Genetic history of East-Central Europe in the first millennium CE

[Jovialis]

Abstract


The appearance of Slavs in East-Central Europe has been the subject of an over 200-year debate driven by two conflicting hypotheses. The first assumes that Slavs came to the territory of contemporary Poland no earlier than the sixth century CE; the second postulates that they already inhabited this region in the Iron Age (IA). Testing either hypothesis is not trivial given that cremation of the dead was the prevailing custom in Central Europe from the late Bronze Age until the Middle Ages (MA).

https://genomebiology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13059-023-03013-9

 

[Jovialis]

Huge increase of R1a in the Middle Ages.

 

[kingjohn]

 

[Moja]

Huge increase of R1a in the Middle Ages.

It seems to be related to the Hunnic Invasion.

 

[Cato]

Apparently the two samples from the Przeworsk culture are Celtic-like. So the Vandals were Germanaized Celts ? [emoji848]

PCA0011CA0011,0.127482,0.128972,0.060716,0.057494,0.036622,0.015339,0.007285,-0.003923,0.000614,0.001276,-0.004872,-0.001349,-0.015758,-0.009221,0.020358,0.005701,-0.00339,0.001647,0.003394,0.008629,0.003119,0.011252,0.012325,0.013134,-0.002754
PCA0012CA0012,0.134311,0.145221,0.054682,0.030685,0.050163,0.007809,-0.00141,0.006,0.013908,0.01877,-0.003085,0.01154,-0.01115,-0.007982,0.013843,0.011138,0.005215,0.006588,0.006536,-0.001626,-0.001373,0.001731,-0.000616,-0.001446,-0.00012

 

[Cato]

Some traditions of the Celtic era survived in the Germanic phase

https://www.researchgate.net/public...ciety_and_its_long-distance_contacts_AD_1-350

If the bulk of the Vandal population was Celtic then this could explain why in places like North Africa or Sardinia there is a decent amount of R1b-U152 but virtually no Germanic haplogroups like I1 [emoji848][emoji848]

We will see...

 

[torzio]

Some traditions of the Celtic era survived in the Germanic phase

https://www.researchgate.net/public...ciety_and_its_long-distance_contacts_AD_1-350

If the bulk of the Vandal population was Celtic then this could explain why in places like North Africa or Sardinia there is a decent amount of R1b-U152 but virtually no Germanic haplogroups like I1 [emoji848][emoji848]

We will see...

the vandals was a vandalic confederation made up of 14 tribes in northern germany and northern poland................tribes like the Carini, Aviones, Varini etc

 

[Cato]

According to Bard. I don't know his sources but probably he's right

 

[Ralphie Boy]

Surprised to not see Slavic I-Y3120 or its parent CTS10228 in Middle Ages samples.

 

[Dibran]

Interesting. So we now have R-L1029 in Iron Age La Tene Czechia, and IA Wielbark. Also M458 in Kowalenko which is likely further downstream (due to low quality). I suspect M458 and its descendants were relatively a small tribe living somewhere around the NE Carpathians at the crossroads between Celto-Germanic and Balto-Slavic Cultures with it becoming large and successful with Pre-Slavic/Slavic culture where it saw its largest growth and expansion. Alternatively it could have been more common but due to cremation, it appears relatively insignificant before the Christian era.

So far M458 progression from BA-IA/Antiquity is as follows:

R1a-M458* -1200-1500 BCE - Middle Bronze Age - Brodzica, East Poland in Volhynian Uplands (Trzinienc Culture) - Balto-Slavic-Like
R1a-M458 low coverage (could be further downstream) - 450-550 BCE - Iron Age, Singen, Germany (Hallstatt C & D) - Italo-Celtic-Like with some Balto-Slavic-Like Admixture
R1a-M458* (could be further downstream) - 150-250 BCE - Iron Age, Eastern Hungary (La Tene) - Balto-Slavic-Like
R1a-L1029>YP263>YP5269 - 250-350BCE - Iron Age, Bohemia, Czechia (La Tene) - Celto-Germanic-Like with Balto-Slavic-Like admixture
R1a-L1029 - Roman Period, 100-300CE, Czarnowko, Poland (Wielbark Culture)
R1a-M458 - Roman Period, Kowalenko, Poland (Gothic??)

 

[Dibran]

Abstract


The appearance of Slavs in East-Central Europe has been the subject of an over 200-year debate driven by two conflicting hypotheses. The first assumes that Slavs came to the territory of contemporary Poland no earlier than the sixth century CE; the second postulates that they already inhabited this region in the Iron Age (IA). Testing either hypothesis is not trivial given that cremation of the dead was the prevailing custom in Central Europe from the late Bronze Age until the Middle Ages (MA).

https://genomebiology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13059-023-03013-9

Will Eupedia ever update their Haplogroup Articles with the ancient study samples?

M458 has seen alot of ancient DNA found (primarily in the IA and Medieval + 1 from BA Poland), none of which have been added/updated in Eupedia. Nor has the haplogroup map/tree been updated either.

 

[Jovialis]

Will Eupedia ever update their Haplogroup Articles with the ancient study samples?

M458 has seen alot of ancient DNA found (primarily in the IA and Medieval + 1 from BA Poland), none of which have been added/updated in Eupedia. Nor has the haplogroup map/tree been updated either.

You should PM Maciamo, the articles are solely within his purview.

 

[Dibran]

You should PM Maciamo, the articles are solely within his purview.

I have in the past regarding the Singen sample in Hallstatt that was found. I never got a response. I will message him again.