Angela
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what's wrong with L mtDNA anyway?
Absolutely nothing, fla88. This hobby attracts bizarre people.
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what's wrong with L mtDNA anyway?
Interestingly, the best of Italian culture is in Tuscany which definitely has more mtdna L than is usual in Europe.
Well, Angela, you certainly don't work 60+ plus hours a week now because you are never away from this site.
ITALIANS start most of the trouble on these websites by claiming they are "whiter" than Iberians.
Interestingly, the best of Italian culture is in Tuscany which definitely has more mtdna L than is usual in Europe.
Nobody1 is a valued member of this community, one who contributes research and analysis on many topics, from genetics, to history and archaeology, to linguistics, and in the context of discussions about many European countries.
This is in total contrast to you and your Iberian posse, who only grace us with your presence when Spain is mentioned, and then only in the hopes of proving that there is no African influence whatsoever in Iberia, an influence which is manifestly there for everyone to see in the mtDNA, yDNA, and particularly in the autosomal DNA. Your endeavor is therefore doomed to failure and merely makes you all look either dishonest or delusional, and ridiculous in either case. Ever heard of the term ethnic nihilists? I believe it, or something like it, was coined by Maciamo.
Oh, excuse me, if this current visit is any indication, you've moved beyond denying that these mtdna numbers exist (there is deafening silence about the autosomal results shown in recent papers, however) Now, you content yourselves with arguing that Italians have it too. Congratulations...we're seeing some progress in your deprogramming.
And please, spare us all the unending posts about papers that find mtDNA "L" in Italy. You've already directed Maciamo's attention to them in this thread, and have posted them again, and again, and again, in the hundreds, if not thousands, of boring, repetitive other posts on this topic here and elsewhere.
No one on this site, to my knowledge, denies that there is some mtDNA "L" in Italy. I certainly don't. I don't give a ***** behind about it, either. As to arguing about whether some particular study should show 1%, instead of 2-3%, with the aim of trying to somehow deny or minimize its existence whether in the abstract or in relationship to some other nationality, I can't imagine so demeaning myself.
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And while I'm at it, stop posting papers on the Basques for these kinds of comparisons. Pick up some of the recent autosomal studies on Europe, and look up the SSA percentages, the EEF percentages, you name it. For whatever reason, you have a different profile than even Pais Vasco...a small minority of your population anyway...deal with it.
Really, and I mean this sincerely...you and your friends and many of the young people whose posts I have read on the topic of genetics have been led astray. I try to excuse this kind of behavior on the grounds of what I presume is the extreme youth of you and your friends...but at your age I was working 60-70 hours a week, which didn't leave me any time to obsess on that kind of nonsense even had I been at all inclined to those kinds of viewpoints. If the economy prevents that, go to school, broaden your mind and your horizons. Study the culture of your own country...that should be the source of your pride, not how many "European" or northwest European or Celtic or whatever genes you have...
When you attack respected forum members such as Angela and Nobody1 because you don't like data they've published, I don't think it helps your credibility. And why do Iberians have a problem with the fact that they have a small but significant amount of "African" DNA? Why is that a problem for you? At the end of the day, all modern humans are very close cousins.
Well, Angela, you certainly don't work 60+ plus hours a week now because you are never away from this site.
ITALIANS start most of the trouble on these websites by claiming they are "whiter" than Iberians.
Interestingly, the best of Italian culture is in Tuscany which definitely has more mtdna L than is usual in Europe.
Apart from unusual Spain and Portugal - who have levels of mtDNA L as 18.2% (Alvarez et al 2010) and 22.0% (Pereira et al 2010) and other such high figures [page1 - post#19 / post#11] not found anywhere else in Europe - might also want to take note of the Eupedia map on page 1 and the data used for it;
For 22% and 18% are higher (basic math) than the 1.9% Tuscany (2.6% Volterra);
PS: The other "Celt"-Iberians (Knovas especially) might find your slander and assertions towards Angela very "helpful" and awesome, but i think its not very nice;
Well, Angela, you certainly don't work 60+ plus hours a week now because you are never away from this site.
ITALIANS start most of the trouble on these websites by claiming they are "whiter" than Iberians.
Interestingly, the best of Italian culture is in Tuscany which definitely has more mtdna L than is usual in Europe.
It's been a very long time since you were banned under the t.r.o.l.l.-nickname Wormhole. You can keep going on, don't worry.PS: The other "Celt"-Iberians (Knovas especially) might find your slander and assertions towards Angela very "helpful" and awesome, but i think its not very nice;
what's wrong with L mtDNA anyway?
I unmasked this guy. Actually he was half French and half Berber, nothing to do with the Portuguese or Brazilian people. He joins 23andme, and he had the brilliant idea to post the same exact things in both forums. Not difficult to catch him.
If someone can prove I was wrong, then I'm all ears. I published all the details and it was pretty evident, that guy wasn't so smart trying to hide his afrocentrist agenda.He wasn't slandering anyone, just pointing out the fact of what you and your friend obviously do around here.
Volterra is one of the ancient 12 etruscan cities
you answered the query
If someone can prove I was wrong, then I'm all ears. I published all the details and it was pretty evident, that guy wasn't so smart trying to hide his afrocentrist agenda.
Brazil and Italy are far apart, different sides of the world
That happened about two years ago, honestly I'm tired to search posts. But he was even taking part in the Dodecad Project, where he gave all his ancestry details (publicly available). I just had to compare the data with the 23andme profile, and then the threads started by this subject. No doubt it was the same person.Interesting. I don't remember seeing this. Where did the "unmasking" take place? I must have missed it. I always suspected he might be Brazilian, since Portuguese people usually don't have such obsessions about Spain and "African" DNA, but some Brazilians and other Latin Americans most definitely do.
I read East Africa as well.. then I read it was also present in ancient times in Middle East, Anatolia, Canary Islands and north Africa .. Some people also believe it is actually Eurasian
see post #5
Nobody1 is a troublemaker with high pretensions of being something of an "expert" (which he is plainly not) and with a very transparent agenda, nothing else, and has been so since the very start, his very firsts posts in these forums were in fact attempted manipulations and "spins" on this very subject of "African" DNA in Europe, something which very obviously immensely bothers him as long as the words "Africa" and "Italy" pop up in the same context ("coincidentally" so was the permanently banned "Wormhole", an Italian claiming to be Canadian.) Notice that the Tuscan user was not saying anything about Iberia or Iberians and was only wondering who brought these genetic markers to Italy, more specifically to Tuscany. But your pal Nobody1 just couldn't keep away from always trying to point fingers at "Iberians" and coming up with lies (like telling this user that his ancestry might be from Iberia supposedly to "explain" why he scores positive, as if no 100% native Italian could do so) and manipulations. His usual game.
My posts here about mtDNA L in Italy were simply in answer to those Nobody1, the usual manipulator/Spin-Doctor when it comes to this topic since way back when. So don't act so surprised.
Regarding your other complaints: as Vallicanus pointed out, you and some other Italian/Italian-descended users here are not really in any position to be criticizing other people in these forums since your behavior is not always the most exceptional either, and it is usually you who throw stones first, not the other way around. Do you want me to quote and post links to some of your provoking posts directed at Iberians in other threads to remind you of this fact?
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