Gencove

Why do these groups have populations that are far apart from each other? Like southwest Europe has Sardinians who are far from everyone else and east med goes from Cypriots to Bulgarians.

I kinda brought this up before but there are still some holes to patch up. Lets consider the south west euro group, does it just take everything that's common between Sardinians, Spaniards etc and deem this pattern of genes "Southwest European"?
 
Now i got
Southwestern Europe 46%
Northern and Central Europe 28%
Northern Italy 12%
Eastern Mediterranean 11%

I still think it needs more work... Also Eastern Mediterranean doesn't make much sense??
 
Now i got
Southwestern Europe 46%
Northern and Central Europe 28%
Northern Italy 12%
Eastern Mediterranean 11%

I still think it needs more work... Also Eastern Mediterranean doesn't make much sense??

Click to enlarge...

This is SE Europe:

View attachment 9654
Gencove-Eastern Med.jpg
This is Southwest Europe: it includes the southern half of France and Northwest Italy. Basically, I could just add this percentage to my North Italian.

View attachment 9656
Gencove SouthWest Europe.jpg
This is northern Italy. It overlaps with North Central Europe, which is probably what brought those numbers down for me.
Gencove-Nortern Italy.jpg

View attachment 9655

Maybe it is sort of right for me.

@Sile,
Thanks.

It works like any other Admixture program...it finds clusters. Some of the clusters overlap, which is indeed the reality.
 
Last edited:
I usually score Italian in every calc in some form or another. 14 Italian over all with LivingDNA. I wonder what is so off with their algorithm?

In AncestryDNA for instance, their main site has be as 84% Albania/Greece/Turkey, 15% North-East Italy/Croatia/Bosnia and 1% Finnish(LOL). I am surprised by the huge South-West Euro for the Ancestry upload. My Fathers by comparison(with 23andme) is 88% Eastern Mediterranean and 12% South-West European.

Someone mentioned people with Sardinian like admixtures are scoring South-West Europe in Gencove. It would make sense, since theres an obvious(for whatever reason) shift towards Sardinia for my father and myself.

I don't think the problem with the Living DNA results necessarily has anything to do with their algorithm. They have uploaded a huge amount of samples from either the English or Irish Atlas, maybe both. The rest of their samples are an order of magnitude smaller. That is going to make everyone who isn't English or Irish look more "western".
 
My results on Gencove.

61%
Northern and Central Europe
26%
Eastern Mediterranean
7%
Northeast Europe
3%
Northern Italy
2%
Central Asia
1%
Southwestern Europe

I'm Hungarian from Transylvania

Gesendet von meinem SM-G903F mit Tapatalk
 
This is SE Europe:

View attachment 9654

This is Southwest Europe: it includes the southern half of France and Northwest Italy. Basically, I could just add this percentage to my North Italian.

View attachment 9656

This is northern Italy. It overlaps with North Central Europe, which is probably what brought those numbers down for me.


View attachment 9655

Maybe it is sort of right for me.

@Sile,
Thanks.

It works like any other Admixture program...it finds clusters. Some of the clusters overlap, which is indeed the reality.
Well ok thanks, but grouping cypriots with Bulgarians and Sardinians with anyone else is insanity.
 
Bulgarians and a lot of other groups in the Balkans have quite a bit more "Caucasus/Eastern Anatolia" than Northern Italians and Tuscans. They have more SW Asian than Northern Italians on some calculators, and just a bit less than Tuscans. I guess there was a migration of Samaritans to Bulgaria as well as Toscana. :)

So much disinformation and deliberately slanted data is published on internet sites that the reality that the Balkans, and not just southern Italy and Greece share a lot with places like Cyprus and eastern Anatolia is virtually unknown.

See, for example, the percentages for these clusters in Dodecad K12b:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...0SRE5L6ED2osPs9M/edit?hl=en_US&hl=en_US#gid=0

This is why Gencove, for instance, includes not only Southern Italy, but the Balkans and Greece in its "Eastern Mediterranean" cluster, and not just parts of Anatolia.
 
Well ok thanks, but grouping cypriots with Bulgarians and Sardinians with anyone else is insanity.


Insanity :LOL:

If you add a bit NorthEast Europe gens to Sardinian, you will have Bulgarian or add redsea admixture, you have Cypriot


Yeah similarity not as much as green-red apple. Mostly like Apple and Pear so on the less selective eyes, they are same.

--------------------------

As a 71 % Eastern Med in Gencove, I can say that they have killed Caucasia and NorthEast Europe.
 
Thanks Angela and Boreas, I'll think more into those posts later!
 
I'm pleased that a specific cluster has been inserted for Northern Italy. But now my results diverge considerably from the previous ones
5c5e50f8480b45909219c2f505f5c826.jpg

mine upgraded yesterday.
,

.
starting to get closer to yfull data which has my snp dated as 1460BC.
Yfull matches for me relating to this gencove data
1x Hessian germany
3x walloon and lorraine france ...........these could be close relatives to each other
1x south tyrol italy
1x spain Pyrenees area Mediterranean side
.
note: central asia is 1% ..........other sites have me as 0.8% for it

How did you people get your maps to post?
For what it's worth:
  • 57%Northern Italy
  • 29%Southwestern Europe
  • 7%Northern and Central Europe
  • 7%Anatolia, Caucasus, Iranian Plateau
It's not bad, but if I didn't know my identity, this wouldn't tell me. The Northern Europe numbers go down, and the Anatolia, Caucasus shows up. Have no idea what that means.

Mine (FTDNA / 23andMe)

Northern and Central Europe: 44% / 43%
Eastern Mediterranean: 29% / 33%
Northern Italy: 23% / 13%
Southwestern Europe: 4% / 8%
Ashkenazi Jewish: 0% / 2%
Central Asia: 0% / 1%

Father (23andMe)

Northern Italy: 32%
Northern and Central Europe: 31%
Southwestern Europe: 16%
Eastern Mediterranean: 11%
Ashkenazi Jewish: 5%
Northern British Isles: 4%
Central Asia: 1%

Mother (23andMe)

Northern and Central Europe: 33%
Eastern Mediterranean: 28%
Northern Italy: 28%
Southwestern Europe: 11%
 
Mine (FTDNA / 23andMe)

Northern and Central Europe: 44% / 43%
Eastern Mediterranean: 29% / 33%
Northern Italy: 23% / 13%
Southwestern Europe: 4% / 8%
Ashkenazi Jewish: 0% / 2%
Central Asia: 0% / 1%

Father (23andMe)

Northern Italy: 32%
Northern and Central Europe: 31%
Southwestern Europe: 16%
Eastern Mediterranean: 11%
Ashkenazi Jewish: 5%
Northern British Isles: 4%
Central Asia: 1%

Mother (23andMe)

Northern and Central Europe: 33%
Eastern Mediterranean: 28%
Northern Italy: 28%
Southwestern Europe: 11%
Dang! North Italy as low as 13 percent!

If this doesnt get a reaction from Angela.. :grin::grin:

seriously, this thing is garbage
 
This is SE Europe:

View attachment 9654

This is Southwest Europe: it includes the southern half of France and Northwest Italy. Basically, I could just add this percentage to my North Italian.

View attachment 9656

This is northern Italy. It overlaps with North Central Europe, which is probably what brought those numbers down for me.


View attachment 9655

Maybe it is sort of right for me.

@Sile,
Thanks.

It works like any other Admixture program...it finds clusters. Some of the clusters overlap, which is indeed the reality.
I can't see the Attachments Angela
 
Was 38% Southwestern Europe, Now is 4%, and 34% North Italy.
 
If someone who had been adopted ran their data through this calculator, he/she would never figure it out.

I have said repeatedly that there is more genetic variation north of Rome than there is south of it, and I'm fully aware of the east/west structure in Italy, as well as the north/south one.

However, these companies are all marketing to the general population: therefore, you shouldn't need to have spent years studying population genetics to figure it out.

I'm done with this stuff.
 
Dang! North Italy as low as 13 percent!

If this doesnt get a reaction from Angela.. :grin::grin:

seriously, this thing is garbage

Well, if you know a lot about Population Genetics, and how Admixture works, and take a careful look at their clusters you can figure it out.

Since SW Europe and NW Italy overlap you can add that, and since North Central Europe overlaps Northern Italy you could add some of that, and since half of Italy is within Eastern Med you could add that. That would be the "Italian" total. Get the idea?

The point, as I said upthread, is that I only know these things because I've been studying population genetics for eight years. The calculators are being used by people who don't have a clue about any of these things, and all it's going to do is confuse them, as well as bringing population genetics into disrepute.
 
Mine (FTDNA / 23andMe)
Northern and Central Europe: 44% / 43%
Eastern Mediterranean: 29% / 33%
Northern Italy: 23% / 13%
Southwestern Europe: 4% / 8%
Ashkenazi Jewish: 0% / 2%
Central Asia: 0% / 1%
Father (23andMe)
Northern Italy: 32%
Northern and Central Europe: 31%
Southwestern Europe: 16%
Eastern Mediterranean: 11%
Ashkenazi Jewish: 5%
Northern British Isles: 4%
Central Asia: 1%
Mother (23andMe)
Northern and Central Europe: 33%
Eastern Mediterranean: 28%
Northern Italy: 28%
Southwestern Europe: 11%
it only looks like 23andme pulls your north italy down to 13% ...ftdna has you higher.

it also looks like the more west you go from Veneto/friuli/trentino towards turin and Genoa the more higher the North Italian % becomes
 
If someone who had been adopted ran their data through this calculator, he/she would never figure it out.

I have said repeatedly that there is more genetic variation north of Rome than there is south of it, and I'm fully aware of the east/west structure in Italy, as well as the north/south one.

However, these companies are all marketing to the general population: therefore, you shouldn't need to have spent years studying population genetics to figure it out.

I'm done with this stuff.
Edit: sorry guys, I was wrong, we cool
 
Last edited:
The east and west doesn't seem all that related, the west has stronger ties to Iberia and the east has stronger ties to Greece/Balkans going by what's in this thread.

That's a vast over-generalization, and illogical.

To say that there's some structure east/west doesn't mean they're "not all that related."

This is almost "Fire-Haired" type reasoning.

The north was not only subject to some differing migration flows, it was also fragmented politically, with resulting isolation from one another and some drift. The south was, for most of the last 1000 years, ruled as a political entity.
 
Some close similarities between my Ancestry dot com results and this new update from Gencove. Same with my mother.

Ancestry:
Europe West 47%
Iberian Peninsula 25%
Scandinavia 13%
Great Britain 6%

Gencove:
Northern and Central Europe 46%
Southwestern Europe 27%
Scandinavia 12%
Northern British Isles 6%

Mom Ancestry:
Iberian Peninsula: 32%
Great Britain: 23%
Scandinavia: 17%

Mom Gencove:
Southwestern Europe: 34%
Northern British Isles: 23%
Scandinavia: 17%
 
Last edited:

This thread has been viewed 60477 times.

Back
Top