23andMe Looking for autosomal data (23andMe) from ex-Yugolslavia, Albania and Ukraine

It's misleading to some degree. There is an obvious East-West cline as there is a North-South cline...

One needs to represent this for what it is..."Western" pure and simple until such time there are Northern markers...which unduobtedly there are but for reasons unknown to me Dienekes is not using them??

It is not originally "Western". This admixture is found as far east as Mongolia (5%) and as far south as India (12% in the Vaishya Hindus). In my opinion, this admixtures comprise one Proto-Indo-European element from Russia, which is why the so-called 'Western European' admixture exceeds 30% in Russians, and reaches almost 40% in Ukrainians. It's just that Slavic people inherited a greater percentage of 'East European' from the Baltic region, but the origins of most of the "Western European" admixture might be in the North Caucasus, South Russia and Ukraine.
 
What about the West Asian and Southwest Asian admixtures ? My guesses are between 5 and 10% for the first and between 1 and 5% for the second.
Your guesses are a bit low.

West + East + Med = 80.3 %

West Asian + Southwest Asian should be around 16-18% (or more), considering it's difficult he has much South Asian, Northeast Asian and Southeast Asian. And the African autosomes must be absent or plain noise if reported.
 
Your guesses are a bit low.

West + East + Med = 80.3 %

West Asian + Southwest Asian should be around 16-18% (or more), considering it's difficult he has much South Asian, Northeast Asian and Southeast Asian. And the African autosomes must be absent or plain noise if reported.

No..it's 14.8 (West Asian + Southwest Asian)


What's your breakdown Knovas..being Iberian?
 
Oh, it really surprises me! I supose you don't have any (or insignificant) African reported, since it's pretty rare among the Balkans.

I'll send you a private message ;)
 
Oh, it really surprises me! I supose you don't have any (or insignificant) African reported, since it's pretty rare among the Balkans.

I'll send you a private message ;)

ha ha..of course not...it's 0.5% North West African...noise??

Thanks for the pm...Wow..you have a high Med score..is that typical for Spaniards?
 
Yes, I told noise since 0.5% (I didn't expect more) it's probably not real, too low.

The Spanish average is 48% and several of us get more than 50%, also Southern French could get reports like this. In the Balkan sample ther's one scoring 44%, wich I wonder if could belong to Bosnia. You are mostly Croatian and it's possible you normaly get more Northern European scores than Bosnians, although I think it's not rare to find 30% in other Croatians. You are near 26%, wich is just slightly lower.
 
Yes, I told noise since 0.5% (I didn't expect more) it's probably not real, too low.

The Spanish average is 48% and several of us get more than 50%, also Southern French could get reports like this. In the Balkan sample ther's one scoring 44%, wich I wonder if could belong to Bosnia. You are mostly Croatian and it's possible you normaly get more Northern European scores than Bosnians, although I think it's not rare to find 30% in other Croatians. You are near 26%, wich is just slightly lower.

I would not assume the 44% is from a Bosnian more likely to be Bulgarian IMO...That seems too high for a Bosnian unless they have mixed Turkish blood which not many do.
 
I would not assume the 44% is from a Bosnian more likely to be Bulgarian IMO...That seems too high for a Bosnian unless they have mixed Turkish blood which not many do.
Wrong, since Turks have only 25% mediterranean.
 
The actual Balkan average with samples from different regions is 30%, wich is a substantial percent. So it wouldn't be surprising to find Bosnians in the large 30's or more than 40%. Note that Croatians have 2 times more R1a and more R1b than Bosnians, who in contrast have a very high percent of I2*/I2a. Your percent rogers is just lower becuase you have inherited more West Asian, Southwest Asian and others, but I'm sure other Croacians could perfectly get, at least, 30% too, conserving the rest of East and West European you get.

By the way, Bulgarians have almost the same Mediterranean average comparing with the Balkans I mention. The Dodecad samples average is 32%, while the new Yunusbayev samples show 29%. Turks have nothing to do here, there's no significant difference between Bulgarians and the rest.
 
Wrong, since Turks have only 25% mediterranean.

It would be nice if you first introduced yourself into this thread before making a sweeping statement like that..It's quite unnerving..uhhg

What are your percentages just out of curiosity?
 
The actual Balkan average with samples from different regions is 30%, wich is a substantial percent. So it wouldn't be surprising to find Bosnians in the large 30's or more than 40%. Note that Croatians have 2 times more R1a and more R1b than Bosnians, who in contrast have a very high percent of I2*/I2a. Your percent rogers is just lower becuase you have inherited more West Asian, Southwest Asian and others, but I'm sure other Croacians could perfectly get, at least, 30% too, conserving the rest of East and West European you get.

By the way, Bulgarians have almost the same Mediterranean average comparing with the Balkans I mention. The Dodecad samples average is 32%, while the new Yunusbayev samples show 29%. Turks have nothing to do here, there's no significant difference between Bulgarians and the rest.

Knovas...I doubt you are right in this regard...Haplogroups would not the least correlate with modern autosomal admixtures...it's ludicrous to think that this could be the case...
 
I know most times haplogroups don't correlate, in Spain you have a clear example (Passiegos). However, for what I see in the Balkan average, it's possible the difference I mentioned could have something to do in this case. Also, the two Bosnians sharing genomes at 23andme makes me think it's very likely, since they cluster with Southern Europe neatly, as well as Eastern Europe. I'll search and see if I find Croatians, but my impression is that you are more Northern, while Bosnians have higher Med.
 
I know most times haplogroups don't correlate, in Spain you have a clear example (Passiegos). However, for what I see in the Balkan average, it's possible the difference I mentioned could have something to do in this case. Also, the two Bosnians sharing genomes at 23andme makes me think it's very likely, since they cluster with Southern Europe neatly, as well as Eastern Europe. I'll search and see if I find Croatians, but my impression is that you are more Northern, while Bosnians have higher Med.

OK it will be interesting to see what you find. I know that Bosnians have some Gothic and Saxon admix so...I as I said before I would be surprised if they have the levels of Med you are saying.
 
It would be nice if you first introduced yourself into this thread before making a sweeping statement like that..It's quite unnerving..uhhg

What are your percentages just out of curiosity?
I don't have to presente myself, i've been here longer than you, and it was not a sweeping statement, is what Dodecad shows, Turks have 25-28% mediterranean, thus the high merditerranean in the Balkans has nothing to do with Turks.
 
I don't have to presente myself, i've been here longer than you, and it was not a sweeping statement, is what Dodecad shows, Turks have 25-28% mediterranean, thus the high merditerranean in the Balkans has nothing to do with Turks.

Being here longer than me gives you no right to be rude.

I have asked you what your admixture breakdown is...why don't you contribute to this thread by letting us know about your own personal admix?
 
I posted you the spreadsheet to check the averages rogers (as well as the individual results). But no problem to post it again, perhaps you'll understand more what I said: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...owN3M3UWRyNnc&hl=en_US&authkey=COCa89AJ#gid=0


Thanks Knovas...I appreciate it!

It's interesting that Northern Italians have such a high Med admix....I would have expected them to be lower than 44.7 % average...strange..

Correct me if I am wrong but are there several projects involved apart from Dodecad?..eg: HGDP, Yunusbay, Behar, Rasmussen, Hapmap, 1000 genomes..
 
You are Correct. Some of the samples were collected by professional studies, as for example the new Yunusbayev or Behar. The rest seem to be other companies or projects dedicated to genetics (some Universities involved), wich have lots of samples from many different regions.

Northern Italians have quite Mediterranean, yes. Between them is also possible to find individuals with more than 50%, although for the moment the Dodecad samples hasn't collected anyone, is in the HGDP where you can find several of these. They are quite similar comparing with Iberians, basically they have less Northern European.
 
You are Correct. Some of the samples were collected by professional studies, as for example the new Yunusbayev or Behar. The rest seem to be other companies or projects dedicated to genetics (some Universities involved), wich have lots of samples from many different regions.

Northern Italians have quite Mediterranean, yes. Between them is also possible to find individuals with more than 50%, although for the moment the Dodecad samples hasn't collected anyone, is in the HGDP where you can find several of these. They are quite similar comparing with Iberians, basically they have less Northern European.


so many Italians where displaced around the country or "forced" to emigrate that genetics has become useless
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_diaspora

it was so bad, that sometimes areas developed their own language in foreign lands
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talian_dialect

Talian , a veneto dialect
 
The North Italians collected get different results from the rest of Italians, they are very easy to distinguish, so not useless at all. I supose North Italy has actually quite influences from other Italian regions, specially in the big cities. Nothing surprising at the present time.

For the rest, it seems it's true the migration to other lands was massive. This are simply "lost" samples, or others have tested being mixed with some Anglo-American stock or other influences. 23andme is plenty of people with half Italian heritage, probably some of them join the projects, although they are surely separated from the averages.
 

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