Tomenable
Regular Member
- Messages
- 5,419
- Reaction score
- 1,337
- Points
- 113
- Location
- Poland
- Ethnic group
- Polish
- Y-DNA haplogroup
- R1b-L617
- mtDNA haplogroup
- W6a
As for the original homeland of Proto-East-Balts (I will simply call them East Balts below):
According to Russian studies of linguistics, toponymy (including hydronymy) and archaeology, such as these:
- Трубачев О. Н., Топоров В. Н., Лингвистический анализ гидронимов Верхнего Поднепровья
- Седов В.В., Происхождение и ранная истрия Славян
- Седов В. В., Славяние верхнево Поднепровья и Подвинья
- Бернштейн С. Б., Очерк сравнительной граматики славянских языков
- Третьяков П. Н., Памятники зарубинецкой культуры
The Iron Age homeland of East Balts were forest cultures of North-West Russia characterised by hillforts and long barrows.
That network of hillfort-building cultures of the forest zone, included primarily the following four cultures:
- Stroked-pottery culture
- Dnieper-Dvina culture
- Yukhnov culture
- Upper Oka culture
Areas occupied by those Iron Age cultures, contained archaeological sites (both Iron Age and older) described in these papers:
Dolukhanov et al., "The East European Plain on the Eve of Agriculture":
http://www.mas.ncl.ac.uk/~nas13/AS/2009BAR_Int_Ser1964_Dolukhanov_etal.pdf
Dolbunova et al., "Archaeology of lake settlement (North-West Russia)":
https://www.academia.edu/9452168/Ar...azurkevich_A._Polkovnikova_M._Dolbunova_E._ed
In the latter paper we have results of aDNA research, in Table 3. on p. 294 we have 6 samples:
For these samples mtDNA and Y-DNA haplogroups were established (but only superficially, no details about subclades are given):
1) The oldest of these samples is from the turns of the 5th and 4th millennia BC (I bet that this R1a didn't belong to Indo-European branch M198/M417, but it was some more archaic subclade, similar to Karelian R1a dated 5500-5000 BC, or to modern R1a kit of Mr Szpakowski, an ethnic Pole from Belarus):
Sample A3 - site Serteya VIII - dated to ca. 4000 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H
2) Three medium-aged samples belong to Zhizhitskaya culture from the mid-3rd millennium BC. It was under strong cultural influence of Corded Ware and/or Globular Amphora cultures. According to Dolukhanov et al. (page 185), Corded or Globular population penetrated this culture, mixing with the locals:
Sample A6 - site Serteya II - dated to ca. 2500 BC; Y-DNA: N1c, mtDNA: H2
Sample A8 - site Naumovo - dated to ca. 2500 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H2
Smple A9 - site Serteya II - dated to ca. 2500 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H2
3) Two youngest samples (800-400 BC) are Iron Age, part of the network of hillfort-building cultures of the forest zone. R1a (A4) was inside the hillfort, where warrios and craftsmen lived (Dolukhanov et al., p. 187), while N1c (A5) was in "Devichi gory" burial (long barrow/kurgan?) near the lake:
Sample A4 - Anashkino hillfort - dated to ca. 800-400 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H
Sample A5 - "Devichi gory" burial - dated to ca. 800-400 BC, Y-DNA: N1c, mtDNA: H2
There is lack of high-resolution data on subclades, but R1a1 and N1c in proportion 1:1 are also today typical haplogroups of East Balts.
Map showing these sites (I couldn't locate "Devichi gory" burial ground, but it was somewhere near the Zhizhitskoye Lake):
http://postimg.org/image/hsmtvl7xd/
I think, that R1a from Zhizhitskaya culture and Anashkino hillfort was of Satem IE origin, while N1c was from Non-Indo-European (Old European or Finnic?) population. So East Balts were a mix of R1a and N1c already when living in forests of North-West Russia, before settling at the Sea.
Was ethnogenesis of East Baslts about mixing of Satem IEs (Globular Amphora or/and Corded Ware) with people of Zhizhitskaya culture?
Zhizhitskaya culture was a Late Neolithic culture of fishermen and farmers, building pile dwellings near lakes and rivers. It was at least partially descended from earlier indigenous North-East European cultures of the Comb Ceramic horizon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit–Comb_Ware_culture
Population of Iron Age cultures of that area (like those from Anashkino hillfort and "Devichi gory") buried their dead in long barrows (long kurgans).
Here is a map showing the area occupied by Zhizhitskaya culture - area number 7 in this map:
This area (No 7) was being penetrated (areas 2 and 16) by people of the Globular Amphora culture (area 1):
http://postimg.org/image/hsmtvl7xd/
Legend to the map:
Lake Zhizhitskoye - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Zhizhitskoye
========================================
Samples described above: http://s020.radikal.ru/i704/1502/be/a19103cc4d67.png
According to Russian studies of linguistics, toponymy (including hydronymy) and archaeology, such as these:
- Трубачев О. Н., Топоров В. Н., Лингвистический анализ гидронимов Верхнего Поднепровья
- Седов В.В., Происхождение и ранная истрия Славян
- Седов В. В., Славяние верхнево Поднепровья и Подвинья
- Бернштейн С. Б., Очерк сравнительной граматики славянских языков
- Третьяков П. Н., Памятники зарубинецкой культуры
The Iron Age homeland of East Balts were forest cultures of North-West Russia characterised by hillforts and long barrows.
That network of hillfort-building cultures of the forest zone, included primarily the following four cultures:
- Stroked-pottery culture
- Dnieper-Dvina culture
- Yukhnov culture
- Upper Oka culture
Areas occupied by those Iron Age cultures, contained archaeological sites (both Iron Age and older) described in these papers:
Dolukhanov et al., "The East European Plain on the Eve of Agriculture":
http://www.mas.ncl.ac.uk/~nas13/AS/2009BAR_Int_Ser1964_Dolukhanov_etal.pdf
Dolbunova et al., "Archaeology of lake settlement (North-West Russia)":
https://www.academia.edu/9452168/Ar...azurkevich_A._Polkovnikova_M._Dolbunova_E._ed
In the latter paper we have results of aDNA research, in Table 3. on p. 294 we have 6 samples:
For these samples mtDNA and Y-DNA haplogroups were established (but only superficially, no details about subclades are given):
1) The oldest of these samples is from the turns of the 5th and 4th millennia BC (I bet that this R1a didn't belong to Indo-European branch M198/M417, but it was some more archaic subclade, similar to Karelian R1a dated 5500-5000 BC, or to modern R1a kit of Mr Szpakowski, an ethnic Pole from Belarus):
Sample A3 - site Serteya VIII - dated to ca. 4000 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H
2) Three medium-aged samples belong to Zhizhitskaya culture from the mid-3rd millennium BC. It was under strong cultural influence of Corded Ware and/or Globular Amphora cultures. According to Dolukhanov et al. (page 185), Corded or Globular population penetrated this culture, mixing with the locals:
Sample A6 - site Serteya II - dated to ca. 2500 BC; Y-DNA: N1c, mtDNA: H2
Sample A8 - site Naumovo - dated to ca. 2500 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H2
Smple A9 - site Serteya II - dated to ca. 2500 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H2
3) Two youngest samples (800-400 BC) are Iron Age, part of the network of hillfort-building cultures of the forest zone. R1a (A4) was inside the hillfort, where warrios and craftsmen lived (Dolukhanov et al., p. 187), while N1c (A5) was in "Devichi gory" burial (long barrow/kurgan?) near the lake:
Sample A4 - Anashkino hillfort - dated to ca. 800-400 BC; Y-DNA: R1a1, mtDNA: H
Sample A5 - "Devichi gory" burial - dated to ca. 800-400 BC, Y-DNA: N1c, mtDNA: H2
There is lack of high-resolution data on subclades, but R1a1 and N1c in proportion 1:1 are also today typical haplogroups of East Balts.
Map showing these sites (I couldn't locate "Devichi gory" burial ground, but it was somewhere near the Zhizhitskoye Lake):
http://postimg.org/image/hsmtvl7xd/
I think, that R1a from Zhizhitskaya culture and Anashkino hillfort was of Satem IE origin, while N1c was from Non-Indo-European (Old European or Finnic?) population. So East Balts were a mix of R1a and N1c already when living in forests of North-West Russia, before settling at the Sea.
Was ethnogenesis of East Baslts about mixing of Satem IEs (Globular Amphora or/and Corded Ware) with people of Zhizhitskaya culture?
Zhizhitskaya culture was a Late Neolithic culture of fishermen and farmers, building pile dwellings near lakes and rivers. It was at least partially descended from earlier indigenous North-East European cultures of the Comb Ceramic horizon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit–Comb_Ware_culture
Population of Iron Age cultures of that area (like those from Anashkino hillfort and "Devichi gory") buried their dead in long barrows (long kurgans).
Here is a map showing the area occupied by Zhizhitskaya culture - area number 7 in this map:
This area (No 7) was being penetrated (areas 2 and 16) by people of the Globular Amphora culture (area 1):
http://postimg.org/image/hsmtvl7xd/
Legend to the map:
Lake Zhizhitskoye - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Zhizhitskoye
========================================
Samples described above: http://s020.radikal.ru/i704/1502/be/a19103cc4d67.png
Last edited: