The nonsense one can post just because they have an internet connection. Albanians, of all people, calling others "Turks". The kettle truly calls the pot black. They dost protest too much, perhaps some underlying recognition of who did most of the collaborating with the Ottomans, and it must be somewhat challenging to square their inflated national pride with the undisputed fact that of all their neighbours, only they and the Bosnians did not seem to have the mettle to resist converting en-masse to their conquerors. Not that it is the religion itself that I have any issue with or make a value-judgement on, I simply point out that for such a long, proud, and entrenched culture and people as our Albanian friends they most surely had more resolve than their southern half-breed, degenerate, rootless neighbours who being mostly Turks in any case, of course could not but assimilate with their overlords.
But wait, that did not happen now did it.
It would be time-consuming, tedious and frankly bring it to the level of the most base nationalist spamming to sit here and find and post as many references available on the net on how their very language and historical references do not even put them in the lands they currently occupy until post-1,000 AD, the evidence for lack of Illyrian continuity, and all the other goodies one can find out there. I no more have the desire to do so, or see a more rewarding outcome, then to have a conversation on the Scottish referendum with my neighbours barking dog, but some of the nonsense being said deserves the proverbial slap to the side of the reality head, and the so called "Greeks are Turks" gibberish is a good case in point to highlight the lack of basic critical reasoning.
So the simple and straight-forward way to cut through to the heart of the matter for those who seem to equate the very well attested and documented thousands-year old Greek communities, dating in some cases to over 200 years before Alexander the Great, whose era we started discussing in this thread, of Asia Minor with their descendants, and later forced emigrants, with somehow being Christian "Turks" is:
Since these Greeks are somehow Christian Turks that were deported to Greece (the prosfygi) show us when, where, and how these Turks converted to Christianity and in such vast numbers?
My historical knowledge must be quite poor, for everything I have read and understood to-date on the Turks, from the Seljuks to the Ottomans, pretty much states that by the time they arrived in Asia Minor they were already Muslim, and after conquering these lands subjected the Christians to basically second-class citizenship. Why did such numbers then decide to convert from the ruling caste to the religion of the oppressed? What is for the greater economic benefits? The upward social mobility? The true word of Jesus Christ? Where is that great baptism in the sources? If our Albanian friends have some problems locating this, perhaps some Turkish contributors can enlighten us?
Why, in the Balkans the Albanians and Bosnians converted to Islam for the opposite reason mostly, yet these Turks somehow felt the need to go from the ruling to the ruled, the privileged to the un-privileged, the elite to the underfoot, and not just in isolated pockets but such vast numbers! After all 20%, or is it 80%, of all Athens apparently has Turkish surnames we are told!
I eagerly await this amazing rewrite of late Byzantine, Ottoman, and early twentieth-century history, and the opportunity to have all my misconceptions and Greek fuelled propaganda all cleared up.
etrified: