New map of Slavic Y-DNA

Dema said:
They are not "Muslims" as you call them but Albanians in denial. Its not "Bosnjak DNA project" rofl but Sanxhak DNA project (so modern South Serbia territory where Slavicized Albanians live).
Their genetics has nothing with Bosnian genetics, as their DNA project name implies. Just as they dont live in Bosnia neither have any connection with Bosnia whatsoever.
Also i believe they included some members from Serbian project or from Bosnia that are artificially bringing up the I2a haplogroup percentage.
Their H1 member is obvious Gypsy while they artificially increased percentages of I2a haplogroup just to connect with Bosnia, these guys are unreal and amazing.







Aromanian Vlachs are probably Latinized Natives (J2b2, Ev13 and R1b) and thats why. They become shepherd Vlachs.
Interesting how there is no or very little J-M205 among Romanians and Albanians, even tho its clearly Roman Vlach haplogroup.
It could be because it arrived later thru late Byzantine Empire and they separated themselves form proto Aromanians.
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I call them Sandžak muslims because they are not Bosniaks.
I agree with you vast majority of Sandžaklije are of Albanian origin.
There is still Albanian speakers among Sandžaklije, but mostly among older people.
 
Bachus said:
I call them Sandžak muslims because they are not Bosniaks.
I agree with you vast majority of Sandžaklije are of Albanian origin.
There is still Albanian speakers among Sandžaklije, but mostly among older people.
Click to expand...


Muslims, is same as Bosnjaks were called in Yugoslavia lol. I think in Yugo they could not declare as Bosnjaks but it was specifically asked from them to declare as Muslims. (Which was very bad move from others)

Therefore calling Sanxhaks Muslims can imply that they are Bosnjaks, which they are not. What they are in fact is Serbicized Albanians who happen to be Muslims. And thats truth.
 
Whats most ridiculous about them is that they believe they are from 13 century Bosnian King Tvrtko expansion. They dont understand that they are from 17,18,19 century North Albanian Gheg expansion.

My theory is that when Ottoman empire fall down, and when Bulgaro Serb forces conquered their territories that were until then under Ottoman empire and they were citizens of Ottoman empire speaking Albanian language. They simply started to claim that they are Bosnjaks out of fear because it was time when these Serbo Bulgaro Montenegrin forces were killing Ottomans and Albanians that joined with Ottomans.
So to save themselves they claimed they are Bosnjaks.

All that happened around year 1913, so their transition from Ottoman Albanians to Bosnjaks was very fast at least to say.
 
Lenab said:
Arnauts were from the Byzantine Albanians I think they're related to Tosks or whatever
Click to expand...
No, they are from the city of Albany in Alameda County, California.
 
Fantastic 😁
 
I am interested to see the frequency of I2 numbers in other so called Slavic countries in Europe.
 
Bachus said:
Northern haplos I2a+R1a+I1 (Slavo-Germanic) are majority among Krajina Serbs.
These 3 haplos together are much stronger than Vlach E-V13, J2 and R1b.
N haplogroup among Serbs is of unknown origin. Lika Serbs have 7-8% N.
Click to expand...

Very interesting this N1 haplogroup, i have always considered it as Slavic incomer into Balkan.

I see that most of Serb, Croatian and Bosnian samples go under N-Y7313, with TMRCA 850 years - https://www.yfull.com/tree/N-Y6503/

But also possible thru Huns, Avars or Mongols, does anyone have a theory?
 
Dema said:
Very interesting this N1 haplogroup, i have always considered it as Slavic incomer into Balkan.

I see that most of Serb, Croatian and Bosnian samples go under N-Y7313, with TMRCA 850 years - https://www.yfull.com/tree/N-Y6503/

But also possible thru Huns, Avars or Mongols, does anyone have a theory?
Click to expand...

That branch is only branch of N haplogroup which exist among Serbs, Montenegrins, Croatians and Bosniaks.
N-Y7313 is from Piva and Banjani tribes in Old Herzegovina
[video]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piva_(tribe)[/video]
[video]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banjani[/video]
Further origin of N-Y7313 is still unclear. There is a theory about proto-Hungarians оr Cumans, there is a theory about Slavic origin, and even about paleo-Balkanic origin.
Some guys from Poreklo think that N-Y7313 are Mataruge tribe [video]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mataruge[/video] There is very little chance that N-Y7313 are Mataruge.
Serbian guy from northwestern Bosnia who have surname Mataruga is R1a-Z280>Y2613
I'm pretty sure that N-Y7313 is not paleo-Balkanic.

Boris Tadić former president of Serbia is N-Y7313, he is from Piva tribe.
 
I doubt that Mataruge were any of these, they must have been from Albano Vlach corpus in majority.
Regarding N1-Y7313, their MRCA could easily be from Avar Khaganate, but with 400 years of bottleneck after expansion.
Do you know any of their autosomals? If they are recent arrivals as their TMRCA suggests there must be some components that could tell additional story.


BTW Tadic has something foreign in his look i dont know does it has anything with N1 but its hard to describe it....
 
Dema said:
I doubt that Mataruge were any of these, they must have been from Albano Vlach corpus in majority.
Regarding N1-Y7313, their MRCA could easily be from Avar Khaganate, but with 400 years of bottleneck after expansion.
Do you know any of their autosomals? If they are recent arrivals as their TMRCA suggests there must be some components that could tell additional story.


BTW Tadic has something foreign in his look i dont know does it has anything with N1 but its hard to describe it....
Click to expand...

I don't know autosomal of any guy who is N-Y7314.

Serbian guy from Lika (he is I2-PH908) got 1,53% Siberian at K12b, and 2,01% Siberian at K7b. As I said N-Y7313 is 7-8% among Lika Serbs.
Serbs ussualy get 0,7 - 1% Siberian, on the both calculators.

This are his K7b and K12b
TO77x5E.png

QurAEqu.png
 
Bachus said:
Serbs ussualy get 0,7 - 1% Siberian, on the both calculators.
Click to expand...

Homeland is homeland..

Bachus said:
This are his K7b and K12b
Click to expand...


If you wondered mine are:


K7b:

Population
South_Asian-
West_Asian20.61
Siberian-
African-
Southern29.02
Atlantic_Baltic49.97
East_Asian0.40

K12b:

Population
Western European21.14
Siberian-
East African-
West Central Asian0.27
South Asian-
West African0.56
Caucasus19.19
Finnish2.76
Mediterranean28.28
Southwest Asian7.96
North European19.74
East Asian0.11



[h=2]Dodecad K7b Oracle results:[/h][FONT=&quot]The GEDmatch version of Oracle may give slightly different results from Dienekes version. The GEDmatch version uses FST weighting in its calculations.[/FONT]

Admix Results (sorted):

#PopulationPercent
1Atlantic_Baltic49.97
2Southern29.02
3West_Asian20.61
4East_Asian0.4

Single Population Sharing:

#Population (source)Distance
1O_Italian (Dodecad)1.49
2Tuscan (HGDP)2.98
3TSI30 (Metspalu)3.83
4N_Italian (Dodecad)7.04
5Bulgarian (Dodecad)7.11
6Bulgarians (Yunusbayev)7.41
7North_Italian (HGDP)7.95
8Romanians (Behar)8.41
9C_Italian (Dodecad)8.74
10Greek (Dodecad)9.99
11Baleares (1000Genomes)14.42
12Murcia (1000Genomes)15.06
13Andalucia (1000Genomes)15.41
14Extremadura (1000Genomes)15.57
15Canarias (1000Genomes)15.8
16Galicia (1000Genomes)15.85
17Portuguese (Dodecad)15.98
18S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad)16.03
19Spaniards (Behar)16.78
20Sicilian (Dodecad)17.12

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source)Secondary Population (source)Distance
1 71.5%Tuscan (HGDP)+28.5%Bulgarians (Yunusbayev)@0.41
2 87%N_Italian (Dodecad)+13%Armenians_15 (Yunusbayev)@0.41
3 70.6%Tuscan (HGDP)+29.4%Bulgarian (Dodecad)@0.43
4 86.8%N_Italian (Dodecad)+13.2%Armenians (Behar)@0.46
5 74.1%Tuscan (HGDP)+25.9%Romanians (Behar)@0.47
6 61%French (HGDP)+39%Cypriots (Behar)@0.49
7 86.4%North_Italian (HGDP)+13.6%Abhkasians (Yunusbayev)@0.5
8 72.5%Aragon (1000Genomes)+27.5%Georgians (Behar)@0.5
9 83.7%C_Italian (Dodecad)+16.3%Lithuanians (Behar)@0.54
10 86.7%N_Italian (Dodecad)+13.3%Armenian (Dodecad)@0.54
11 82.5%C_Italian (Dodecad)+17.5%Lithuanian (Dodecad)@0.59
12 79.9%C_Italian (Dodecad)+20.1%Polish (Dodecad)@0.59
13 80.9%C_Italian (Dodecad)+19.1%Belorussian (Behar)@0.6
14 87.1%N_Italian (Dodecad)+12.9%Georgia_Jews (Behar)@0.61
15 86.6%N_Italian (Dodecad)+13.4%Uzbekistan_Jews (Behar)@0.62
16 71.9%Aragon (1000Genomes)+28.1%Abhkasians (Yunusbayev)@0.63
17 87.2%N_Italian (Dodecad)+12.8%Azerbaijan_Jews (Behar)@0.65
18 75.2%Greek (Dodecad)+24.8%English (Dodecad)@0.65
19 65.2%TSI30 (Metspalu)+34.8%Bulgarian (Dodecad)@0.68
20 74.6%Greek (Dodecad)+25.4%Cornwall (1000Genomes)@0.71

 
What is about your Dodecad K12b and Family Finder?

You are more northern oriented than Albanian average, due to Slavic influence. (y)
 
Bachus said:
@ Dema

What is about your Dodecad K12b and Family Finder?

You are more northern oriented than Albanian average, due to Slavic influence. (y)
Click to expand...

I might be, we know we had one Serbian woman like 6 or 7 generations ago, i expected my autosomal to score some Slavic genetics in advance, it was no surprise to me.

Its funny that you mention a bit of my Slavic influence while you dont mention Albanian and Vlach influence that is pulling all Serbs away from Croats, Slovens, Hungarians and rest. Serbs are obviously more Albanian shifted then rest of their neighbors (as it can be seen on V2 K15 map below). Probably Bulgarian influence also pulls them towards the South.


Here you can see map of some Albanian members plotting together:

Eurogenes v2 K15



s3kaqw.jpg




As you can see i plot just fine with other Albanians, a bit N Italian and Tuscany shifted while Serbs Plot towards Albanians so away from your so desired North (y)

Whats funny to me is i just realized Fustanovic, that you joined up with, to ruin my M205 thread is also there. Funny that he says Slav this and Slav that when he is the most Serbian shifted one lol
 
Dema said:
I might be, we know we had one Serbian woman like 6 or 7 generations ago, i expected my autosomal to score some Slavic genetics in advance, it was no surprise to me.

Its funny that you mention a bit of my Slavic influence while you dont mention Albanian and Vlach influence that is pulling all Serbs away from Croats, Slovens, Hungarians and rest. Serbs are obviously more Albanian shifted then rest of their neighbors (as it can be seen on V2 K15 map below). Probably Bulgarian influence also pulls them towards the South.


Here you can see map of some Albanian members plotting together:

Eurogenes v2 K15



s3kaqw.jpg




As you can see i plot just fine with other Albanians, a bit N Italian and Tuscany shifted while Serbs Plot towards Albanians so away from your so desired North (y)

Whats funny to me is i just realized Fustan boy that you joined up with, to ruin my M205 thread is also here. Funny that he says Slav this and Slav that when he is most Serbian shifted one lol
Click to expand...

Montenegrin Serbs and southern (Torlakian) Serbs are the most southern shifted Serbs, but even they are closer to Serbian and Croatian average than to Albanians.
Serbs on average are autosomally closer not only to Croatians, Slovenian and Hungarians, but also to Czechs than to Albanians.
Most northern shifted Serbs are Krajina and Bosnians Serbs, they are more northern shifted than Vojvodinian Serbs on average. Vojvodinia Serbs are about Serbian average.
Vast majority of Croatians are autosomally closer to Serbs than to Slovenians. Only northwestern Croatians (kaykavians) are closer to Slovenians, because they are croatized Slovenians.
Serbs which are the closest to Croatians autosomally are Bosnian and Krajina Serbs, and they very rare mixed them. Only very few Krajina/Bosnian Serbs have Croatian influence by female line, and very few Croatians have Serbian influence by female line.
 
Bachus said:
Montenegrin Serbs and southern (Torlakian) Serbs are the most southern shifted Serbs, but even they are closer to Serbian and Croatian average than to Albanians.
Serbs on average are autosomally closer not only to Croatians, Slovenian and Hungarians, but also to Czechs than to Albanians.
Most northern shifted Serbs are Krajina and Bosnians Serbs, they are more northern shifted than Vojvodinian Serbs on average. Vojvodinia Serbs are about Serbian average.
Vast majority of Croatians are autosomally closer to Serbs than to Slovenians. Only northwestern Croatians (kaykavians) are closer to Slovenians, because they are croatized Slovenians.
Serbs which are the closest to Croatians autosomally are Bosnian and Krajina Serbs, and they very rare mixed them. Only very few Krajina/Bosnian Serbs have Croatian influence by female line, and very few Croatians have Serbian influence by female line.
Click to expand...


These Serbs, that Serbs, i dont know which Serbs, but obviously, on average, Serbs are more Vlach and Albanian Shifted then their neighbors.
So not that you only have more Albano Vlach haplos on average (E-v13 J2b2, R1b, J1, J2a) but also specifically J2b1>Y22066 which is a clear Vlach signal. You are also more Vlach and Albanian shifted autosomally.

What were you saying about my autosomal again?
icon10.png
 
Dema said:
These Serbs, that Serbs, i dont know which Serbs, but obviously, on average, Serbs are more Vlach and Albanian Shifted then their neighbors.
So not that you only have more Albano Vlach haplos on average (E-v13 J2b2, R1b, J1, J2a) but also specifically J2b1>Y22066 which is a clear Vlach signal. You are also more Vlach and Albanian shifted autosomally.

What were you saying about my autosomal again?
icon10.png
Click to expand...

Hahahaa, dude you don't know what are yuo talking.
Serbs shifted more northern than Montenegrins, Macedonians, Albanians, Bulgarians and Romanians and all of these nation are neighbors of Serbs.
In reality Serbs shifted more northern than current datas says, because there is a lot of Montenegrin samples which are calculated in Serbian average. Montenegrins shifted towards to Ghegs, but they are still closer to Serbian average.

Excuse me, but E-V13, J2b2, J2b1, J1, R1b and J2a exist among Croatians, Bosniaks and Hungarians.
Bosnian muslims have pretty high percentage of J2a. In all statistics for them which I have seen they have about 7% J2a.
Szekely Hungarians have a high percentage of J2. Hungarians have more J1 than Serbs on average. Stears claims that all J1 in Hungary is from hungarized or Hungarian speaking Jews.
J2a and J1 are not Vlachic, first one is Anatolian and second one is Semitic.
Majoriry of Serbian E-V13 is from Montenegrin imigrants who live in Serbia, and somethimes declared themselves as Serbs and somethimes as Montenegrins.
 
J2a came from the Fertile Cresent and Levant in general J1 is from the Arabian Plateau
 
No if N exists in Slavs it's because of full blown Mongoloids it's actually in Finland and Sami it would not be Avars but probably Sabirs...

Lol at Serbs being Albanian shifted too but aren't they originally Illyrian by their claims?

If Serbs are the most North shifted in all of Balkans it makes sense they are pretty tall at least almost as much as Montenegro and forgive me for saying so they are pretty equipped in the right departments from what they show me in Omegle lol
 
Dema said:
Here you can see map of some Albanian members plotting together:

Eurogenes v2 K15

s3kaqw.jpg


As you can see i plot just fine with other Albanians, a bit N Italian and Tuscany shifted while Serbs Plot towards Albanians so away from your so desired North (y)
Click to expand...

You destoyed them...:LOL:
 
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