don't know if Neanderthals, but maybe 'Cro-Magnon'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mmiikkii View Post
    Maybe, I am convinced that Europeans are the best representations of the original Culturally Modern Humo Sapiens. Those who expanded all over the world about 50,000 years ago.

    Basically because we know Asians are mixed with the population of haplogroup M, and Africans are the result of populations from before that.

    So, I don't know if Neanderthals, but maybe 'Cro-Magnon'.
    I have a strong issue with the term Cro-Magnon as a box. What exactly was their genetic make-up? I avoid mentioning them because of that.

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