Germanic tribes - founders of modern nations

[sparkey]

Well, the subclade I1b2 is also considered Germanic, and parts of Spain, like Castille has 19% or Cadiz(Andalusia) 10.7%, and Cantabria has 8% of R1a. But besides this, for germanic influence (since Visigoths were not the only the Germanics here, there were also Vandals, Suevi, Franks, etc) I would make :

Q + I1 + I2b + R1a + R1b-U106 = 0.28 + 3.35 + 2.24 + 2 + 7.7 = 15.25

I was using Maciamo's estimates and your I1 estimate is higher. I actually think that you're justified in making it higher... the 0% he gives for Andalusia, for example, is obviously wrong.

I think small amounts of the Q and the R1a and maybe some of the others were introduced before the Migration Period... it's hard to estimate how much. The ratio also doesn't fit what we expect from the Visigothic admixture either, it looks more West Germanic. Any ideas of the relative contribution of the groups? Because if we suppose that a little bit of the admixture you gave (say 1%) is pre-Germanic to Iberia and each that you listed contributed about a quarter of the Germanic input, we end up with (15.25-1)/4 = 3.6% Visigothic influence.

 

[Wilhelm2]

At Eurogenes the North-Atlantic + North-European + Baltic + Finnic = 58.7 % (Portugal = 57.7% basically the same).
In the most recent run, the West-European + Northwest-European + East-European + North-European + Baltic = 67.6 %
The rest is South-European. Basically a 60/40 mix of Nortwest and South.

 

[Reinaert]

Hmm..
All is pure speculation. Who says the Germanic or even the Celtic tribes all have identical Ydna?
People migrated all over Europe, and could easily form clans from different family lines.
Look what even happens in areas like New Guinea until this day. Clans are formed out of 2 or 3 families.
Living together, and have different functions. One family are hunter/gatherers/warriors and another family are primitive farmers.

Looking at Western Europe the Franks were the warrior tribe, that took control of the power, but it's easy to understand that the Celts in the area formed a large part of the army. In a few generations nobody would know the difference between them.

There are at least similarities between the legends around Arthur and Charlemagne.

 

[Anton Bear's den]

Russia was founded by the Swedish tribe known as the Rus

Better to say "was involved" in process of formation. Russia originally was created by Slavs, Finno-Ugric peoples and Varangians. First capital Novgorod was founded by Slavic & Finno-Ugric tribes, later they asked varangian konung Rurik to reign.

map - 1015 year

Ruins of viking fortress near Novgorod, google "Рюриково городище"

 

[weissmacht]

Modern Nations founded by Germanic peoples-England,Great Britain if you include southern scotland and some of the protestants of Northern Ireland,Kingdom of the Netherlands-which included the Dutch as well as the Flemish of Belgium,Modern Netherlands-Holland,United States,Australia,SouthAfrica,Rhodesia,Canada-along with the French,the Scandinavian nations,Austria,Alsace in France,Normandy in France,Lombardy Italy,Andalusia Spain,Danzig or Gdansk Poland,Switzerland,and some states started by the Rus-Vikings in Eastern Europe.Probably much more too.

 

[weissmacht]

I am not saying you are wrong about this-I dont presume to know hardly anything about the history of Spain but if Gallicia in Spain was founded by a Germanic tribe then why is it called Gallicia?That name refers to Gauls and the Celtic peoples who lived in Spain.

 

[weissmacht]

if the Germanic tribes had little to do with the founding of Scotland then why is Scots a Germanic-Angle language??????Why are the LOWLANDS more closely related to the Anglo-Saxons and Nromans than the Celts?And Why do SOOOO many Highland Clans claim and actually have ALOT of VIKING ancestry????The Hebridean Celts of Scotland were known as Galloglasses to the Irish-that refers to thier mixed Norse-Celtic culture as oppoesd to a predominantly Celtic one.You really dont know much about the history of Scotland-almost every Scot from the Western Isles to the Orkneys to the Lowlands have Germanic ancestry mixed with Celtic.

 

[weissmacht]

Actually you are COMPLETELY WRONG about Scotland

There are various threads on the forum, but does anyone have a list of modern nations that can be said to have been founded by the Germanic tribes?

I reckon England - via the Anglo Saxons - obviously Germany, the Netherlands. I'm sure there are others.

Thanks, Chris

I can only tell you that they certainly did'nt play in significant part in the foundation of Scotland. While the English and the Germans are gentically speaking almost identical, as I understand it, there is a much larger distance between Scots and Germans.

The Irish called the Hebridean Scots-Galloglases meaning Foriegn Gaels referring to thier mixed Norse-Celtic culture and ancestry too.Many Many Highland clans claim Viking ancestry and as dna tests show many many Highlanders have ALOT of Viking ancestry from the Western Isles to Mid-Highlands to the Orkneys.The Lowlands speak Scots-which is a Germanic dialect taken from te Angles who settled heavily in the Lowlands.The culture of the Lowlands is historically closeley related to the Anglo-Saxon and Norman cultrures mixed with Celtic.The acutall ancestry of the Lowlands is predominantly Germanic in some parts and in other parts a mixture of Celtic and Germanic.The Highlanders are in some places a mixture of Norse-Celtic in some places Norman-Celtic and in some predominantly Celtic.The greates Kings of ALL of Scotland were Anglo-Normans-Robert the Bruce was of Norman descent and the Stewarts were originally from Brittany and came with the Norman invasion and were mixed with Norman blood.The population of Scotland has historically been settled the Heaviest in the Lowlands not the highlands.MOST Scots are Lowlanders or are of mixed Lowland and Highland background.And again throught history most Scots spoke the Scots toungueand not Gaelic-Scots being a Germanic tounge.Vikings,Normans,Angles and Celts-these are the major sources for the Genetic input of the people of Scotland.

 

[Sile]

the main tribes are Vindili ( vandals ) in the north
Suevi in the west
lugii in the east
Alemanni in the south

the others are branches of these , as an example, under the vindili where
Longobardi
Burgundones
Aviones
Varini
carini
Nuitones
Rugii
Lemoii
Turchilingi
Angili
Gotones

 

[Vallicanus]

Italy was only a geographical expression after the Lombard/Langobard invasion of 568 which left Byzantine areas like Rome, Naples and Ravenna. Arabs later occupied Sicily.
The Carolingian and Ottonian Kingdoms of Italy only included the northern half of the country as did the Holy Roman Empire in Italy.

 

[zanipolo]

Italy was only a geographical expression after the Lombard/Langobard invasion of 568 which left Byzantine areas like Rome, Naples and Ravenna. Arabs later occupied Sicily.
The Carolingian and Ottonian Kingdoms of Italy only included the northern half of the country as did the Holy Roman Empire in Italy.

The Italians where always rated a "geographical expression" even said by all european leaders as last as the congress of Vienna in 1820.

Which brings a question...when is someone known as an italian, after 1860 when Italy formed , or before?
Was leonard da Vinci a tuscan or an italian? If he was italian, then
Why are the Romans not known as Italians?

Was frederick the great a prussian or a pole now since there is no prussia. Historical expressions of cultures are so confusing the it leads to arguements

Was philip the good a burgundian or French?