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Thread: Interactions Trypilla and Sredni Stog

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    Regular Member etrusco's Avatar
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    Interactions Trypilla and Sredni Stog

    Interactions between Trypillian farmers and North Pontic forager-pastoralists in Eneolithic central Ukraine
    https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1...10.31.514526v1


    View ORCID ProfileAlexey G Nikitin, View ORCID ProfileMykhailo Videiko, View ORCID ProfileNick J Patterson, View ORCID ProfileVirginie Renson, View ORCID ProfileDavid E. Reich
    doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/2022.10.31.514526 This article is a preprint and has not been certified by peer review [what does this mean?].


    0000008








    Abstract

    The establishment of agrarian economy in Eneolithic East Europe is associated with the Pre-Cucuteni-Cucuteni-Trypillia complex (PCCTC). PCCTC farmers interacted with Eneolithic forager-pastoralist groups of the North Pontic steppe as PCCTC extended from the Carpathian foothills to the Dnipro Valley beginning in the late 5th millennium BCE. While the cultural interaction between the two groups is evident through the Cucuteni C pottery style that carries steppe influence, the extent of biological interactions between Trypillian farmers and the steppe remains unclear. Here we report the analysis of artefacts from the late 5th millennium Trypillian site of Kolomiytsiv Yar Tract (KYT) in central Ukraine, focusing on a bone fragment found in the Trypillian context at KYT. Diet stable isotope ratios obtained from the bone fragment place the diet of the KYT individual within the range of forager-pastoralists of the North Pontic area. Strontium isotope ratios of the KYT individual are consistent with having originated from contexts of the Sredny Stog culture sites of the Middle Dnipro Valley. Genetic analysis of the KYT individual indicates ancestry derived from a proto-Yamna population such as Sredny Stog. Overall, the KYT archaeological site presents evidence of interactions between Trypillians and Eneolithic Pontic steppe inhabitants of the Sredny Stog horizon and suggests a potential for gene flow between the two groups as early as the beginning of the 4th millennium BCE.

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    So Reich and Patterson pretty much confirm that Sredny Stog is proto-Yamnaya?
    indicates ancestry derived from a proto-Yamna population such as Sredny Stog
    If Polska reads this:

    At the same time, a late Trypillian individual dated to 3482-3297 calBCE from410 the Gordinești site in Moldova and identified as having a substantial “steppe” genetic admixture carried a U4-derived mitochondrial lineage U4a1 (Immel et al. 2020). On the whole412 genome Principal Component Analysis (PCA), the Gordinești individual is pulled away from the413 cluster of Trypillian specimens from Verteba cave, dated to ca. 3900-3600 calBCE, towards the414 EBA Yamna individuals from Ukraine and the Volga River region.
    Is this what I think it is? Does Gordinesti ring a bell?
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    Thanks for sharing etrusco.

    This is a confirmation that Sredni Stog has the same autosomal DNA like Yamnaya, but what about the Y-DNA? According to David Anthony Stredni Stog was I2 and R1a. What does this study say about the Y-DNA? I haven’t read it yet.

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    "A plausible scenario is that the KYT individual has 433 much of their ancestry from a Proto-Yamna population (Chintalapati et al. 2022), while also 434 being admixed with Serbia/Iron Gates Mesolithic, the latter possibly coming from the Neolithic 435 populations of the Dnipro Valley that have been shown to carry WHG admixture (Mathieson et 436 al. 2018). Sredny Stog is the main Proto-Yamna group of the Eneolithic North Pontic steppe and 437 has been hypothesized to be ancestral to Yamna based on archaeological analysis (Telegin 438 1986), which would be consistent with the assignment of the KYT individual to deriving most of 439 its ancestry from Sredny Stog people."

    So, a Sredny Stog woman in a Trypilla settlement.

    I wish they had looked at whether the domesticated animals came from the Caucasus or from Trypilla, although the latter is certainly more plausible.


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    So, could Corded Ware be the result of some proto-yamna ancestry mixed with some Cucuteni-Trypolia?
    Or maybe the Globular Amphora is a better fit for the EEF component in Corded Ware? Or some other European neolithic group?
    Finaly, the concept of proto-yamna is growing.
    Because of the predominant Y-DNA in each group, both Corded Ware and Bell Beaker can't be derived from Yamna.
    There must have been some common 'proto-Yamna' group in which R1a-M417, R1b-Z2103 and R1b-L51 were all represented.

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    No J-L283?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wanderer View Post
    No J-L283?
    It is one single bone fragment, inferred sex is female.

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    2 members found this post helpful.
    It's pretty interesting that the Indo-Europeans who apparently didn't like living in cities originated next to possibly the first cities in the world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philjames100 View Post
    It's pretty interesting that the Indo-Europeans who apparently didn't like living in cities originated next to possibly the first cities in the world.
    I am not so sure we can make the equivalence of (proto)Yamnaya to the origin of Indo Europeans anymore. But rethinking your statement, whether Trypilla or the Fertile Crescent, your point still stands.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bicicleur 2 View Post
    So, could Corded Ware be the result of some proto-yamna ancestry mixed with some Cucuteni-Trypolia?
    Or maybe the Globular Amphora is a better fit for the EEF component in Corded Ware? Or some other European neolithic group?
    Finaly, the concept of proto-yamna is growing.
    Because of the predominant Y-DNA in each group, both Corded Ware and Bell Beaker can't be derived from Yamna.
    There must have been some common 'proto-Yamna' group in which R1a-M417, R1b-Z2103 and R1b-L51 were all represented.
    Possible, what is not saying these groups were ONE group but they could have lived in close proximity with exchanges, in which constant exogamy existed. According to chronological depth of first contacts, this grouping (rather than "group") could have involved Y-R1b-L23 at first, before forking.

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    BTW already GAC could have learned from CTC before contacts with CWC?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    So Reich and Patterson pretty much confirm that Sredny Stog is proto-Yamnaya?


    If Polska reads this:



    Is this what I think it is? Does Gordinesti ring a bell?
    Gordinesti is too far north in Moldova in my opinion. I think Gordinesti was more toward these Cucuteni Trypillian people. My best guess is that if Novodanilovka, Cernavoda, or Usatovo are relevant, then closer to Black Sea coast and associated tributaries (rivers). Seems like papers are trickling out, including the one about that Usatovo site at Mayaki (no ancient dna calls, unfortunately) and the reservoir offset applied to several samples there thought to be Usatovo, but are actually 500 years older than previously thought. This is an issue I’ve noticed when reading papers from some researchers from that part of the world…there is a tendency to ascribe all pre Yamnaya kurgans to the Usatovo culture. But there was Cernavoda and Novodanilovka who preceded even Usatovo, which didn’t really start until about 3650 BC.

    Here’s a link to the Mayaki study. It’s not peer reviewed yet, but was a good read nonetheless. I’m still learning a lot about how they date these samples.

    https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers....act_id=4236123

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOESAN View Post
    Possible, what is not saying these groups were ONE group but they could have lived in close proximity with exchanges, in which constant exogamy existed. According to chronological depth of first contacts, this grouping (rather than "group") could have involved Y-R1b-L23 at first, before forking.
    Y-R1b-L23 or Y-R1b-M269.
    Y-R1b-M269 would include Y-R1b-PF7562, whose fouding father would have crossed the Caucasus.

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-PF7562/


    Y-R1b-M269 is an offspring of Y-R1b-P297, a mesolithic tribe in the forests of the Upper Volga area, along with Y-R1a-M459.

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