Who were the Thracians?

[Yaan]

However, my both grand mother and grand father were refugees from Byala Slatina, Bulgaria to Gonan, Turkey after 1877-1878 Turko-Russo War and they were mostly speaking Ukrainian.

Ukrainian?? Not true! They were either Bulgarian Muslims called Pomak(in Byala Slatina there was never Turks), or they were Crimean Tatars and spoke Russian.
I mean only half of the Ukrainians in Ukraine speak Ukrainian(most speak Russian) lo let alone that Turks from Bulgaria would be speak Ukrainian.
Turks in Bulgarian mostly speak Turkish, there is also some that are actually Bulgarian Muslims and speak Bulgarian and some are assimilated Tatars and Cherkez, but also speak Turkish.

 

[adamo]

The thracians, with their red auburn hair, to me, where a southernmost extension of Romanian Dacian types, they where I1b in my opinion.

 

[Yaan]

The thracians, with their red auburn hair, to me, where a southernmost extension of Romanian Dacian types, they where I1b in my opinion.

There is no proof that they were with red hair or even if they were that all of them were with red hair. Red hair is not connected to a y chr, and if it was it would have been some R1b or J2, not I1.
Everything in this world says that they were E-V13,R1b-L23 and J2b2, they may have had another thing as well. E-V13 and R1b-L23 and J2b2 are big where they used to live and in todays Bulgarians we see them. If u exclude R1a-M458,R1a-Z280 which should have been from Slavs, as well as the Slavic gene I2a-Din, these are genes big in Bulgarians. Pomaks are Bulgarian Muslims claiming to be the most Thracian in the world. I know of 3 tested, one is R1b-L23, one is E-V13 and one is R1a(not sure which subtype).
That R1b-L23,E-V13 and J2b2 are the Balkan genes identified with Thrachians is no brainer!

 

[Yaan]

Also out of the bodies found and examined one woman was Med and one men was Nordic.

 

[adamo]

Sorry but NO J2 lineage creates red hair, unless mixed with mtdna H or U females, J2 in an appropriately "middle eastern" setting mixing with N and R lineages of Anatolia/Iran would never create red hair.

 

[kamani]

Sorry but NO J2 lineage creates red hair, unless mixed with mtdna H or U females, J2 in an appropriately "middle eastern" setting mixing with N and R lineages of Anatolia/Iran would never create red hair.

correct. Thracian mtdna would have been european but their ydna ~50% middle-eastern, which makes them only 25% middle-eastern. So they could have not been as redhead as the english, lets say. But lets not forget, they were redhead according to the Greeks..
Another thing to think about: European Jews were known in the middle ages for a high percentage of redheads, so somehow middle-eastern mixed with european produces a lot of redheads.

 

[Yaan]

Sorry but NO J2 lineage creates red hair, unless mixed with mtdna H or U females, J2 in an appropriately "middle eastern" setting mixing with N and R lineages of Anatolia/Iran would never create red hair.

Y DNA creates nothing, u should learn this or stop with genetics
And there is not such thing as Middle Eastern DNA plus J2b2 is 100% European one of the IE markers!
It is normal not to know, but at least learn.

 

[adamo]

Thanks for stating the obvious "J2b originated In The Balkans", please yaan, piss off before I write something offensive to you lol, you've been "up my hind quarters" for the past 3 months telling me things I already know so have a nice day, good sir.

 

[Yaan]

Thanks for stating the obvious "J2b originated In The Balkans", please yaan, piss off before I write something offensive to you lol, you've been "up my hind quarters" for the past 3 months telling me things I already know so have a nice day, good sir.

U do not know a lot of things and keep on spreading lies and not verified things. Learn something before posting.

 

[adamo]

Read my "haplogroups of the world" and then say that again, " u do not know a lot of things" says the man that writes u instead of you, what does your statement mean anyways, is it just a "general" statement?

 

[RHAS]

"Cruciani et al.’s E-V13 and J2-M12 coalescence times bear a striking similarity to carbon-14-based date calculations for certain archaeological sites in the Maritsa river valley and its tributaries, near the city of Nova Zagora, Bulgaria (Nilolova, 2002). These sites are associated directly with the proto-Thracian culture of the southern Balkans that came to dominate the region during the first millennium BCE. Sites surveyed included Ezero, Yunatsite, Dubene-Sarovka and Plovdiv-Nebet Tepe, all of which had deep associations with the developing EBA proto-Thracian culture of the region."
Haplogroup E3b1a2 as a Possible Indicator of Settlement in Roman Britain by Soldiers of Balkan Origin.
http://www.jogg.info/32/bird.htm

 

[Noman]

Cathars were mainly bulgarians who migrated west, and bulgarians fought endlessly againt the ottomans in revolts, so I doubt there's much continuity at this point.

Sadly it seems most the redheaded people of the world chose death over lack of freedom.

And when j2 is proved founder of thrace or greece, that's a laugh.

 

[RHAS]

 

[RHAS]

"The cis-Caspian, trans-Caucasian R-M269 population followed an early (late 4th millennium, early 3rd millennium?) expansion into Europe, probably together with J2 in the Balkans (Graeco-Phrygian, perhaps Thracian), and arriving in the form of Bell Beakers in Western Europe (Italo-Celtic), as well as a later (2nd-1st millennium BC?) expansion to the east (Tocharians) "
http://dienekes.blogspot.nl/2012/07/complex-y-chromosome-structure-in-east.html

 

[Garrick]

Albanians especially Tosk also have a lot of Slavic genes(R1a and I2a)!

You are right, Tosk Albanians and Geg Albanians are quite different. For example according to Ferri at al. (2010, Springer) Tosk Albanians have 25,6% I haplogroup, from which over 20% is I2a2, but Geg Albanians have very small percetanges I2a2, according Pericic et al. Kosovo Albanians (they are almost all Geg Albanians) have only 2,65% I2a2.

And MDS scaling locates Tosk Albanians very close to Greeks and close other Balkans nations: Serbs, Upper Macedonians (Macedonians from Former Yugoslav Republic not Aegean Macedonians), Bosniacs, Romanians, Bulgarians. On the other hands Geg Albanians are close to Egiptians and Lebanese (Ferri et al., 2010 and Regueiro et al. 2012).

MDS scaling Ferri et al. (Geg or Gheg Albanians close to Egyptians)


MDS scaling Regueiro et al. Geg Albanians (Kosovo Albanians KoAL) close to Lebanese

 

[FBS]

No, they are closer to Italians in the table.

 

[Luan]

You are right, Tosk Albanians and Geg Albanians are quite different. For example according to Ferri at al. (2010, Springer) Tosk Albanians have 25,6% I haplogroup, from which over 20% is I2a2, but Geg Albanians have very small percetanges I2a2, according Pericic et al. Kosovo Albanians (they are almost all Geg Albanians) have only 2,65% I2a2.

And MDS scaling locates Tosk Albanians very close to Greeks and close other Balkans nations: Serbs, Upper Macedonians (Macedonians from Former Yugoslav Republic not Aegean Macedonians), Bosniacs, Romanians, Bulgarians. On the other hands Geg Albanians are close to Egiptians and Lebanese (Ferri et al., 2010 and Regueiro et al. 2012).

MDS scaling Ferri et al. (Geg or Gheg Albanians close to Egyptians)

View attachment 6009
MDS scaling Regueiro et al. Geg Albanians (Kosovo Albanians KoAL) close to Lebanese

View attachment 6010

You again, I told you already e-v13 is European Clade and and south of Greece has the same amount of e-v13. Its been in Europe 7000 years or so. Serb will try anything to claim kosova. And Ferri didnt even mention south of greece high E-v13. give something up to date.
[h=5][/h]

 

[Garrick]

You again. I told you already e-v13 is European Clade and and south of Greece has the same amount of e-v13. Its been in Europe 7000 years or so. Serb will try anything to claim kosova. And Ferri didnt even mention south of greece high E-v13. give something up to date.

What do you want to say?

Yaan is right, he knows, Tosks and Gegs have significant differences, researches show this. If you have some new study you can post to see everyone, if you do not have, why do you ask such questions, we're talking about science and researches, not about politics.

 

[Sile]

You are right, Tosk Albanians and Geg Albanians are quite different. For example according to Ferri at al. (2010, Springer) Tosk Albanians have 25,6% I haplogroup, from which over 20% is I2a2, but Geg Albanians have very small percetanges I2a2, according Pericic et al. Kosovo Albanians (they are almost all Geg Albanians) have only 2,65% I2a2.

And MDS scaling locates Tosk Albanians very close to Greeks and close other Balkans nations: Serbs, Upper Macedonians (Macedonians from Former Yugoslav Republic not Aegean Macedonians), Bosniacs, Romanians, Bulgarians. On the other hands Geg Albanians are close to Egiptians and Lebanese (Ferri et al., 2010 and Regueiro et al. 2012).

MDS scaling Ferri et al. (Geg or Gheg Albanians close to Egyptians)

View attachment 6009
MDS scaling Regueiro et al. Geg Albanians (Kosovo Albanians KoAL) close to Lebanese

View attachment 6010

so, Tosks could have a lot of epirotes as well?

 

[Ike]

Serb will try anything to claim kosova.

We don't have to do anything. Every building on Kosovo is a proof that Serbs were there for centuries. Where are Albanian remnants? Anything in Albanian language older than 200 years?