bigsnake49
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Come back when there is a whole bunch of samples.
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the look you describe (above the list of percentages of common traits) doesn't evoke something typically African (SSA).
and I don't see on what they can produce these curious percentages.
earlier scientists of 19 th century can' t accept sumerians were blacks and said they were eurafrican people with a nose intermediary between those of africans and those of europeans, they also think sumerians were from australoid families but racism bias make them say sumerians were black red turanians
somesay they are ancestorsof ugrian langages with proof
but the truth show sumerians were australoid peoples:
the analysis of sumerian bones show thay are australoids
According to many experts, the Al-Ubaid people were ancestral to the Sumerians, or at least, to their culture. The Al-Ubaid skulls show a chaemaerrhine index with a mean value of 49.2. In other words, they had very broad noses. The skulls had both subnasal and alveolar prognathism, or fullness of the lower and upper lips. The average linear projection was 8 mm. for the skulls. Their heads were long and narrow.
Buxton and Rice found that of 26 Sumerian crania 17 were Australoid, five Austrics and four Armenoid. According to Penniman who studied skulls from Kish and other Sumerian sites, these three: the Australoid (Eurafrican), Austric and Armenoid were the "racial" types associated with the Sumerians. Here is Penniman's description of the Austric type found at Sumer:
"These people are of medium stature, with complexion and
hair like those of the Eurafrican, to which race they are
allied, dark eyes, and oval faces. They have small ill-filled
dolichocephalic skulls, with browridges poorly developed or
absent, bulging occiputs, orbits usually horizontal ellipses,
broad noses, rather feeble jaws, and slight sinewy bodies."
Both the Australoid and Austric type are found in India, where the former is known as Dravidian in its less extreme variety. Like all the different populations of India, both Dravidian and Austric are long-headed like most of the skulls at Sumer. As one goes further East, Austrics become mostly round-headed due possibly to the greater proportion of Mongoloid blood, and the Austronesians of the South Seas are primarily round-headed. Formerly, it was popular to ascribe the Australoid and Austric types to "dark Caucasoid" origin in the Mediterranean area
from a nationalist iranian pro shah site azargoshnasp.net seek recent_history/pan_turkist_philosophy/sumd/austricsumerian
BUT when we blacks say this people qualify us afrocentricists !!!!
for example this wikipedia wikipedia.org seek K 3364 which forget scientists have discovered bones and skulls closed to australoids proving sumerians were blacks but australoids and say sumerians are not negroid
i use this stage also to say negroid is a racist term coming from negre/ nigger the way blacks were called from 15th to 20 th centuries and it keeps on producing bias: like blacks have big nose stuff
i notice ASI/AASI and melanesians and australian aborigines who according to experts come from africa ( M haplogroups from african horn L3) are considered as blacks but not called like this
i think both them and africans are blacks and are brothers and should be both called melanoid instead of african blacks called negroid
THE SUMERIAN AND THE TAMOUL ur = city, town, village in Tamil, ur = town, town in Sumerian as = one, alone in Sumerian, as = prime / one, alone in Tamil kur = mountain in Sumerian, kur = name of hill tribes in Tamil and Dravidian, kori / koeum = mountain in Altaic language. tamil arukan arhus Sumerian "benevolent person".
Tamil tribes carry Q-M242 at 6%-8%. The Marsh Arabs (2%) are considered the population with the strongest link to ancient Sumerians. The diversity of sub-lineages of Q-M242 before 15.3 kya resulted from the differentiation of Q-M242 in South Siberia since the Paleolithic Age. The appearance of the Paleo-Indian population is part of the great human diffusion throughout the Eurasia after the Last Glacial Maximum. The Tamils and the Marsh Arabs are partly descendants of the Paleo-Indian population from South Siberia.
Thanks for answer.
Question: how many phenotypical alleles have been analysed on how many people in every pop?
Figure 2
Phylogeny of Y-chromosome haplogroups and their frequencies (%) in Marsh Arab and Iraqi populations.
Al Zahery et al. (2011) investigated the issue of the origin of Marsh Arabs, who are presumed to be the descendants of the ancient Sumerians. Their mtDNA and Y chromosome haplogroups showed that Marsh Arabs are predominantly of Middle Eastern origin, thus refuting the theory that Marsh Arabs are recent migrants from the Indian sub-continent. Haplogroup Q was found at minor frequencies from 0.7% to 2.1% among Marsh Arabs (Figure 2) and haplogroup Q-M25 (0.7%) and haplogroup Q-M378 (2.1%) are descendant haplogroups of Q-M242, which is a very common Y-DNA haplogroup among Native Americans (92.3% in Navajo.)
the royal tombs at ur have been long famous for their chilling scenario of young soldiers and courtesans who loyally took poison to die with their mistress. the authors investigate two of the original skulls with ct scans and propose a procedure no less chilling, but more enforceable. the victims were participants in an elaborate funerary ritual during which they were felled with a sharp instrument, heated, embalmed with mercury, dressed and laid ceremonially in rows.
They seems to be brutal w/o mercy:
The Great Death Pit: PG1237, with its 74 attendants, was the most spectacular of Ur’s royal tombs. Woolley called any burial without a tomb chamber a "death pit”. He named PG1237 “The Great Death Pit" because of the many bodies that were found within it. http://sumerianshakespeare.com/117701/117801.html
Dodgerland proved i was right, according to his site pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27417496/ sumerians were blacks and have 70 per cent genes of africans, 69 percent genes of adamanese who are from M haplogroup common to dravidians and australoids and 62 per cent genes of australian aborigines who are from M HAPLOGROUP TOO from L3 haplogroup of africaThe linguistic aspect of the thread is the most interesting one. The phenotypic aspect is very confuse in your post, and in your place I would not put too much faith in the ancient anthropologists works or I 'd try to distinct between the more or less serious ones and the strictly un reliable ones. BTW we are all cousins spite different and the term 'negroid' has nothing racist in it: it is based on Latin 'niger' which gave the French 'noir' in north and 'nègre' in south (Occitan) and 'negro' in Spanish, not based on 'nigger' which is an evolutive form of the same roots but took over centuries a contempt colour in the Anglo-Saxon word. It seems we all Eurasians are come from Africa, and you are not obliged to search more close cousins in some Asia dark populations; it's more complicated, and proximity is not tied only to external features so it isn't useful to construct some kind of affective feelings based on all that (your "brothers").
&: for an anthropologist, 'melanoid' is not sufficient (blackish skin), so you need an epithet (African melanoid and Asian melanoid) terms you can use if you want; personally when I say 'negroid' I think 'African melanoid', not 'nigger'. No offense, that said.
you say yourself both marsharabs and dravidians are partly descendants of paleo indians which we know are AASIsTamil tribes carry Q-M242 at 6%-8%. The Marsh Arabs (2%) are considered the population with the strongest link to ancient Sumerians. The diversity of sub-lineages of Q-M242 before 15.3 kya resulted from the differentiation of Q-M242 in South Siberia since the Paleolithic Age. The appearance of the Paleo-Indian population is part of the great human diffusion throughout the Eurasia after the Last Glacial Maximum. The Tamils and the Marsh Arabs are partly descendants of the Paleo-Indian population from South Siberia.
That's not my opinion, that's what genetics of the samples say:
rs4787778 AA Hooked nose
rs2058742 GG Downturned nose tip
rs17640804 TT Slim nostrils
rs3751074 GG Long nose bridge
Do you know what kind of nose alleles natufian had? It seems to me that the natufian had african skull genetically. If iran neolithic got hooked nose, anatolia farmer had the nose of a person in the middle.:
Anatolia HGs nose had an average long nose bridge and a down tuned nose tip. Other SNPs for nose are missing.
I once posted about the Natufians in another thread. Here are the similarities to modern populations again:
Middle East 75%
Swede 70%
Estonian 67% European 67% Ashkenazi Jewish 67% Northern South Asian 67%
Netherlands 65% United Kingdom 65%
Danish 61% Pygmy 61% African 61%
Basque 51%
Bedouin 50%
Sardinian 48%
Orcadian 46%
Adygei 45% Palestine 45%
French 44% Russian 44%
Italian 43%
Hungarian 39%
Turkish 36%
Ukrainian 21.4 %
IfI only use SNPs for skull physiology, it is only 50% matching with Africans.
About the nose again:
rs4787778 MISSING (nosebridge angle)
rs2058742 TT (Nose tip position is upturned)
rs17640804 TT (Breadth of nostrils is slim)
rs3751074 GG (Nose bridge lenght is long)
Seems that some People disliked that they or some of them had an upturned nose tip, because its not matching with their ideas of how they should look.
Hooked nose bridge with upturned nose tip:https://www.drhilinski.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/FinesseRhino196OblLatBefore1Diagram1.jpg
Straight nose bridge with upturned nose:https://i.pinimg.com/originals/45/80/20/45802075e38f029981bd778c81956d44.jpg
Hooked nose bridge with down turned nose tip:https://rhinoplasty-blog.com/wp-con...e-Historically-Better-Known-As-Roman-Nose.jpg
We don’t know that kind of nose bridge type they had, only nose tip.
you say yourself both marsharabs and dravidians are partly descendants of paleo indians which we know are AASIs
so marsharabs were not the first people of mesopotamia, they inherited from a people which were much older than them and we know axxording to bible first mesopotamians were black people
(fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fichier:Table_of_Nations.jpg ) the Nimrod people, Nimrod was a black a koushite with a sumerian name NIM which means high in sumerian and is closed of Nim in dravidian which is linked to something high , nimir meaning arise
When we know the map of ASI/AASI genetic presence qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-8a1e2300d2869577d4ed9ae64e0898d3 show ASI/AASI ( dravidians and australoids) predate marsharabs in irak because they were there since 50000 years old and inhabited irak , iran till india and burmese frontier and were known to be black , so sumerians were blacks , ASI/AASIs , dravidians and australoid folks, this explaining the similarity of sumerian with austric and dravidians language
interesting
and with who it match the best in terms of skull physiology ?
Danish 80%
Hungarian 75% Swede 75%
Middle East 67%
Like I said in the Natufian thread, they seemed to have a connection to the founder population of SHG. Maybe this is based on interbreeding with LGM survivors or the idea of a Basal Eurasian, or whatever.
Compared to ancient populations Natufians had the highest match with Iberomaurusians in physiological traits.
There where also anthropologist in the last century who connected skulls found in denmark(The Borreby type) to Mechta Afalou skulls, this could be a coincidence, but maybe they are really much similar, according to genetics of skull morphology.
Danish 80%
Hungarian 75% Swede 75%
Middle East 67%
Like I said in the Natufian thread, they seemed to have a connection to the founder population of SHG. Maybe this is based on interbreeding with LGM survivors or the idea of a Basal Eurasian, or whatever.
Compared to ancient populations Natufians had the highest match with Iberomaurusians in physiological traits.
There where also anthropologist in the last century who connected skulls found in denmark(The Borreby type) to Mechta Afalou skulls, this could be a coincidence, but maybe they are really much similar, according to genetics of skull morphology.
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