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That sample is Hellenistic era and Mycenaean/Empuries-like, from the Biomuse project PCA. Most of those are similar, post-Mycenean ancient Greeks plotting with or near Mycenaeans. But because the samples are so few, we don’t know where variations exist, or a fuller haplogroup picture. What happened between North Macedonia and Thessaloniki area, a big change in ancestry, or blending?
^^ Change my mind
Distance to: | BGR_KapitanAndreevo_IA:I20186 |
---|---|
0.02919304 | Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2 |
0.03321198 | HUN_MA_Szolad_o1 |
0.03739661 | BGR_IA |
0.04064316 | GRC_Mycenaean |
0.04098704 | ITA_Sicily_LBA |
0.04747289 | DEU_MA_Baiuvaric_o |
0.04823040 | GRC_Koufonisi_Cycladic_EBA |
0.04926681 | ITA_Tarquinia_Imperial |
0.04969857 | ITA_Sicily_MBA |
0.04984308 | BGR_Varna_C |
0.05091011 | BGR_Middle_C |
0.05110997 | ITA_Sardinia_MA |
0.05133185 | HUN_Avar_Early_Kövegy |
0.05171843 | GRC_Minoan_Kephala_Petras |
0.05175676 | GRC_Manika_Helladic_EBA |
0.05241295 | ITA_Prenestini_tribe_IA_o |
0.05252493 | BGR_Krepost_N |
0.05271176 | MDA_Trypillia_Late |
0.05319362 | ITA_Sicily_EBA |
0.05342384 | ITA_Sardinia_IA |
0.05512894 | BGR_C |
0.05561674 | Italian_Apulia |
0.05606614 | GRC_Minoan_Lassithi |
0.05628714 | BGR_Late_C |
0.05672511 | ITA_Chiusi_EMA |
Distance to: | BGR_KapitanAndreevo_IA:I20185 |
---|---|
0.03360491 | BGR_IA |
0.03574293 | HUN_MA_Szolad_o1 |
0.03767019 | Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2 |
0.03913558 | GRC_Mycenaean |
0.04140636 | ITA_Sicily_LBA |
0.04195656 | MDA_Trypillia_Late |
0.04374654 | BGR_Varna_C |
0.04532439 | HUN_Avar_Early_Kövegy |
0.04581081 | ITA_Sardinia_IA |
0.04624949 | DEU_MA_Baiuvaric_o |
0.04668514 | ITA_Sicily_MBA |
0.04684505 | HUN_IA_La_Tene_oEast |
0.04733391 | ITA_Sicily_EBA |
0.04808000 | BGR_EBA |
0.04893819 | ITA_Prenestini_tribe_IA_o |
0.04930457 | BGR_Late_C |
0.05074768 | BGR_Krepost_N |
0.05126565 | GRC_Koufonisi_Cycladic_EBA |
0.05163663 | BGR_Middle_C |
0.05313661 | HRV_Pop_CA |
0.05363485 | HUN_BA |
0.05418317 | ITA_Sardinia_MA |
0.05432798 | ITA_Tarquinia_Imperial |
0.05478901 | BGR_C |
0.05522570 | BGR_Dzhulyunitsa_N |
Distance to: | BGR_KapitanAndreevo_IA:I20183 |
---|---|
0.03507599 | HUN_IA_La_Tene_oEast |
0.03648193 | HUN_Avar_Early_Kövegy |
0.03649306 | BGR_IA |
0.03714837 | MDA_Trypillia_Late |
0.04128025 | BGR_EBA |
0.04137300 | ITA_Prenestini_tribe_IA_o |
0.04359175 | ITA_Sardinia_IA |
0.04503083 | GRC_Mycenaean |
0.04550480 | HRV_Pop_CA |
0.04567942 | ITA_Daunian |
0.04797340 | French_Corsica |
0.04893808 | ITA_Sicily_EBA |
0.05040804 | ITA_Rome_Late_Antiquity |
0.05106324 | Italian_Lazio |
0.05132098 | Italian_Umbria |
0.05160977 | Greek_Laconia |
0.05172526 | Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2 |
0.05174065 | HUN_MA_Szolad_o1 |
0.05229898 | BGR_Varna_C |
0.05237747 | DEU_MA_Baiuvaric_o |
0.05258223 | HUN_BA |
0.05361955 | ITA_PoggioPelliccia_EMA |
0.05381868 | ITA_Tivoli_Renaissance |
0.05400970 | Italian_Tuscany |
0.05478629 | Italian_Abruzzo |
Distance to: | BGR_KapitanAndreevo_IA:I20181 |
---|---|
0.03155147 | HUN_Avar_Early_Kövegy |
0.03778236 | BGR_IA |
0.04047889 | HUN_IA_La_Tene_oEast |
0.04486662 | MDA_Trypillia_Late |
0.04511422 | ITA_Prenestini_tribe_IA_o |
0.04640284 | GRC_Mycenaean |
0.04691150 | ITA_Sardinia_IA |
0.04824241 | BGR_EBA |
0.04953981 | HRV_Pop_CA |
0.05262849 | French_Corsica |
0.05351423 | ITA_Rome_Late_Antiquity |
0.05396685 | Italian_Umbria |
0.05452510 | ITA_PoggioPelliccia_EMA |
0.05538621 | ITA_Tivoli_Renaissance |
0.05544245 | Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2 |
0.05590677 | Italian_Tuscany |
0.05609569 | ITA_Sicily_EBA |
0.05645051 | ITA_Daunian |
0.05694337 | Italian_Lazio |
0.05728048 | HUN_BA |
0.05750660 | HUN_MA_Szolad_o1 |
0.05754695 | Greek_Laconia |
0.05765370 | ITA_Etruscan_Chiusi |
0.05818917 | Italian_Molise |
0.05828980 | Greek_Izmir |
Distance to: | BGR_KapitanAndreevo_IA:I20180 |
---|---|
0.03141407 | Iberia_Northeast_Empuries2 |
0.03261722 | HUN_MA_Szolad_o1 |
0.03558394 | ITA_Sicily_LBA |
0.04000906 | BGR_IA |
0.04504348 | DEU_MA_Baiuvaric_o |
0.04573734 | BGR_Middle_C |
0.04626449 | GRC_Mycenaean |
0.04749242 | ITA_Sardinia_MA |
0.04869590 | ITA_Sicily_MBA |
0.04997527 | GRC_Manika_Helladic_EBA |
0.05087199 | BGR_Varna_C |
0.05137518 | GRC_Minoan_Kephala_Petras |
0.05176423 | GRC_Koufonisi_Cycladic_EBA |
0.05217211 | BGR_C |
0.05297395 | MDA_Trypillia_Late |
0.05346343 | ITA_Tarquinia_Imperial |
0.05351074 | ITA_Sardinia_IA |
0.05360915 | ITA_Sicily_EBA |
0.05503839 | ITA_Prenestini_tribe_IA_o |
0.05560631 | BGR_Late_C |
0.05595434 | ITA_Sardinia_Roman_Imperial |
0.05615882 | HUN_Avar_Early_Kövegy |
0.05702864 | BGR_EBA |
0.05765723 | Italian_Apulia |
0.05806300 | Italian_Lazio |
1 E-V13 in an Ancient Macedonian site. Every single Thracian or Thracian-related sites are bearing E-V13, that's a no-brainer. Riverman's systematic approach and theory needs recognition.
As for entertain, his E-V13 bias and hatred screams from his screen lmao. It's out of control.
The Enchelei cremated their deaths on a pyre on a low-mound/tumuli like the Channeled-Ware, i doubt those samples are Enchelei. They must be some Matt-Painted Pottery descendands.
There was no one “Greek” language during Alexander’s reign. Koine hadn’t developed yet, we were still in the era of Attic/Ionian, Doric, Aeolian etc. Pittacus was an aeolian speaker and according to Plato, gave Prodicus (Attic speaker) a hard time with his dialect to the point of calling Pittacus a barbarian. I don’t hear anyone doubting that Aeolians were Greek speakers. The same happens today. I am a native Greek speaker, exposed to northern modern Greek dialects (both my maternal grandparents spoke one) and yet I do not fully understand Kozanitika (a divergent nothern idiom). I need them to speak slowly and I will still have unknown vocabulary. That doesn’t mean they aren’t speaking Greek.
Northern Macedonia was never Ancient Macedonia except for when they conquered it AFAIK. It became Roman Dardania and Roman Macedonia during Roman period. Peonians were most likely of Illyrian stock given their location or Thrako-Illyrian.
If I'm not mistaken, Macedonian was most closely compared with Dorian, and even then Tsakonian today in Sparta is not mutually intelligible with Koine.
What bothers me the most is that after this results I'm afraid that the DNA analysis of the tomb of Vergina (Philip II & co) will be postponed for a long time. Really a mised opportunity to know more about a possible importan figure of antiquitie.
There are two main sets. One from northern....North Macedonia (mouthful), and one from southern/east of Ohrid.
The east of Ohrid area is clearly ancient Macedonian territory and are pretty much identical to southern Illyrians.
This is your personal interpretation. The historical fact is another and Demosthenes said it clearly:
"...οὐ μόνον οὐχ Ἕλληνος ὄντος οὐδὲ προσήκοντος οὐδὲν τοῖς Ἕλλησιν, ἀλλ᾽ οὐδὲ βαρβάρου ἐντεῦθεν ὅθεν καλὸν εἰπεῖν, ἀλλ᾽ ὀλέθρου Μακεδόνος, ὅθεν οὐδ᾽ ἀνδράποδον σπουδαῖον οὐδὲν ἦν πρότερον πρίασθαι."
"...he is not only no Greek, nor related to the Greeks, but not even a barbarian from any place that can be named with honour, but a pestilent knave from Macedonia, whence it was never yet possible to buy a decent slave."
Demosthenes-Third Philippic 31
Even the Thracians that lived there were probably more like BGR_IA than Tuscans. Greek Macedonians form a cline with Peloponnesians and the rest of Mainlanders.
The Slavic YDNA is higher there than in most other parts of Greece and also the historical account tells us that Macedonia was more Slavized than Peloponnese.
Ancient Macedonians and probably the Thracians were similar to Ancient Peloponnesians.
Northern Macedonia was never Ancient Macedonia except for when they conquered it AFAIK. It became Roman Dardania and Roman Macedonia during Roman period. Peonians were most likely of Illyrian stock given their location or Thrako-Illyrian.
I think you need some geography lessons pal. The southern parts of Macedonia were clearly ancient Macedonian, and Paeonians don't seem any different genetically.
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