Christians Have Gone Too Far

Doc

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I am royally pissed right now. I'm about this close to renouncing my religion. This is complete BS. The conservative Christians have finally crossed the line with me. I've sat by quietly watching the debate go back and forth, but I think it's about time I start sending some angry letters to senators. YOU CANNOT PUT FAITH FIRST BEFORE REASON ON LITAGATION IN THIS COUNTRY! This is crap! I mean I'm not a Democrat, but I think you'll see where I'm coming from with this. Read this article below, and you'll know what I mean.

New York Times

WASHINGTON, April 14 - As the Senate heads toward a showdown over the rules governing judicial confirmations, Senator Bill Frist, the majority leader, has agreed to join a handful of prominent Christian conservatives in a telecast portraying Democrats as "against people of faith" for blocking President Bush's nominees.

Fliers for the telecast, organized by the Family Research Council and scheduled to originate at a Kentucky megachurch the evening of April 24, call the day "Justice Sunday" and depict a young man holding a Bible in one hand and a gavel in the other. The flier does not name participants, but under the heading "the filibuster against people of faith," it reads: "The filibuster was once abused to protect racial bias, and it is now being used against people of faith."

Organizers say they hope to reach more than a million people by distributing the telecast to churches around the country, over the Internet and over Christian television and radio networks and stations.

Dr. Frist's spokesman said the senator's speech in the telecast would reflect his previous remarks on judicial appointments. In the past he has consistently balanced a determination "not to yield" on the president's nominees with appeals to the Democrats for compromise. He has distanced himself from the statements of others like the House majority leader, Tom DeLay, who have attacked the courts, saying they are too liberal, "run amok" or are hostile to Christianity.

The telecast, however, will put Dr. Frist in a very different context. Asked about Dr. Frist's participation in an event describing the filibuster "as against people of faith," his spokesman, Bob Stevenson, did not answer the question directly.

"Senator Frist is doing everything he can to ensure judicial nominees are treated fairly and that every senator has the opportunity to give the president their advice and consent through an up or down vote," Mr. Stevenson said, adding, "He has spoken to groups all across the nation to press that point, and as long as a minority of Democrats continue to block a vote, he will continue to do so."

Some of the nation's most influential evangelical Protestants are participating in the teleconference in Louisville, including Dr. James C. Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family; Chuck Colson, the born-again Watergate figure and founder of Prison Fellowship Ministries; and Dr. Al Mohler, president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary.

The event is taking place as Democrats and Republicans alike are escalating their public relations campaigns in anticipation of an imminent confrontation. The Democratic minority has blocked confirmation of 10 of President Bush's judicial nominees by preventing Republicans from gaining the 60 votes needed to close debate, using the filibuster tactic often used by political minorities and most notoriously employed by opponents of civil rights.

Dr. Frist has threatened that the Republican majority might change the rules to require only a majority vote on nominees, and Democrats have vowed to bring Senate business to a standstill if he does.

On Thursday, one wavering Republican, Senator John McCain of Arizona, told a television interviewer, Chris Matthews, that he would vote against the change.

"By the way, when Bill Clinton was president, we, effectively, in the Judiciary Committee blocked a number of his nominees," Mr. McCain said.

On Thursday the Judiciary Committee sent the nomination of Thomas B. Griffith for an appellate court post to the Senate floor. Democrats say they do not intend to block Mr. Griffith's nomination.

That cleared the way for the committee to approve several previously blocked judicial appointees in the next two weeks.

The telecast also signals an escalation of the campaign for the rule change by Christian conservatives who see the current court battle as the climax of a 30-year culture war, a chance to reverse decades of legal decisions about abortion, religion in public life, gay rights and marriage.

"As the liberal, anti-Christian dogma of the left has been repudiated in almost every recent election, the courts have become the last great bastion for liberalism," Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council and organizer of the telecast, wrote in a message on the group's Web site. "For years activist courts, aided by liberal interest groups like the A.C.L.U., have been quietly working under the veil of the judiciary, like thieves in the night, to rob us of our Christian heritage and our religious freedoms."

Democrats accused Dr. Frist of exploiting religious faith for political ends by joining the telecast. "No party has a monopoly on faith, and for Senator Frist to participate in this kind of telecast just throws more oil on the partisan flames," said Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York.

But Mr. Perkins stood by the characterization of Democrats as hostile to faith. "What they have done is, they have targeted people for reasons of their faith or moral position," he said, referring to Democratic criticisms of nominees over their views of cases about abortion rights or public religious expressions.

"The issue of the judiciary is really something that has been veiled by this 'judicial mystique' so our folks don't really understand it, but they are beginning to connect the dots," Mr. Perkins said in an interview, reciting a string of court decisions about prayer or displays of religion.

"They were all brought about by the courts," he said.

Democrats, for their part, are already stepping up their efforts to link Dr. Frist and the rule change with conservatives statements about unaccountable judges hostile to faith.

On Thursday, Mr. Schumer released an open letter calling on Dr. Frist to denounce such attacks. "The last thing we need is inflammatory rhetoric which on its face encourages violence against judges," he wrote.

Picture of Flyer:

15judges_184.gif


Doc:angryfire:
 
I think I understand where you're coming from Doc. All of sudden everything in this country has now become, "bible, bible, bible." It makes me sick, too. I don't understand why some conservatives see Democrats as anti-faith. I don't know, really. I guess some of these conversatives completely forgot about separation of church and state. :clueless:
 
Ma Cherie said:
I don't understand why some conservatives see Democrats as anti-faith.

It seems to me to be a case of using highly emotional rhetoric to motivate your support base, which in the case of conservatives seems to be mostly Christians. It wouldn't be politics if it didn't involve emotional appeals that lack any sound logic or basis in fact. :sick:
 
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Obviously we just need to get some more liberal bleeding heart Christians. Sign me up.
 
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A fundamentalist Christian country. We haven't had one of those since the Crusades :D
On a serious note it seem to be more difficult in the US for the Church and State to seperate their policies. It could be worring for the number of non-christians who live in the US. Let's hope your next president isn't as religious as GW

I suggest you move to a more liberal country Doc. The US government seem to be giving you high blood pressure. :wave:
 
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Mycernius said:
A fundamentalist Christian country. We haven't had one of those since the Crusades :D
On a serious note it seem to be more difficult in the US for the Church and State to seperate their policies. It could be worring for the number of non-christians who live in the US. Let's hope your next president isn't as religious as GW

I suggest you move to a more liberal country Doc. The US government seem to be giving you high blood pressure. :wave:

Where do you suggest I move to? :clueless:

Doc:ramen::happy:
 
Goodness, everything seemed fine here in the US when things were more secular. :(
 
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Doc said:
Where do you suggest I move to? :clueless:

Doc:ramen::happy:
Somewhere in Europe. The Swedes are very liberal. Can bit a bit cold though and a little on the expensive side. The Netherlands are another good bet. Pot can be smoked in licenced coffe shops. Plus the drinking age in European countries are lower than the US. You could always consider Canada. Nice country, pleasent people, proper health care and you can still play with your guns.. you could always start a thread on 'Suggest a country I could live in' :)
 
Mycernius said:
Somewhere in Europe. The Swedes are very liberal. Can bit a bit cold though and a little on the expensive side. The Netherlands are another good bet. Pot can be smoked in licenced coffe shops. Plus the drinking age in European countries are lower than the US. You could always consider Canada. Nice country, pleasent people, proper health care and you can still play with your guns.. you could always start a thread on 'Suggest a country I could live in' :)

Canada sounds nice. There are even game development companies in that region.:) Maybe I should start a thread on where to live. Chances are 10 years from now I won't be living in America anymore. This country is going to Hell in a handcart way too fast for my tastes.

Doc:ramen::happy:
 
I never understood why Christians were so uptight about stuff. Jesus was a frickin Communist for chrissakes (yes, pun intended). A true Christian would be as liberal as they come.
 
MeAndroo said:
I never understood why Christians were so uptight about stuff. Jesus was a frickin Communist for chrissakes (yes, pun intended). A true Christian would be as liberal as they come.
You can't really define Jesus as a Christian. He was born a Jew and he probably was just trying to change the Jewish faith into something more liberal at the time. Unfortunatly he upset the Jewish leaders and suffered the consquences. So for his time Jesus was a liberal Jew.
 
nothing for ungood- soon christian bible needs sticker "historic fairytale- freely invented"*

PG-16 because illustration of painful punishment, alcohol reference, suggestive themes**, and bigotery.

*very small: "jesus really lived. the wonders he did, and his supernatural origins are freely made up for illustration purpose. for the reason to talk in images. these images refer to circumstances not longer part of the daily life."

**suggestive: the concept the reader would be a sinner, without doing sin previously. some people misunderstand it as a command to perform sins.

alcohol reference: "if wine does not suit you, try one of these beer brands: millers genuine draft, fosters australian beer or stella artois, belgian brand. most countries laws do not allow to drink alcohol under the age of 16."

bigotry: the wine = the blood. the beer = the ****? this is slanderous, of course. imagine a story with beer instead wine. jesus would not have gone the way to the cross. please do not tell this to faithful people. they consider such things as sin.
 
Mycernius said:
You can't really define Jesus as a Christian. He was born a Jew and he probably was just trying to change the Jewish faith into something more liberal at the time. Unfortunatly he upset the Jewish leaders and suffered the consquences. So for his time Jesus was a liberal Jew.

Tisk, tisk, tisk. I didn't think you were that pagan enough Mycernius to get into the defining of Jesus. :)

Doc:ramen::happy:
 
Thanks for trashing my faith guys. I am so glad you saved my from beleiving such a remarkably simplistic religion. One day hope to be as enlightened and faithless as you guys are. (this is sarcastic-- I appologize... at least a little.)
 
sabro said:
Thanks for trashing my faith guys. I am so glad you saved my from beleiving such a remarkably simplistic religion. One day hope to be as enlightened and faithless as you guys are. (this is sarcastic-- I appologize... at least a little.)

Sure you are. :eek:kashii: When you have 84% of the country following the Christian Right on decision making, I think it's about time to re-evaluate the religious majority of this country.

Doc:ramen::happy:
 
Doc said:
Tisk, tisk, tisk. I didn't think you were that pagan enough Mycernius to get into the defining of Jesus. :)

Doc:ramen::happy:
That's me, A great big hairy pagan. I prefer heathen actually. :)
Actually you can call anyone who doesn't follow the teachings of God (Islam, Christainlty and Judiasm) satanists. That is the proper defination of Satanist, not someone who follows the devil.
 
Mycernius said:
That's me, A great big hairy pagan. I prefer heathen actually. :)
Actually you can call anyone who doesn't follow the teachings of God (Islam, Christainlty and Judiasm) satanists. That is the proper defination of Satanist, not someone who follows the devil.

Just make sure nobody declares jihad on you!:D

Doc:ramen::happy:
 
You can't really define Jesus as a Christian. He was born a Jew and he probably was just trying to change the Jewish faith into something more liberal at the time. Unfortunatly he upset the Jewish leaders and suffered the consquences. So for his time Jesus was a liberal Jew.

I disagree, but I don't think we're talking about the same thing. Sure Jesus was a Jew, but he's SUPPOSED to be the shining example for people of a Jesuit faith isn't he? WWJD anyone? If you aren't expected to act in a manner similar to Jesus, why worship him? If Jesus and God are one, his actions directly reflect the desires of his father, which would lead me to expect that people observing a faith along the lines of Christianity would attempt to emulate Jesus. Unfortunately, the Catholic Church and the religious right have become hopelessly and possibly inexorably connected to images of good ole boys and their conservative nature, at least in this country and in my opinion.

Then again, religiousness is also how any smart politician would strive to get the hispanic and parts of the black vote.
 
Good response AnDroo.

You wouldn't call the founder of a faith a follower of himself. Also I don't think "Jesuit" in that context is the right word. Politics is about power, influence, and money. Christianity is about faith. Not the same thing.
 
Christ is Powerful, has great influence and provides your needs.

if government and citizens would Hold God high where he belongs

he will bless you as a nation.

America has been blessed for a long time but the more we take out God and the bible the more we just see immorality and a nation destined for hell.

America needs More God and less immorality practice
 

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