With what ancient ethnicity do you most identify, and what has DNA told you ?

[Northener]

An umap (Ph2ter) with the most recent publishes Saxon samples, I'm in the middle of the original "Saxon cluster" (red just above the word germanic).

I guess this is pretty accurate with my ancestry, the outmost North Dutch are a kind of "original Anglo-Saxon jurassic park".

I identify myself with the 'free minded seafaring culture' the Anglo-Danish aka Saxons had...

 

[qh777]

MyTrueAncestry says my closest ancient populations are: Celtic Britons, Celts, Anglo-saxons, Celtic Dobunni, and the Gaels

Celt + Anglo Saxon (5.567)
Celt + Celtic Dobunni (5.717)
Celt + Briton (6.007)
Celt + Gael (6.028)
Gael + Anglo Saxon (6.216)
Briton (6.618)
Gael (7.082)
Celt (7.515)
Celtic Dobunni (7.786)
Anglo Saxon (7.814)

 

[Jovialis]

 

[Tautalus]

When I think of ancient peoples, there are two that immediately come to mind, the Greeks and the Romans. The Greeks in a wave of creative genius laid the foundations of Western civilization. And in relation to the Romans, I always remember what Nietzsche said about them:​

“What stood as aere perennius (more lasting than bronze), the imperium Romanum, the most magnificent form of organization ever to be achieved under difficult conditions, compared to which everything before or after has just been patched together, botched and dilettante…

The imperium Romanum that we know, and that the history of the Roman provinces teaches us to know better and better—this most admirable of all works of art in the grand manner was merely the beginning, and the structure to follow was to prove its worth for thousands of years. To this day, nothing on a like scale sub specie aeterni (from the viewpoint of eternity) has been brought into being, or even dreamed of! “

I love and admire the ancient Greeks and Romans, but the ancient people who I identified the most are the Lusitanians, my distant ancestors from Western Iberia. This is noticeable by my avatar, Tautalus, a Lusitanian warrior and by my profile banner, which represents the death of Viriathus, the great leader of the Lusitanians.

The Lusitanians were Indo-European speaking tribes, whose ancestry would be made up mainly of native Iberian Chalcolithic people and the Bell Beakers who arrived on the peninsula in the early Bronze Age.
​

North-West Indo-Europeans of Iberian Beaker descent and haplogroup R1b-P312 | Indo-European.eu

North-West Indo-European-speaking East Bell Beakers of Yamnaya Steppe ancestry reached Iberia and developed into Galaico-Lusitanians

indo-european.eu

​

Theories differ about their language, some consider it a Celtic language, others Italic, others still basal Italo-Celtic. Being a language derived from the Bell Beakers, it is related to the Italo-Celtic family.​

Strabo said of them “And yet the country north of the Tagus, Lusitania, is the greatest of the nations in Hispania, and is the nation against which the Romans waged war for the longest times.”

They were barbarians in the eyes of the Romans, but they were a proud and independent people who fought and gave the Romans great disappointments for several decades before they were finally conquered.

Once conquered and romanized, they lost their language and identity, as happened with many other peoples conquered by the Romans. The little we know about them today is due to Greek and Roman writers.​

They, and other peoples from Western Iberia with the same ethnic background formed in the Early Bronze Age, constitute the majority of my ancestry.

I and all Portuguese still today have an emotional connection with this ancient people, although their blood is diluted and the memory of their culture and identity has been lost for millennia.
​

 

[Salento]

Numero Uno :

Romans of Italy
The geographic location and age of the Roman remains that make up this population group corresponds to Italia (Roman Italy) itself. This period of time represents the Roman Empire in its entirety, from its beginning (31 BCE - 476 CE) through its height, until its fracture into part of the Western Roman Empire, and its eventual invasion by the Ostrogoths in 476 CE.
Under Roman rule - beginning with Julius Caesar in 49 BCE - the Italian peninsula experienced great achievements in literature, architecture, and the arts that was particularly focussed in Rome and its surrounding areas. Rome, the Eternal City, is the largest municipality on the European continent today, mostly owed to its history as the capital of the Roman Empire.

... far away:

23andme - Ancient shared DNA
... the Normans in Puglia ... ... I think.

 

[Salento]

I noticed that Rs 83 + VK 17 = 100

… maybe Greek (44) overlap with Rs, … probably a partial common Ancestry.

 

[Vitruvius]

I identify most with the ancient Italics and what became their sense of unified Roman identity - particularly more so in a broad sense than being over specific about identifying with one tribe or another. Most of my family's ancestral towns have existed since at least the imperial Roman era and going even further back in some cases they started as Magna Graecian settlements which were later conquered and colonized by Roman Veterans during the republican era of classical antiquity. Moreover my ethnic background is rather pan-Italic instead of specifically coming from one province or region. The idea that there is little significant difference between the various peoples of Italy and that their well being, culture and ethnic expression is better preserved as a well kindred nation state rather than divided tribes or city states is the kind of mentality and archetype identity which the Romans believed in and the same one rekindled during the Renaissance and Risorgimento. Historically I've found this interpretation of Italian nationhood to be beneficial and of course many other nations have mimicked the model with great success.

While the Italic speakers entered the Italian peninsula in the Bronze age with strong affinities and genetic overlap to many modern Italians today - particularly those of the north - it's clear to me that the advent of Italian unification under the guise of the Roman citizenship and civic identity genetically produced more precisely the kind of genetic norms we see today in Italy as a direct result of the conquest and assimilation of Magna Graecian Greeks. The broad assimilation of their large populations under the guise of the conquering Oscan and Latin tongues, their integration into Roman culture as Roman citizens, and finally their broad scale mixing with the genetically Italic populations of Po valley and the Alps effectively looks to have produced the genetic norms of the modern Italian people by the imperial era. This matches the height of Italy's power in which the Roman empire would reach its maximal extent, dominating the Mediterranean, Middle east, North Africa and Western Europe with a standing army of 400,000 men of Italic stock. In this sense the Italians of today are the only people that can claim heir to the Romans of the ancient world, as they are simply the final realization of Rome's idealized archetype concerning their own standards of citizenship, identity, culture, ethnicity and nationhood to define who constituted a foreigner and who did not. This is of course not to degrade or belittle the influence Rome has had on many other nations outside of Italy which is of course often times considerable and legitimately part of their national history, language and culture.

 

[Duarte]

The cultures that developed in the Near East and throughout the Mediterranean region from the Bronze Age to classical antiquity are truly fascinating. I really like the Phoenicians because of their entrepreneurial and adventurous spirit.

The Phoenicians formed an enterprising maritime trading culture that extended throughout the Mediterranean Sea during the period from 1500 to 300 BC. The Phoenicians were the first society to make extensive use, at a state level, of the alphabet. The Phoenician phonetic alphabet is considered the ancestor of all modern alphabets. Through maritime trade, the Phoenicians spread the use of the alphabet to North Africa and Europe, where it was adopted by the ancient Greeks, who passed it on to the Etruscans, who in turn passed it on to the Romans. The recovery of the Mediterranean economy, after the collapse that occurred at the end of the Bronze Age, appears to be largely due to the work of Phoenician traders and their merchant princes. Phoenician culture had a major impact on the cultures of the Mediterranean basin in the Early Iron Age, which in turn also influenced them enormously.

 

[Luso]

The Conii/Cynetes. Depicted in what it today southern Portugal

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cynetes

"Their presence in these regions is attested archeologically by the elaborated cremation burial-mounds of their ruling elite, whose rich grave-goods and the inscribed slabs in ‘Tartessian alphabet’ – also referred to as ‘Southwest script’ – that mark the graves, evidence contact with North Africa and the eastern Mediterranean since the 9th century BC. Scholars like Schulten, consider the Conii a Ligurian tribe (related to the Ligures of North-western Italy/South-eastern France) and believe that the «Ligurians are the original people of the Iberian Peninsula». The Conii would have left their mark not only in Portugal but also in Spain and European regions where the Ligurians established themselves. They appear to be related to the Aquitanians and the Basques.[13]

Inscriptions in the Tartessian language have been found in the area, in a variety often referred to as Southwest Paleohispanic script.[14][15] The name Conii, found in Strabo, seems to have been identical with the Cynesii, who were mentioned by Herodotus as the westernmost dwellers of Europe and distinguished by him from the Celts.[16]"

-- I am not aware of any dna samples found of them, but they resided where my family is from today. If they were essentially like Tartessians then genetically my family would not be that similar to them. Today, we are far more similar to modern Galicians, and Castillians than ancient iberians in that area. And in general, modern iberians can attribute a larger deviation from these ancient people's and tribes because of the subsequent Roman-era.

 

[torzio]

i was given this map before, linking me to Pannonians, Illyrians and Picene people ......................but lately it has come down to either Pannonian or Japodes

 

[Jalisciense]

None because I'm mixed, and my DNA tests have told me that too.

 

[hapiness15]

By my Y, i would say that i feel a lot of connection with proto-italic and proto-celtic people , R-S8172 is too strong veneto region , another person did analyze my str's and said that y was in iberia before roman period , i thought it could be a roman but is from iron age , probably some proto left italy and went to south iberia , my another ancient ethncities is ancient amerindians , ancient west africans and east africans could be kenya , nothern indian also is found on me , ancient north african tribes, small traces of germanic tribes is found aswell , so european is basically ancient iberian tribes , celtic tribes , italic tribes mainly proto and most recent like romans aswell , germanic tribes and probably another ones i dont know , but strongest connection is for sure proto-italic and proto-celtic

 

[Kirgonix Pereira]

Although my genetics point to Celtiberus with Greek and North African influences, since all my ancestors are from Portugal, I have been fascinated by Asterix and Obelix comics since I was a child, to the point that my name on this forum is "Kirgonix" which is an agglutinated name of "King Obelix". As I've always been slightly "chubby", I always really like Obelix and his story about the Magic Potion, but what fascinated me most in the comics and films was the great power of Rome.
In a way, I identify as a Gallo-Roman. However, on a cultural level, I am very addicted to Turkish culture, be it the war songs, the clothes, the mustaches, everything.

In total it would be a mixture of Turkish, Gaulish (Celtic) and Roman. It would be the ethnicity that defines me.

 

[hapiness15]

Although my genetics point to Celtiberus with Greek and North African influences, since all my ancestors are from Portugal, I have been fascinated by Asterix and Obelix comics since I was a child, to the point that my name on this forum is "Kirgonix" which is an agglutinated name of "King Obelix". As I've always been slightly "chubby", I always really like Obelix and his story about the Magic Potion, but what fascinated me most in the comics and films was the great power of Rome.
In a way, I identify as a Gallo-Roman. However, on a cultural level, I am very addicted to Turkish culture, be it the war songs, the clothes, the mustaches, everything.

In total it would be a mixture of Turkish, Gaulish (Celtic) and Roman. It would be the ethnicity that defines me.

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In your mytrueancestry modern populations appear what , your star is close to north italy aswell, can send the pic? I suspect there was a massive migration from northwest italy and northeast to iberia mainly south but before roman period , strongest R-U152 is found in southwest iberia, but with roman settlements this Y inscreased still more

 

[Jovialis]

Italics and Ancient Greeks

 

[Ivorix]

Iberians and Anglo Saxons

 

[Vitruvius]

Italics and Ancient Greeks

I'm surprised you get a higher BA Italic than Greek result as a Southern Italian. Typically Southern Italians would score a majority Greek like with minority Italic like input where as Northerners score the inverse.

 

[Who Cares?]

Based on DNA results I believe some ancient Balkan people - be it Greeks, Thracians, Illyrians, or some others.

IllustrativeDNA gives me 62-63% Neolithic Anatolian farmer, putting me close to quite close to Neolithic Balkans.

DNAGenics Shared Roots Europe option confirms that with majority of samples either Starcevo Neolithic (Serbia, Hungary & Croatia), France/Germany Neolithic, or Iron Gates HG (Serbia & Romania) with occasional western European HGs. I basically score almost no Eastern European Neolithic from that era

Its also interesting that DNAGenics Shared Roots gives me almost the same amount of ancient European and ancient Asian matches.

 

[Jovialis]

I'm surprised you get a higher BA Italic than Greek result as a Southern Italian. Typically Southern Italians would score a majority Greek like with minority Italic like input where as Northerners score the inverse.

There's also a minority component of Lombard to consider in the North that would be in addition to Italic and Greek though.

 

[Vitruvius]

There's also a minority component of Lombard to consider in the North that would be in addition to Italic and Greek though.

Personally I'm not visibly seeing it. If it exists it would have to be small. The Lombards were definitely historically there as an ethnic group, but there is really no "northern" or "Germanic" shift in Italians when I look at the IA Picenes or EMA non lombard Torino & Bardonecchia burials and compare them to modern northern Italians.

If IA northern Italics end up plotting like the IA Picenes it will be a direct overlap between ancient and modern Italians with no influx of Germanic. There will probably be some Greek like ancestry like I mentioned but I'm betting it will also be more limited to the southern regions of Po valley, such as what we saw with Bologna/Felsina.

Anyways, we will only find out definitively when we have more studies on the northern Italian Iron age to compare moderns against. My bet still remains that the IA Picene profile will be as abundant in the north as the Etruscan/Latin profile so far has been in central Italy. A lot of the data is pointing this direction but we will have to see.