Genetic study The Picenes and the Genetic Landscape of Central Adriatic Italy in the Iron Age.

[Ghurier]

If I was petty I would have rubbed it in your face when the paper came, but I am not about such childish behavior, although I thought and laughed about it.

Yet I wonder what time it is where you at, you might wanna double check that clock of yours.

What paper ?
Something I often say about debates is that claiming that "you won't do something" is only a way to "do it without assuming doing it".

Apparently, you seems to believe that the fact we obtained a Z597+ sample from southern Germany EIA, exactly where I claimed for years that we have signal of a IA-related sub-diversity spot, would somehow invalidate my claims !!!
You realize that you start to have an incoherent behavior ?
I already showed that for some peoples with a big cognitive dissonance when they are confronted to the reality.

Or do you think that the lack of sample in France and Czechia during IA will make dispear MAG006 and RMPR116 ?
Because, this is not how are working data.
Look MAG006 and his admixture, the lineage have been there for centuries.

We have ancient DNA, we have statistical diversity signal, we have clade segregation signal ... we have everything.
Yet you refuse the data because it didn't fits with your narrative.

At this point it is a comedy.

PS: as this is a Picene-related topic ... I will stop here this non-discussion. No point in polluting this topic with your issues about recent data. Feel free to take the final non-sense !

 

[Archetype0ne]

And here I thought you would write just one psychological dissertation. You wrote two.
Imagine if it was two L283 samples, instead of 1/600.

 

[mount123]

Is the sardinian sample (ORC007) really J-YP91 + ?
Personally I tend to trust more on yfull than Trojet, not for any other reason than that i never saw then made a reading mistake but Trojet did, no ofense intended.
If anyone that holds no animosity towards this fading piece of fetishised dna could take a look in ORC007 's Y snps it would be cool i guess.

Yfull is a Russian owned third party service for uniparental clade placement. Their upload policy for aDNA samples is flawed as is often times their analysis, plenty such examples exist.

I have literally never witnessed any major mistake in Flor's analysis. Matter of fact I have witnessed him correcting others on their mistakes.

 

[Johane Derite]

Mate your claim was that L283 has nothing to do with the steppe and was a local Sardinian like haplogroup, you were even claiming that once we got more samples from France and Germany you would be vindicated. Telling us time will tell, this and that.

Funnily enough, now that we got like 500+ samples from Central Europe and France and all we found was one single L283...? Is that your smoking gun, is that your vindication?

If I was petty I would have rubbed it in your face when the paper came, but I am not about such childish behavior, although I thought and laughed about it.

Yet I wonder what time it is where you at, you might wanna double check that clock of yours.

Hundreds of samples from the steppe and not a single J2b-L283 yet. No evidence this was a steppe halplo

 

[TaktikatEMalet]

Hundreds of samples from the steppe and not a single J2b-L283 yet. No evidence this was a steppe halplo

Can't rule it out being Caucasus Hunter Gatherer, Yamnaya had a big amount of CHG autosomal ancestry

Other possibility is being an Anatolian Neolithic Farmer line which makes more sense for Sardinians

 

[Archetype0ne]

Hundreds of samples from the steppe and not a single J2b-L283 yet. No evidence this was a steppe halplo

First correct statement I have seen you utter in years. I tend to be on Polska's camp on this one. But you wont see me hallucinating facts and making up fairy tales to back some horse where the evidence is lacking.

All we have so far is an overwhelming steppe signal for L283 in the Balkans, and all but 4(?, 3 Nuragic, 1 Caucasus) L283 samples out of a hundred that show this signal. So chances are it got incorporated into steppe movements on its way to the Western Balkans.

But the great thing is that as any sound hypothesis this can be easily falsifiable, unlike fairy-tales about daco-thraco-myso-bassarabis. All we need is a 4-5kbc sample from around Moldova and its autosomal signature. Then we are able to tell if this was non-steppe (CHG+EEF) at the time of its incorporation into the IE movements, or if its an earlier components of said Steppe movements (CHG+EHG+EEF). Last I heard Patterson was working on something regarding the pre-Yamnaya populations of said region, so chances are we will soon find out.

 

[Trojet]

Is the sardinian sample (ORC007) really J-YP91 + ?
Personally I tend to trust more on yfull than Trojet, not for any other reason than that i never saw then made a reading mistake but Trojet did, no ofense intended.
If anyone that holds no animosity towards this fading piece of fetishised dna could take a look in ORC007 's Y snps it would be cool i guess.

Just to clarify. ORC007 is low coverage, it has a single YP91+ read. This mutation is a C → T transition which is prone to aDNA damage. Combined with the fact that he has no coverage at J-Z600, I'm simply not convinced he is YP91+ or anything else under J-Z622 with the data we have, hence he is classified as J-L283>Z622>? in the aDNA map (it would be different if it had two or more positive reads at J-YP91, or if there was at least one negative read at J-Z600). FTDNA has not placed him anything more specific than J-L283 either (sample S'Orku 7): https://discover.familytreedna.com/y-dna/J-L283/tree
Others are free to place him as J-YP91.

So I do not see what where the "mistake" is. Speaking of which, YFull initially had ORC007 as J-L283* (meaning negative at J-Z622) as can be seen: https://www.yfull.com/arch-10.00/tree/j-l283/. It was me who reached out to them and asked them to look into it because there was no evidence of that:

They also had misplaced the J-YP9 subclade (sample ERS256805) as can be seen: https://www.yfull.com/arch-7.02/tree/J-Z638/