Jovialis
Advisor
- Messages
- 9,439
- Reaction score
- 6,089
- Points
- 113
- Ethnic group
- Italian
- Y-DNA haplogroup
- R-PF7566 (R-Y227216)
- mtDNA haplogroup
- H6a1b7
If I recall, Medieval Foggia was similar, you had a wide range of Italians on the cline living there from North to South, with a centrum that was basically at the modern approximation of Foggia.As expected, the Islamic community in Segesta which appears to be about 3/4 Sicilian derived and 1/4 N. African derived shows total discontinuity. They fall on a cline not dissimilar to Kerkouane and are effectively made of the same admixture proportions and components. There is one fully SSA individual which was probably quite uncommon during this period.
The later Christian community established in the same area shows a clean break in ancestry. They look extremely Pan-Italic, being evenly split between the genetic norms of modern North, South and Central Italy and they show effectively no North African ancestry. This most likely reflects the mainland Italian colonists that were settled to rechristianize the island. Many of these also continue to cluster close to the Himeran Greeks as well, unsurprisingly. I have somewhat suspected that more northerly contributions from Italy may have played a minor role in influencing the genome in areas like this under this context and we are now beginning to see it.
I think it's fair to say the long standing controversy of what past ethnic groups the Sicilian people derive their ancestry from is effectively closed. They are vastly majority descended of Romanized Magna Graecians with perhaps some minor input from central and northern Italians in the medieval era. They are no different from the rest of Southern Italians in this respect. Conversely population movements from North africa left zero or near zero legacy, due to demographic insufficiency and/or political expulsion.
@Salento
They're not available yet I see, but I think I speak for everyone when I say we would be highly appreciative if you could convert these to Dodecad K12b format.
I could do it too, but frankly, it has been a while, and I would need to re-learn the steps.
Salento: Thanks for taking this task up. Hopefully we can get the Dodecad 12b coordinates for these samples. The paper has already documented overlap between the Segesta Christian (Catholic) burial site samples and the Iron Age Sicilian Samples from the Himera Site (33 Individuals) and nearby Sicani site (21 individuals) (Reitsma et al 2022), in particular the Sicani samples.I think they're here:
They're SRA (fastq) and many of them are huge, ... It takes time, and I'm not sure if my machine can handle them all, but I'll give it a shot
I tested a couple of the smaller singles fastq following their 'design', the coverage was low, I need to test some of the bigger one by design, ... for Design I mean which set of files go together, or if a single file must stand by itself.
Yes, we even see it in Torino, granted with a heavier northern bias. As to whether the southern shifted samples in Torino were actually recent travelers from Southern Italy or instead descendants from central Italians of the Roman era remains to be known. My gut instinct is telling me that the reason southern and northern Italy returned to being effectively Ancient Greek and Ancient North Italic like after these back and forth colonization events has to do with a rural resurgence of high fertility populations that were less affected or unaffected by the migrations.If I recall, Medieval Foggia was similar, you had a wide range of Italians on the cline living there from North to South, with a centrum that was basically at the modern approximation of Foggia.
SGBN17_Dod_K12b,6.67,0,2.66,0.74,24.86,17.96,0.93,0,13.01,0,30.17,3.01
SGBN18_Dod_K12b,5.23,0,5.39,0,36.93,23.25,0,0.05,3.01,3.94,21.21,1.00
SGBN19_Dod_K12b,1.42,0,0.28,2.26,38.95,25.36,2.20,0,6.59,0,20.14,2.81
Distance to: | SGBN17_Dod_K12b |
---|---|
3.86927642 | BasilicataG21 |
4.37816171 | SR44_Busby_2015 |
4.82577455 | TP04_Busby_2015 |
5.08112192 | Abruzzo:Alp162 |
5.21592753 | Apulia:GS34 |
5.31776269 | BasilicataG18 |
5.47181871 | Apuliau2 |
5.52043477 | Abruzzo:Alp140 |
5.70574272 | C-Sicily50_Behar_2013 |
5.86635321 | Campania:NaN119AMR |
6.10702874 | Campania:NaN207MM |
6.15314554 | C-Sicily57_Behar_2013 |
6.18413292 | Siracusa:SR60_LazaridisNat2014 |
6.28403533 | ITS7 |
6.34990551 | BasilicataG19 |
6.43023328 | Marche:MarABY030D |
6.46974497 | E-Sicily18_Behar_2013 |
6.56258333 | Ag-Sicily8_Behar_2013 |
6.61689504 | SR48R_Busby_2015 |
6.63051280 | BasilicataG24 |
6.69061283 | MoliseG27 |
6.69243603 | ITS2 |
6.73346865 | ITS5 |
6.80490264 | Abruzzo:Alp090 |
6.80800264 | Marche:MarACO100D |
6.81435984 | Apulia:ALP379 |
6.81989003 | Abruzzo:Alp616 |
6.85598607 | Italy_Sicily |
6.87161553 | MoliseG26_Molise |
6.87795028 | Abruzzo:ALP205 |
6.90129698 | W-Sicily5a_Behar_2013 |
7.03646218 | Abruzzo:ALP161 |
7.10535713 | W-Sicily5b_Behar_2013 |
7.16084492 | TP06_Busby_2015 |
7.32610401 | BasilicataG25 |
7.38426706 | Apulia:cera1 |
7.43294693 | Campania:NaN212CR |
7.47890366 | Palermo_Trapani_Ancestry_23Me |
7.50951397 | Apulia:ALP583 |
7.51112508 | BasilicataG17 |
Distance to: | SGBN17_Dod_K12b |
---|---|
4.34906887 | Margaryan_etal_2020:VK537_Foggia_Puglia_Italy |
4.92386027 | Posth_etal_2021:S.Italy_Venosa:Venosa(Potenza_Basilicata)_672-800CE:VEN016 |
4.99092176 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R60_Medieval_Era_Villa_Magna |
5.16139516 | Posth_etal_2021:S.Italy_Venosa:Venosa(Potenza_Basilicata)_650-800CE:VEN001 |
5.61316310 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R54_Medieval_Era_Villa_Magna |
5.77482467 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R121_Late_Antiquity_S_Ercolano_Necropolis_Ostia |
5.87246967 | Posth_etal_2021:C.Italy_Early.Medieval:Tarquinia(Viterbo_Lazio)_729-942CE:TAQ003 |
6.08719968 | Margaryan_etal_2020:VK535_Foggia_Puglia_Italy |
6.22524698 | Posth_etal_2021:S.Italy_Venosa:Venosa(Potenza_Basilicata)_670-775CE:VEN015 |
6.27867820 | Posth_etal_2021:S.Italy_Venosa:Venosa(Potenza_Basilicata)_670-775CE:VEN013 |
6.50158442 | Posth_etal_2021:S.Italy_Venosa:Venosa(Potenza_Basilicata)_650-763CE:VEN006 |
6.64916536 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R57_Medieval_Era_Villa_Magna |
6.82316642 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R969_Medieval_Era_Tivoli_Palazzo_Cianti |
6.89437452 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R1290_Medieval_Era_Villa_Magna |
7.03499822 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R59_Medieval_Era_Villa_Magna |
7.06203229 | Antonio_etal_2022_R1554_Urbino-Bivio_125calCE-220calCE |
7.08969675 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R64_Medieval_Era_Villa_Magna |
7.09871115 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R835_Imperial_Era_Civitanova_Marche |
7.11027426 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R973_Medieval_Era_Tivoli_Palazzo_Cianti |
7.45285851 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R35_Late_Antiquity_Celio |
7.47908417 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R107_Late_Antiquity_Crypta_Balbi |
7.52657293 | Antonio_etal_2022_R1292_Cancelleria_500-1400_AD |
7.56444975 | Margaryan_etal_2020:VK534_Foggia_Puglia_Italy |
7.60091442 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R1544_Imperial_Era_Necropolis_of_Monte_Agnese |
7.63024246 | Antonio_etal_2019:Mediterranean_C6:R1549_Imperial_Era_Monterotondo |
Per the paper, 4 of the 9 Christian Samples were R1B-M269. But best I can tell there is no Supplementary Information available for all of them.Anything showing more specific Y-dna placements for the Christian samples?
Here are the coordinates for SGBN1 - SGBN12 - SGBN17 - SGBN18 - SGBN19 - I'll try to get some more samples - the files are very big and require a lot of processing power.
SGBN1_Dod_K12b,5.44,0,5.94,0,27.16,13.04,1.48,3.80,10.86,1.40,29.02,1.85
SGBN12_Dod_K12b,9.12,0.33,4.29,0,27.46,17.68,0,2.01,9.30,0,28.98,0.84
SGBN17_Dod_K12b,6.67,0,2.66,0.74,24.86,17.96,0.93,0,13.01,0,30.17,3.01
SGBN18_Dod_K12b,5.23,0,5.39,0,36.93,23.25,0,0.05,3.01,3.94,21.21,1.00
SGBN19_Dod_K12b,1.42,0,0.28,2.26,38.95,25.36,2.20,0,6.59,0,20.14,2.81
Anything showing more specific Y-dna placements for the Christian samples?
Just saw this now!Here are the coordinates for SGBN17 - SGBN18 - SGBN19 - I'll try to get some more samples - the files are very big and require a lot of processing power.
Code:SGBN17_Dod_K12b,6.67,0,2.66,0.74,24.86,17.96,0.93,0,13.01,0,30.17,3.01 SGBN18_Dod_K12b,5.23,0,5.39,0,36.93,23.25,0,0.05,3.01,3.94,21.21,1.00 SGBN19_Dod_K12b,1.42,0,0.28,2.26,38.95,25.36,2.20,0,6.59,0,20.14,2.81
SGBN1_IsL_Dod_K12b,5.44,0,5.94,0,27.16,13.04,1.48,3.80,10.86,1.40,29.02,1.85
SGBN4_IsL_Dod_K12b,2.57,0,11.00,1.23,26.49,8.70,0.40,5.06,17.10,0,27.07,0.38
SGBN10_ChR_Dod_K12b,4.54,0,1.47,2.67,24.82,22.89,0.85,1.85,10.51,0,28.27,2.12
SGBN12_ChR_Dod_K12b,9.12,0.33,4.29,0,27.46,17.68,0,2.01,9.30,0,28.98,0.84
SGBN17_ChR_Dod_K12b,6.67,0,2.66,0.74,24.86,17.96,0.93,0,13.01,0,30.17,3.01
SGBN18_ChR_Dod_K12b,5.23,0,5.39,0,36.93,23.25,0,0.05,3.01,3.94,21.21,1.00
SGBN19_ChR_Dod_K12b,1.42,0,0.28,2.26,38.95,25.36,2.20,0,6.59,0,20.14,2.81