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Genetic study Ancient genomes from a rural site in Imperial Rome (1st–3rd cent. CE): a genetic jun

Angela said:
It came from the steppe present in both Italics and Etruscans.

Nothing at all to do with Slavs.
Click to expand...

ok ,:good_job:
thats what i thought
the most logical explanation
 
Pax Augusta said:
Baltic is already present in Etruscans and Latins. Were the Etruscans and Latins also descended from Slavic migrations that are later than them? It seems clear to me that the Baltic = Slavic equation is wrong.


R1015_Lazio_Rome_Iron_Age_Villanovan,34.16,9.13,33.08,0.00,20.98,1.79,0.00,0.27,0.00,0.59,0.00,0.00,0.00
R473_Civitavecchia_Etruscan._Iron_Age,33.38,12.03,31.63,0.41,18.38,3.34,0.34,0.42,0.06,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00
R474b_Civitavecchia_Etruscan._Iron_Age,35.67,12.22,25.57,5.16,17.48,1.51,0.00,0.00,1.10,0.59,0.00,0.71,0.00
R1016_Lazio_Rome_Iron_Age_Latini,35.91,7.69,33.00,1.06,20.82,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00,1.52,0.00,0.00,0.00
R1021_Lazio_Frosinone_Iron_Age_Latini,37.21,9.04,30.58,2.18,18.82,1.44,0.00,0.04,0.00,0.00,0.70,0.00,0.00
R851_Lazio_Rome_Iron_Age_Latini,34.22,14.60,34.26,1.01,15.44,0.30,0.00,0.00,0.18,0.00,0.00,0.00,0.00




Someone is there with possible haplogroups associated with Slavs but it is a small minority, nothing that can justify a mass replacement.
Click to expand...
Thank you for getting involved, Pax! Really useful information.

It seems my skepticism is proving to be useful (to myself) as of now. The authors of such papers don?t really seem to bother differentiating between Slavic and Baltic, yet proceed on calling it Slavic input.

It?s thanks to the similarities between Italy and Balkans/Greece that can we narrow down our options and come to better conclusions as to what happened during and after the fall of Rome.
 

[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: CZE_Early_Slav
Distance: 2.7478% / 0.02747845 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]46.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]40.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_Avar_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]13.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]Baltic_EST_BA[/TD]


First I tried to see how Early CZE Slav can be modeled.

Using these on source:
Baltic_LVA_HG,0.1292603,0.1004104,0.1802636,0.1972329,0.1064236,0.0560919,0.0083574,0.0207106,0.0524476,-0.0261394,-0.0046788,-0.0181151,0.0281434,-0.0053759,0.0355759,0.0480141,0.003072,0.0040856,-0.0059236,0.042325,0.0613526,0.0130531,-0.0262979,-0.1110549,0.0095949
DEU_Tollense_BA,0.1249778,0.137198,0.0769703,0.0599811,0.0502246,0.0175142,0.0094946,0.0060229,0.0126395,0.0009478,-0.0061708,-0.0025478,-0.0009811,0.0016239,-0.0020766,0.0029303,0.0019687,0.0030659,0.002803,0.0091044,0.0006239,0.0012861,-0.0034632,-0.0148455,0.0015568
HUN_Avar_Szolad,0.133742,0.12948,0.073727,0.057494,0.0373915,0.029144,0.0094,0.007269,0.004295,-0.018224,-0.001543,-0.006369,0.0102575,0.017753,-0.0138435,0.0007295,0.0002605,0.0034205,0.0055305,0.001313,0,-0.002782,0.010846,-0.0069285,0.001736
HUN_MA_Szolad,0.1268314,0.1386923,0.0474633,0.0296237,0.0347316,0.0087153,0.0026858,0.0034531,0.0025492,0.0060333,-0.0043729,0.0041963,-0.0096947,-0.0066944,0.009859,0.0043755,-0.0015227,0.0006923,0.0054185,0.0022109,0.0027452,0.0040408,0.0003433,0.0085467,-0.0012231
Baltic_EST_BA,0.1321485,0.1213556,0.0992205,0.111662,0.051671,0.040746,0.0158398,0.0204684,-0.0029042,-0.050607,0.0009094,-0.0182389,0.0359462,0.0400344,-0.0180239,0.0018297,0.0103654,-0.000684,-0.0013952,0.0046272,-0.0024957,-0.0062692,0.0106487,-0.017388,0.002359

After that, I added Early Slavic CZE on the Source as well to model modern populations. From reading some of the experts in modeling Slavs, Avar is very important sample. Meanwhile from reading the fora I know tollense like populations + yamnaya is how some ancient Balkans populations can be modeled. Mokrin etc...

Here are the results after adding early Slavic CZE as a component.




[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Belarusian
Distance: 1.3935% / 0.01393459 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]63.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_Avar_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]24.6[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]Baltic_EST_BA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]12.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]





[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Serbian
Distance: 3.7958% / 0.03795817 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]66.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]33.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]





[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Italian_Lombardy
Distance: 6.1244% / 0.06124430 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]100.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]





[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Italian_Tuscany
Distance: 6.9928% / 0.06992756 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]100.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]



[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Greek_Central_Macedonia
Distance: 7.0482% / 0.07048239 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]100.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]



[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Albanian
Distance: 7.1215% / 0.07121452 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]100.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]





[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: CZE_Early_Slav
Distance: 2.7478% / 0.02747845 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]46.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_MA_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]40.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_Avar_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]13.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]Baltic_EST_BA[/TD]





[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Belarusian
Distance: 1.3935% / 0.01393459 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]63.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_Avar_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]24.6[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]Baltic_EST_BA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]12.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]


If I in 5 minutes can come up with a better model than the published Danubian limes paper... what does that say? Either mediocrity, or agendas at work.




[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: Belarusian
Distance: 1.3935% / 0.01393459 | ADC: 0.25x RC
[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]63.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]HUN_Avar_Szolad[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]24.6[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]Baltic_EST_BA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]12.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]


Edit: Now of course this model is not optimized for best fit, just to see relationships, and to point out how the Danubian limes paper is decieving.

Further adding BGR_IA or Log02 to the source, improves both the comparative power and fit of the model.

If anyone wants to play with it:

https://g25vahaduo.genetics.ovh/G25ancient-averages-scaled.htm
Source:Baltic_LVA_HG,0.1292603,0.1004104,0.1802636,0.1972329,0.1064236,0.0560919,0.0083574,0.0207106,0.0524476,-0.0261394,-0.0046788,-0.0181151,0.0281434,-0.0053759,0.0355759,0.0480141,0.003072,0.0040856,-0.0059236,0.042325,0.0613526,0.0130531,-0.0262979,-0.1110549,0.0095949
DEU_Tollense_BA,0.1249778,0.137198,0.0769703,0.0599811,0.0502246,0.0175142,0.0094946,0.0060229,0.0126395,0.0009478,-0.0061708,-0.0025478,-0.0009811,0.0016239,-0.0020766,0.0029303,0.0019687,0.0030659,0.002803,0.0091044,0.0006239,0.0012861,-0.0034632,-0.0148455,0.0015568
HUN_Avar_Szolad,0.133742,0.12948,0.073727,0.057494,0.0373915,0.029144,0.0094,0.007269,0.004295,-0.018224,-0.001543,-0.006369,0.0102575,0.017753,-0.0138435,0.0007295,0.0002605,0.0034205,0.0055305,0.001313,0,-0.002782,0.010846,-0.0069285,0.001736
HUN_MA_Szolad,0.1268314,0.1386923,0.0474633,0.0296237,0.0347316,0.0087153,0.0026858,0.0034531,0.0025492,0.0060333,-0.0043729,0.0041963,-0.0096947,-0.0066944,0.009859,0.0043755,-0.0015227,0.0006923,0.0054185,0.0022109,0.0027452,0.0040408,0.0003433,0.0085467,-0.0012231
Baltic_EST_BA,0.1321485,0.1213556,0.0992205,0.111662,0.051671,0.040746,0.0158398,0.0204684,-0.0029042,-0.050607,0.0009094,-0.0182389,0.0359462,0.0400344,-0.0180239,0.0018297,0.0103654,-0.000684,-0.0013952,0.0046272,-0.0024957,-0.0062692,0.0106487,-0.017388,0.002359
CZE_Early_Slav,0.12862,0.129988,0.068259,0.046835,0.02739,0.013387,0.007285,0.014076,-0.001841,-0.018406,-0.000812,-0.004346,0.003717,0.007156,-0.010993,-0.003182,0.011604,-0.002027,-0.002388,-0.004752,0.005615,0.000618,0.001725,-0.000964,-0.006706
BGR_IA,0.126344,0.157407,0.007165,-0.051034,0.029852,-0.02259,0.00423,-0.001385,0.007772,0.032074,-0.001461,0.005695,-0.013974,-0.003028,-0.015065,-0.001458,0.01369,0.006968,0.006285,-0.014757,-0.006239,0.004699,-0.007888,0.003494,-0.008861



Target:

Any modern populations you like which can be lifted from the source tab of this https://g25vahaduo.genetics.ovh/G25modern-scaled-averages.htm :

In my models I used these pops as target.


Albanian,0.1181863,0.1417511,0.0155562,-0.0158808,0.0251586,-0.0074138,0.0033683,0.0018077,0.0006648,0.0161279,0.0011097,0.0015486,-0.0070986,0.0066059,-0.019295,-0.0041544,0.0081273,0.0014992,0.0082962,-0.0059402,-0.0055629,0.0007212,0.0024238,0.0021991,-0.0025248
Greek_Central_Macedonia,0.1194473,0.142473,0.0157725,-0.016492,0.0213432,-0.0035601,0.0020321,1e-07,0.0008782,0.0120812,0.0009934,0.0018424,-0.0014429,0.0070025,-0.016957,-0.0005459,0.0098095,8.94e-05,0.0050649,-0.0035531,-0.0078319,0.0015057,0.0032408,0.0005529,-0.0007256
Italian_Tuscany,0.1186036,0.1487413,0.0136014,-0.0204997,0.0261587,-0.0090546,-0.00047,-0.0013845,0.0074991,0.0238972,-0.0002273,0.0054552,-0.0118631,-0.0045965,-0.0023797,-0.0002917,0.0040332,0.0004815,0.0038463,-0.0023929,-0.0012063,0.0024647,-0.0010436,0.00388,-0.0015885
Italian_Lombardy,0.1245224,0.147861,0.0279822,-0.0137598,0.0327446,-0.007753,0.000658,0,0.0103898,0.0299232,-0.0025008,0.008932,-0.0143606,-0.0047066,-0.0008686,-0.0078758,-0.0083448,0.0017738,0.0034442,-0.004102,-0.002246,0.0012366,-0.0006656,0.0030602,0.0008382
Serbian,0.1273334,0.137229,0.040024,0.0148299,0.0314974,0.0045957,0.0048738,0.006672,-0.0011737,-7.9e-06,-0.0022946,-0.001251,0.0034128,0.012434,-0.0128875,-0.0008358,0.0040476,0.0005894,0.0043011,-0.0024468,-0.0083168,-0.0017151,0.0048925,0.000372,-0.0020097
Czech,0.1311592,0.1318625,0.0604843,0.0472574,0.038658,0.0189217,0.0063451,0.0086623,0.0046724,-0.0088874,-0.0016862,-0.0038965,0.0060493,0.011772,0.0017435,0.0009995,-0.0006419,-0.0001462,0.0035679,0.0028956,-0.001267,-0.0001617,0.0065132,0.0039302,0.0015935
Belarusian,0.1322625,0.1236239,0.0750219,0.0695957,0.0402331,0.0265691,0.0107321,0.0133226,-0.0002727,-0.0246017,-0.0026957,-0.0092119,0.0193259,0.0272309,-0.0112647,-0.0038009,-0.0009647,0.0003717,0.0041397,-0.0010504,-0.0042342,-0.0046081,0.0077235,-0.0068601,0.0006946
 
kingjohn said:
so is it a native elment to north east italy ?
or it arrived with germanic tribes ?
or others ?
Click to expand...

comparing only slavic to baltic for ............
North East Italians association is minimal slavic ......the baltic mix is due to the bronze-age amber road connection from baltic states ( usually west-baltic peoples )

about Germanic ( usually east germanic ) is minimal presence in BC times and but more in AD times ( with eastern germanics, ( ostrogoths ) ) and also it is swabian ( or southern german ) of the german group
 
@kingjohn

check the admixture of the lombards

you will find they are more associated with east-germanic then with west-germanic


slavic is only linked directly with the border area of Ukraine and Belarus .................all other slavic is linked with lingustic association and not genetic association
 
torzio said:
@kingjohn

check the admixture of the lombards

you will find they are more associated with east-germanic then with west-germanic
Click to expand...


thats why i think they probably also increased the baltic in the north of italy
afcorse it was minimal compare to the steppe movement
i understand from angela that there( LOMBARDS) y haplogroup was r-u106
but here i speak about autosomal influence not y haplogroup influence


p.s
by the way in northwest italy the baltic component is also between 10-16%
 
kingjohn said:
thats why i think they probably also increased the baltic in the north of italy
afcorse it was minimal compare to the steppe movement
i understand from angela that there( LOMBARDS) y haplogroup was r-u106
but here i speak about autosomal influence not y haplogroup influence


p.s
by the way in northwest italy the baltic component is also between 10-16%
Click to expand...



slavic is only linked directly with the border area of Ukraine and Belarus .................all other slavic is linked with linguistic association and not genetic association

Slavic and Baltic have association via language and that is only AD times
 
I wonder if the French will come out as 40% Early Slav too according to their ?scientific? methods and calculators.
ADMIXTURE-analysis-of-autosomal-SNPs-of-the-Western-Balkan-region-in-a-global-context-on.png


In my humble/amateur opinion, their so-called Slavic input in the Balkans = Steppe/Indo-European + Baltic + Gava/Hallstatt + Getae/Dacian/Free Dacian + East Germanic + Scythian/Sarmatian + Slavic. The first 3 probably constitute more than half of that component which increase with wave after wave of natural human migrations (war included).
 
Mass migrations bring their y along with them. If the y is under 5%, how much autosomal influence can there be?

The only way to pinpoint how much of X ancestry came to Y place in Z time is to use, for comparison, an ancient sample from Y place and Z time, and have some freaking context for the burial from archaeology and history, and then add a big dollop of COMMON SENSE.

It's not to use some calculator by Eurogenes based on modern people which he gerrymandered so that Poles would get a lot of whatever it was...

Any analysis based on his freaking calculator components is a joke and a complete waste of everybody's time, including that of the person playing with it.

I'll agree that Mordovians may not seem like the perfect sample to use for the "Slavs" who actually got to the Balkans, but then again, the Reich Lab has thousands of samples which are as of yet unpublished. I see that the "leaked" page from the Lazaridis paper also seems to use the Mordovians. Maybe it will turn out that those people aren't that far from what those farmers who arrived in the Balkans were like...

To refresh everyone's recollection, please take a look at the maps here and tell me how much Langobard influence there is in Italy, keeping in mind that every male sample found so far is U-106. You could also take a freebie and add I1 for other stray Germanics.

[TABLE="width: 974"]
[TR]
[TD="class: content"]

​
Introduction

The maps on this page represents the distribution of Human Y-chromosomal DNA (Y-DNA) haplogroups. A Y-DNA haplogroup is a group of men sharing the same series of mutations on their Y chromosome, which they inherited from a long line of common paternal ancestors. A few new mutations, known as SNP's, happen every generation. This allows to retrace the genealogical tree of humanity with great accuracy and see patterns in the distribution of shared historical lineages. Most major haplogroups are many thousands of years old, typically going back to the Bronze Age, Neolithic, Mesolithic or even Paleolithic. The deeper the subclade the more recent the shared ancestor. Classifying SNP's into a genealogical order is known as phylogenentics. Phylogenetic trees of European haplogroups are available here. The following maps were compiled with all the latest available Y-DNA data for each country. The maps are frequently updated when new data becomes available.

[TH="align: left"]Disclaimer: The accuracy of the regional data for France is particularly problematic due to the fact that France is the only country in the world where DNA tests are prohibited by law and punishable by heavy fines ( more information ).[/TH]


Haplogroup I (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup I in Europe
Haplogroup_I-borders.gif

Haplogroup I1 (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup I1 in Europe
Haplogroup_I1.png

Haplogroup I2a1 (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup I2a1 in Europe
Haplogroup_I2a.png

Haplogroup I2a2 (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup I2a2 in Europe
Haplogroup-I2b.png

Haplogroup R1 (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup R1 in Europe
Haplogroup_R-borders.gif

Haplogroup R1a (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup R1a in Europe, the Middle East & North Africa
Haplogroup-R1a.png
Distribution map of haplogroup R1a-M458 in Europe
Haplogroup-R1a-M458.png
Distribution map of haplogroup R1a-M558 (CTS1211) in Europe
Haplogroup-R1a-Y93.png
Distribution map of haplogroup R1a-Z93 in Eurasia
Haplogroup R1b (Y-DNA)

Distribution map of haplogroup R1b in Europe, the Middle East & North Africa

Distribution map of haplogroup R1b-S21 (U106) in Europe
Haplogroup-R1b-S21.png
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
 
torzio said:
@kingjohn

check the admixture of the lombards

you will find they are more associated with east-germanic then with west-germanic


slavic is only linked directly with the border area of Ukraine and Belarus .................all other slavic is linked with lingustic association and not genetic association
Click to expand...

Linguistically, the Lombards/Langobards may have started off North Germanic (Scandinavian) in speech but were West Germanic like Alemans and Bavarians when they reached Italy.
 
Very good point Angela. Did not know of the Lazaridis leak. Would love to see that page.

The thing is, that Mordovians were/are not Slavic... And as you say given the historical context nowhere near Western Slavic region from where south Slavs descended on the Balkans.

This might all be just the tip of the iceberg. Who knows what the other samples hold.

Muromian-map.png


I personally already had distaste for the model the first time I saw it, but then I saw a Mordovian member on another forum and his critique of the model. This guy is one of the more active members on the Slavic thread, from Russia. And his critique was in line with mine. So even accounting for any bias I might hold, my point is not stemming out of that bias.

Alas, you can try it with K13 as well, the results are similar. When you force a two pop model on a population, the calculator will do the best it can. When the two populations are not enough to account for the nuances, you get nonsensical answers such as some French being >50% early Slavic.

[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: French_Seine-Maritime
Distance: 4.5734% / 0.04573431 | ADC: 0.25x RC

[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]73.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]26.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]BGR_IA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]


[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: French_Provence
Distance: 3.7593% / 0.03759307 | ADC: 0.25x RC

[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]50.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]BGR_IA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]50.0[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]


[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: French_Pas-de-Calais
Distance: 4.9056% / 0.04905648 | ADC: 0.25x RC

[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]72.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]27.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]BGR_IA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]


[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: French_Paris
Distance: 4.9416% / 0.04941613 | ADC: 0.25x RC

[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]65.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]34.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]BGR_IA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]


[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: French_Occitanie
Distance: 4.9053% / 0.04905323 | ADC: 0.25x RC

[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]59.2[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]40.8[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]BGR_IA[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]


[TH="class: singleheader, colspan: 2, align: left"]Target: French_Nord
Distance: 4.3426% / 0.04342611 | ADC: 0.25x RC

[/TH]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]69.4[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]CZE_Early_Slav[/TD]

[TD="class: barchartmode1 nonselectable, colspan: 2"][/TD]

[TD="class: singleleftcolumn, align: right"]30.6[/TD]
[TD="class: singlerightcolumn"]BGR_IA[/TD]



I hope and know that Lazaridis paper will be per usual of high standard, and his f-stats usually don't suffer from PCA weaknessess. Do you know when the paper comes out?
 
As you can see below the K13 results are very consistent with G25(from my previous post).

3NKpDpw.png


K13 with Mordovins in place of Early Slavs from Moravia.

iTR0pPY.png
 
Vallicanus said:
Linguistically, the Lombards/Langobards may have started off North Germanic (Scandinavian) in speech but were West Germanic like Alemans and Bavarians when they reached Italy.
Click to expand...

Longobards after moving from scania sweden where part of the vindili confederation

 
Archetype0ne said:
rAUF05t.png

phU0DXz.png


No matter how you look at it... the Danubian lime paper methodology is trash, what I said by taking one look at it. And I believe Pax also had some similar feelings without further specifying what at the time.

https://imgur.com/a/jbYPD4H
Click to expand...

Very, very interesting since Calabria has plenty of Arbereshe which should have bumped its Savic component a bit. I totally agree with you that this methodology has something seriously wrong with it.
 
Archetype0ne said:
rAUF05t.png

phU0DXz.png

No matter how you look at it... the Danubian lime paper methodology is trash, what I said by taking one look at it. And I believe Pax also had some similar feelings without further specifying what at the time.
https://imgur.com/a/jbYPD4H
Click to expand...
Interesting:cool-v:
Can you try to model aschenazi jews( moldovan jews) and cretans
With this combination of
iron age bulgaria+ early slav CZE ?
 
kingjohn said:
Interesting:cool-v:
Can you try to model aschenazi jews( moldovan jews) and cretans
With this combination of
iron age bulgaria+ early slav CZE ?
Click to expand...

Sadly couldn't find the coordinates for Moldovan Jew.


But for your enjoyment :cool-v:

https://imgur.com/a/8SGIygh


You could probably guess my train of thought (algorithm) slide to slide.

This is after cleaning up the model, removing the marginally improving populations and also removing any modern populations.
I can explain the alorithm I used to come to this final table but doubt anyone much cares.

llKcQlQ.png
 
Archetype0ne said:
Sadly couldn't find the coordinates for Moldovan Jew.


But for your enjoyment :cool-v:

https://imgur.com/a/8SGIygh


You could probably guess my train of thought (algorithm) slide to slide.

This is after cleaning up the model, removing the marginally improving populations and also removing any modern populations.
I can explain the alorithm I used to come to this final table but doubt anyone much cares.

llKcQlQ.png
Click to expand...
Basically you can mix and match any nationality as the source combination.
 
Thank-you. Couldn't have said it better.
 
Archetype0ne said:
Sadly couldn't find the coordinates for Moldovan Jew.


But for your enjoyment :cool-v:

https://imgur.com/a/8SGIygh


You could probably guess my train of thought (algorithm) slide to slide.

This is after cleaning up the model, removing the marginally improving populations and also removing any modern populations.
I can explain the alorithm I used to come to this final table but doubt anyone much cares.

llKcQlQ.png
Click to expand...


Thanks kudos:good_job:
 
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