Fire Haired
Regular Member
- Messages
- 689
- Reaction score
- 32
- Points
- 0
- Ethnic group
- Celto-Germanic, Latino(~6%)
- Y-DNA haplogroup
- R1b Df27(Spain)
- mtDNA haplogroup
- U5b2a2(Prussia)
mtDNA 236 samples Iberia from 7,000-4,340 years ago the vast majority of the mtDNA where not well enough perserved to show the subclade like H1 they just had the basic haplogroup H.
H=98 41.52% (H20=4 1.7%,H1a1a=2 0.85%, H14a=1 0.4%)
U=43 18.2%(U5=8 3.4%(U5a=2 0.8%(U5a1=1 0.4%), U5b2=1 0.4%), U4=2 0.8%)
K=34 14.4%(K1a=3 1.27%)
J=18 7.6%
N=6 1.7%
T2=5 2%(T2b=2 0.8%)
X=3 1.27%(X1=1 0.4%, X2b=1 0.4%)
V=2 0.8%
L2=2 0.8%
I=2 0.8%
W1=1 0.8%
D=1 0.8%
Some of the mtDNA was undecided
T/X=11 4.6%
http://www.buildinghistory.org/distantpast/ancientdna.shtml
pre Neolithic Iberian mtDNA 15 samples from 20,000-7,500ybp
H=7 46.6%(H1b=2 13.3%, H6=1 6.6%)
U=4 26.6%(U5=2 13.3%(U5b1c2=1 6.6%), U4=1 6.6%)
N=2 13.3%(N5=1 6.6%, N1b=1 6.6%)
R0/HV/H=1 6.6%
http://www.buildinghistory.org/distantpast/ancientdna.shtml
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/ancient_european_dna.shtml
R or and decendant of R=1 6.6%
mtDNA R is the mother of most non African mtDNA haplogroups but this one was almost definlley in the Caucasian family so it was either RO/HV/H U/K pre JT/JT/T/J
Y DNA from Neloithic Catolnia Spain 7,000ybp 6 samples
G2a=5, E1b1b V13=1
the mtDNA haplogroups from 236 samples of Iberians from 7,000-4,340ybp is almost completly identical to modern Iberians and most modern Europeans in my other thread i showed 86 mtDNA samples from Germany they are 6,625-4,025ybp they also almost completely match modern Europeans mtDNA http://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...25-4-025-year-old-mtDNA-and-Y-DNA-from-German
Surprisingly mtDNA H was also over 40% for pre Neolithic Iberian mtDNA like most modern Europeans but almost all mtDNA from pre Neolithic Europe is U the oldest sample of mtDNA H in Europe is on the south tip of Italy and it is 28,000 years old mtDNA H probably migrated to Europe from its place of origin which is the mid east about 33,000-36,000ybp it would have migrated to Europe right after the time it was born about 36,000-40,000ybp
there is a 20,000-18,000 year old mtDNA sample from solutrian http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean
Nerja Spain which is at the southern tip of Spain all they could tell is it was in the RO family mtDNA RO is very old it is about 45,000-50,000 years old today it is almost only found around Arabia and it probaley never migrated to Europe mtDNA RO is the mother of HV and the grandmother of H
mtDNA HV is also very old about 40,000-45,000ybp today it is almost only found around Iraq mtDNA HV did migrate to Europe because it has a daughter mtDNA V which originated in Europe 15,000ybp so this sample had either mtDNA HV or H
there where three mtDNA samples in Cantabrina Magdolnion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalenian
northern Spain from 15,000ybp two had H one of them had mtDNA H6 which today is mainly in eastern Europe this may mean it migrated there from Spain or that it migrated to Spain and is over 15,000 years old one of the samples had mtDNA U5 which is the oldest mtDNA haplogroup to orignate in Europe it is 50,000-55,000 years old
mtDNA H1,H3 and V all are about 15,000 years old, originated in northern Spain, and have similar distribution http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0056775
these mtDNA haplogroups then migrated acroos Europe and north west Africa many experts believe these people are a major ancestral source for all modern Europeans so that makes Spain very important for Europeans ancestry this people group lived during the last ice age alot of Europe was uninhabitable they where taking refuge in Spain experts call it the Iberian refuge http://genome.cshlp.org/content/15/1/19.full
12,000 year old mtDNA 21 samples from Mooroco which is in north west Africa
H/V/U=12, H=4, H/V=3, V=2
http://www.buildinghistory.org/distantpast/nafricaadna.shtml
the source said HV/H/V/U i changed it because there is no way it could have had HV also one of the samples said R mtDNA R is over 60,000 years old today its subclades only exsist in India and parts of east Asia and Australia but since North Africans are Caucasians there is no way they had R and since mtDNA RO is 50,000 years old and never migrated to North Africa or Europe i knew that was not it so the only possible results are H and V
mtDNA V originated 15,000ybp in the northern Spain so this means those Iberian refuge people did not just migrate across Europe four of the samples had mtDNA H but 14 more could have had H since so many where undecided but H was a possibility in all of them
modern north west Africans have 15-35% mtDNA H1 and H3 the Turags in Libya have 61% mtDNA H1
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0013378 the rest of North Africa and mid east is less 5% uselly less than 1% in the rest of Europe they average about 10-20% it is highest inn northern Spain at 40% and central and southern Scandnavia at 25-35%
also north west Africans have about 5% mtDNA V this haplogroups is almost never found in the mid east and other parts of North Africa it is about 3-5% in Europe and highest in northern Spain at 15-25% and in far northern Scandinavian Sami people at 50%. since 12,000ybp mtDNA in Morocco had V and alot of H these people where probably Spanish immigrants and represent Iberians mtDNA 12,000ybp and they had mainly mtDNA H same with pre Neolithic Iberian remains so Iberian over 12,000ybp probabley had 40-60% mtDNA H
North west Africans also have 1-5% mtDNA U5b which also originated in Europe and is the most popular group for pre Neloithci Europeans the subclade of North African U5b is most relted to Sami in northern Scandnavia the common ancester of north African and Sami U5b is estimated at 9,600ybp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_genetics_of_the_Sami this U5b subclade takes up about 50% of Sami mtDNA this means Sami people and north Africans got their U5b from the Iberian refuge the other 50% of Sami mtDNA is V which also came from the Iberian refuge
so mtDNA haplogroups from this group that spread out of northern Spain 15,000ybp is found all over Europe and north west Africa which means they made migrations in those areas
the oldest human genome was found in northern Spain it is a 7,000 year old hunter gather named La Brana it is unrelated to modern Iberian's and southern Europeans he is most related to northern Europeans mainly Sami and Finnish people
http://fennoscandia.blogspot.com/2013/05/la-brana-individuals-and-1000g-european.html
there are genomes of two farmers in Europe one is the famous Otzi the ice man he is 5,300ybp and from alps Italy another is 5,000 years old farmer from south Sweden they where most related to modern southern Europeans mainly Sardinia people they also have Genomes of three hunter gathers in south Sweden from 5,000ybp and La Brana in north Spain 7,000ybp they where all most relted to northern Europeans mainly Sami and finnish people just like
here is the K7b austomnal DNA of them
and this is a link to a website that explians ther austomnal DNA in more depth http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2012/07/bronze-age-indo-european-invasion-of.html
Sami people have specific mtDNA u5b subclade and V subclade these groups take up 100% of their mtDNA both groups are estimated as 8,000 years old this means Sami people have lived in north Scandinavia for at least 8,000 years and since 100% of their mtDNA comes from that people group that migrated out of Spain 15,000ybp and that they are the closest modern relatives to Genomes of European hunter gathers this could mean Sami people are the closest modern relatives to the Iberian refuge group that migrated across Europe and north Africa 15,000ybp and Sami people are probably from the first Scandinavians 11,000ybp
Iberia has 236 mtDNA samples from the Neolithic age that is way higher than any other region in the world I think it is enough mtDNA to say what haplogroups Neolithic Iberians had it shows they had the same haplogroups as most modern Europeans
And Iberian Ice age refuge 15,000ybp spread alot of mtDNA groups acroos Europe and North west Africa and are probably a major ancestral source of modern Europeans and where probably the first setllers of Scandinavia so Iberia is important for all Europeans ancestry and somewhat important for ancestry of north west Africans
Here are 15,000 year old Magdalonian carvings from La Marche cave in western France near the area of the Iberian refuge so these people in the carvings might be related http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Marche_(cave)
H=98 41.52% (H20=4 1.7%,H1a1a=2 0.85%, H14a=1 0.4%)
U=43 18.2%(U5=8 3.4%(U5a=2 0.8%(U5a1=1 0.4%), U5b2=1 0.4%), U4=2 0.8%)
K=34 14.4%(K1a=3 1.27%)
J=18 7.6%
N=6 1.7%
T2=5 2%(T2b=2 0.8%)
X=3 1.27%(X1=1 0.4%, X2b=1 0.4%)
V=2 0.8%
L2=2 0.8%
I=2 0.8%
W1=1 0.8%
D=1 0.8%
Some of the mtDNA was undecided
T/X=11 4.6%
http://www.buildinghistory.org/distantpast/ancientdna.shtml
pre Neolithic Iberian mtDNA 15 samples from 20,000-7,500ybp
H=7 46.6%(H1b=2 13.3%, H6=1 6.6%)
U=4 26.6%(U5=2 13.3%(U5b1c2=1 6.6%), U4=1 6.6%)
N=2 13.3%(N5=1 6.6%, N1b=1 6.6%)
R0/HV/H=1 6.6%
http://www.buildinghistory.org/distantpast/ancientdna.shtml
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/ancient_european_dna.shtml
R or and decendant of R=1 6.6%
mtDNA R is the mother of most non African mtDNA haplogroups but this one was almost definlley in the Caucasian family so it was either RO/HV/H U/K pre JT/JT/T/J
Y DNA from Neloithic Catolnia Spain 7,000ybp 6 samples
G2a=5, E1b1b V13=1
the mtDNA haplogroups from 236 samples of Iberians from 7,000-4,340ybp is almost completly identical to modern Iberians and most modern Europeans in my other thread i showed 86 mtDNA samples from Germany they are 6,625-4,025ybp they also almost completely match modern Europeans mtDNA http://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...25-4-025-year-old-mtDNA-and-Y-DNA-from-German
Surprisingly mtDNA H was also over 40% for pre Neolithic Iberian mtDNA like most modern Europeans but almost all mtDNA from pre Neolithic Europe is U the oldest sample of mtDNA H in Europe is on the south tip of Italy and it is 28,000 years old mtDNA H probably migrated to Europe from its place of origin which is the mid east about 33,000-36,000ybp it would have migrated to Europe right after the time it was born about 36,000-40,000ybp
there is a 20,000-18,000 year old mtDNA sample from solutrian http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean
Nerja Spain which is at the southern tip of Spain all they could tell is it was in the RO family mtDNA RO is very old it is about 45,000-50,000 years old today it is almost only found around Arabia and it probaley never migrated to Europe mtDNA RO is the mother of HV and the grandmother of H
mtDNA HV is also very old about 40,000-45,000ybp today it is almost only found around Iraq mtDNA HV did migrate to Europe because it has a daughter mtDNA V which originated in Europe 15,000ybp so this sample had either mtDNA HV or H
there where three mtDNA samples in Cantabrina Magdolnion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalenian
northern Spain from 15,000ybp two had H one of them had mtDNA H6 which today is mainly in eastern Europe this may mean it migrated there from Spain or that it migrated to Spain and is over 15,000 years old one of the samples had mtDNA U5 which is the oldest mtDNA haplogroup to orignate in Europe it is 50,000-55,000 years old
mtDNA H1,H3 and V all are about 15,000 years old, originated in northern Spain, and have similar distribution http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0056775
these mtDNA haplogroups then migrated acroos Europe and north west Africa many experts believe these people are a major ancestral source for all modern Europeans so that makes Spain very important for Europeans ancestry this people group lived during the last ice age alot of Europe was uninhabitable they where taking refuge in Spain experts call it the Iberian refuge http://genome.cshlp.org/content/15/1/19.full
12,000 year old mtDNA 21 samples from Mooroco which is in north west Africa
H/V/U=12, H=4, H/V=3, V=2
http://www.buildinghistory.org/distantpast/nafricaadna.shtml
the source said HV/H/V/U i changed it because there is no way it could have had HV also one of the samples said R mtDNA R is over 60,000 years old today its subclades only exsist in India and parts of east Asia and Australia but since North Africans are Caucasians there is no way they had R and since mtDNA RO is 50,000 years old and never migrated to North Africa or Europe i knew that was not it so the only possible results are H and V
mtDNA V originated 15,000ybp in the northern Spain so this means those Iberian refuge people did not just migrate across Europe four of the samples had mtDNA H but 14 more could have had H since so many where undecided but H was a possibility in all of them
modern north west Africans have 15-35% mtDNA H1 and H3 the Turags in Libya have 61% mtDNA H1
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0013378 the rest of North Africa and mid east is less 5% uselly less than 1% in the rest of Europe they average about 10-20% it is highest inn northern Spain at 40% and central and southern Scandnavia at 25-35%
also north west Africans have about 5% mtDNA V this haplogroups is almost never found in the mid east and other parts of North Africa it is about 3-5% in Europe and highest in northern Spain at 15-25% and in far northern Scandinavian Sami people at 50%. since 12,000ybp mtDNA in Morocco had V and alot of H these people where probably Spanish immigrants and represent Iberians mtDNA 12,000ybp and they had mainly mtDNA H same with pre Neolithic Iberian remains so Iberian over 12,000ybp probabley had 40-60% mtDNA H
North west Africans also have 1-5% mtDNA U5b which also originated in Europe and is the most popular group for pre Neloithci Europeans the subclade of North African U5b is most relted to Sami in northern Scandnavia the common ancester of north African and Sami U5b is estimated at 9,600ybp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_genetics_of_the_Sami this U5b subclade takes up about 50% of Sami mtDNA this means Sami people and north Africans got their U5b from the Iberian refuge the other 50% of Sami mtDNA is V which also came from the Iberian refuge
so mtDNA haplogroups from this group that spread out of northern Spain 15,000ybp is found all over Europe and north west Africa which means they made migrations in those areas
the oldest human genome was found in northern Spain it is a 7,000 year old hunter gather named La Brana it is unrelated to modern Iberian's and southern Europeans he is most related to northern Europeans mainly Sami and Finnish people
http://fennoscandia.blogspot.com/2013/05/la-brana-individuals-and-1000g-european.html
there are genomes of two farmers in Europe one is the famous Otzi the ice man he is 5,300ybp and from alps Italy another is 5,000 years old farmer from south Sweden they where most related to modern southern Europeans mainly Sardinia people they also have Genomes of three hunter gathers in south Sweden from 5,000ybp and La Brana in north Spain 7,000ybp they where all most relted to northern Europeans mainly Sami and finnish people just like
here is the K7b austomnal DNA of them
and this is a link to a website that explians ther austomnal DNA in more depth http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2012/07/bronze-age-indo-european-invasion-of.html
Sami people have specific mtDNA u5b subclade and V subclade these groups take up 100% of their mtDNA both groups are estimated as 8,000 years old this means Sami people have lived in north Scandinavia for at least 8,000 years and since 100% of their mtDNA comes from that people group that migrated out of Spain 15,000ybp and that they are the closest modern relatives to Genomes of European hunter gathers this could mean Sami people are the closest modern relatives to the Iberian refuge group that migrated across Europe and north Africa 15,000ybp and Sami people are probably from the first Scandinavians 11,000ybp
Iberia has 236 mtDNA samples from the Neolithic age that is way higher than any other region in the world I think it is enough mtDNA to say what haplogroups Neolithic Iberians had it shows they had the same haplogroups as most modern Europeans
And Iberian Ice age refuge 15,000ybp spread alot of mtDNA groups acroos Europe and North west Africa and are probably a major ancestral source of modern Europeans and where probably the first setllers of Scandinavia so Iberia is important for all Europeans ancestry and somewhat important for ancestry of north west Africans
Here are 15,000 year old Magdalonian carvings from La Marche cave in western France near the area of the Iberian refuge so these people in the carvings might be related http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Marche_(cave)
Last edited: