K12 Autosomal map : European admixture (from Dodecad)

[Wilhelm]

Based on the NW European + Mediterranean + East-European scores. (Not mine)

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[Knovas]

Very good to complete the series. Probably the East European map is also coming.

 

[Wilhelm]

I could add some holes, like Bulgaria, Ukraine, Denmark, and regions, like Catalonia/Valencia where averages 95%

 

[julia90]

but western asia genes are europoid looking too, no?.. if not we tuscans should look like african, indian or east asian

 

[Knovas]

Tuscans have substantial near eastern influence (not the same as Asian or African). Is what decreases the European average, but of course this admixture is mainly Caucasoid and the repercussion in phenotype is not drastic.

 

[julia90]

i've seen pictures of georgians and adygei and they don't look less european than sardinians. caucasian genes look europoid, and should be included in that map, since italians and people from the balkans are as european as the other people.

the title of the map is Misleading

 

[Knovas]

Some of the look European, and others not. In my opinion quite of them don't. But this refers to genetic admixtures, and Near Eastern is not the same as European, but it's quite similar. You can also find ethnic Berbers with incredibly high North African percent looking European, and it does not mean they are European.

 

[julia90]

And your idea is wrong. the map is misleading.. what do you consider european, is not what all the people consider european.
you can talk about europid looking, and caucasian genes are europoid.

i was talking about the peak you find in people from the caucasus and Adygei

 

[julia90]

georgians.. aren't less europoid looking than sardinians

 

[julia90]

You can also find ethnic Berbers with incredibly high North African percent looking European, and it does not mean they are European.

i consider "pure" berbers europoid looking

 

[Alan]

A good map, but some little Problems to mention. First of all Dodecad results about Kurds are from Northern Iraq and some from Iran. However you did place the results inn East Anatolia. The West-Northwest of Iran is mainly Kurdish populated and similar to that of Iraq. However you placed there the Iranian results. I would suggest to move the 25%(Iranian results) further East, on the southern coast of the Caspian and place the 32% in East Anatolia, between North Iraq, Northwest Iran and southeastern border of Anatolia.

 

[Knovas]

Ok Julia, but what I mean is that this is not a "looking" map, It's a genetic one. And in both places (Gerogia and North Africa) you can find individuals with European looking, and others who don't in a great number. They are predominantly caucasoid, but not the same as Europeans.

 

[julia90]

Ok Julia, but what I mean is that this is not a "looking" map, It's a genetic one. And in both places (Gerogia and North Africa) you can find individuals with European looking, and others who don't in a great number. They are predominantly caucasoid, but not the same as Europeans.

since southern italians, tuscans, and many balkans people have high quantity of this genes, according to that map they are less european than northern italians, even if caucasian people are europoid looking.

i don't see your logic

 

[Knovas]

I did not create the map, components, and neither the thread. Not my logic, it's all based on academical studies. Doug McDonald's paintings show substantial levels of Mideast between Italians, this is actuallly how it works.

Nothing wrong with it.

 

[julia90]

yes, but why if those genes are present in southern eastern europe

and the people who bear them the most (adygeis and georgians), are so un-european looking lol less than other europeans.

the title is misleading, since it should have included also the genes that peak in the caucasus.
I'm not denying anything, and i'm ok being 30% similar to adygeans.

what some people consider european, or un european looking is relative, i could consider east european genes, un european too, but it doesn't change the fact that the people who have east european slavic genes are europoid looking.

 

[Wilhelm]

No way georgians look more european than Sardinians. To start with, georgians genetically cluster with Iranians and Turks, and also look similar to them (unless we talk about russian admixed georgians) while Sardinians cluster with Europeans and look mainly euro-mediterranean, maybe more archaic because of their strong palaeolithic ancestry.

 

[julia90]

this are adygeans (circassians), i found this images on the english wikipedia under the adygeans voice
link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adyghe_people

do they look un european?

LOL

 

[julia90]

this are Sardinians, a famous band Tazenda

LOL, southern italian less europoid than them.. another LOL, with all my respect to Sardineans.

No Way, the map is misleading, and deliberately to exclude some people from the "pure" european race.
It's misleading for the title given to that map, because that map assumes, that the circassians genes are "aliene to europe", which is not because that genes are present in south-eastern europe.

 

[Knovas]

Cherry-picking with pictures does not prove nothing, average is what really cares. Also, some of the others you posted above no way look European.

Georgians, Adygeans, etc., don't cluster with Europeans. The same as North Africans and other Caucasoids. Simply not the same, but similar.

 

[julia90]

that is what you and whilelm think, i don't think this, this is relative and higly subjective like the title given to that map.

and they are not cherrypicked, at least the adygeans.

caucasian genes, are part of europe, of south east europe, therefore european