J2a and R1a are markers of Indo Europeans. Greeks have it because of ancient Indo Europeans. The highest concentration of J2a is in Kavkaz not in Creta!R1b and J2b have a lot to do with Hellenics!J2a have nothing to do with Baltic!The birth place is more or mess what is called Kurdistan, people from there mixed with R1a people and Scythians and Iranics were born. The mixture of I2a2 and R1a people give birth to Slavs!
Not all J2a is the same. Majority of J2a in the Balkan is from Schytians,Bulgars, Avars etcs, but some of it is older and comes from Micenian Cyvilization,some of it comes from Phinicians. I think ancient Hellenics were J2b and R1b people.
J2a4 is typical of Cretans
J2a7 is typical of Pontic Greeks and Ioniian populations
what scythians?
J2a has nothing to do with Scythians,
R1a -M17 has to do with Scythians, Thracians etc
it is not J2a but J2axxxxxxx that counts
J2 is consider Caucasian HG but it has nothing to do with Nations we know today,
J2 either 2a or 2b was already spread much before,
J2b according the extra xxx after might be from Europe to India,
Now if you Believe that J2 + R1a is the IE Hg well that is another story,
and sorry if I have misunderstood,
you must specify which J2a or J2b you consider what,
For me J2a J2b might Be proto Greco-Aryan some parts and Indo-Iranic some others,
when same time all J2 might not even be IE but earlier, (Not Greco-Aryan Not Indo-iranian but whatever before, Farmers before the creations of Nations)
the case of IE gives R1b but can't easily explain the R1b of Basquez etc,
or R1a (m-17) But R1a is also high among some Turkic pop
J2a & J2b but can not explain why The North IE populations which do not have J2 speak IE
Now J2a can not Be Bulgarian but Pre-Bulgarian
J2a was in Balkan before the arrival of Bulgarians
to be more specific at least for Me
Bulgars or Balkars as I read it in an older text are consider Turkic tribe, which Moved to Balkans from the pass of Black sea (Cerno-More) and not from the Pass of Serbs,
Bulgars also had N Y-DNA and local Volga around HG
Bulgars were Minority but manage to Create a city and a state,
In order to survive cooperate with Severi a Slavic tribe, Creating the nation that today is called Bulgaria,
But People lived there much before the arrival of Bulgars
It is not strange that culture of what today all call Thracians passed to Greeks to Bulgarians Romanians Turks etc,
Now about E-V13 Taranis comparing the Iberian finding suggest that is Neolithic,
Personally I believe that is Imported at chalcolithic era from Arcado-Cypriots, and that is why we can not consider it as a founder effect,
it Seems like either Thracians ruled upon E-V13 either E-V13 came to Greece at 2000 BC and slowly expand North,
Thracians surely were not E-V13
now about I Hg, my question is always this, Since I and especially I2a2 has exactly the area were Thracians were expand, could it be Thracian marker?
now about R1b and If I remember well is M-23 you are right, it might be mycenean proto-Greek, with minor asian origin
But according History Greeks and Hellenes origin is Upper Thessaly, South Upper Makedonia, South Epirus and Phthia, that area has enough concentration of R1a which takes a corridor south, and expands in Doric Colonies in S.Italy,
the ratio M-17/M-198 that exists among Greek R1a is same with Scandinavian-Norwegian, S Italy and Kurdish, that means that probably Thracians were Aryan R1a not Scythian that passed from minor Asia to Balkans creating Greeks and Thracians and Getae and Getae moved to GothLand
that is an unproven theory, but has some small possibilities, and I strongly support it
the other possibility is That R1b came from minor Asia even to Kurgan and moved west when R1a came, and R1a came from North The Baltic (Tracians were mix of Balto-Germanic R1a+ Celtic+anatolian R1b)
the 3rd possibility is that if Greeks had no R1a then R1a is medieval Slavic or Bulgarian,
That drops to a paradox cause only in Doric colonies we find bigger quantities of R1a than in any other Greek population. while Trikka the march center of Dorians is in the Heart of R1a concentration.
the 4rth possibility is that Bryges were R1a and the R1a in Greeks and in Kurds is Brygian
(Gordium)
the sure is that Avars Bulgars had not J2 and E-V13 But I and R1a and N HGs
remember that tribes also adopt or kidnaped children and orphans to raise them as their own,
Farmers and simple people obey the warriors,
in Fact the 'hole' in west Balkans, an area of almost 0 J2 and Big R1a gives clear that there was limited cooperation among these 2
J2 is not a Northen HG
Sory Yaan but from The little I know I can not accept that J2 has to do with Avars and Bulgars and Scythians, But with what we call South IE (Greco-Aryan, Indo-Iranian, and maybe Celts also) or a totaly non IE population that existed much before the expansion of IE, and adopted IE,
It was here much Before, the existance of J2a especially in areas were non of the above or relative step proves so,
although Until tombs DNA tests prove another theory,
my point is that,