in several GEDmatch calculators a criteria to tell north_italian from south_italian is actually by east-med / west_med proportions not so much by other proportions;
Not really.
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in several GEDmatch calculators a criteria to tell north_italian from south_italian is actually by east-med / west_med proportions not so much by other proportions;
Thanks for the info! I always assumed northern Italians would plot closer to Central Europeans. You score 40% Southeastern Europe on FTDNA. I always assumed there was a large farming component in the West and Central Europe category and that Southeastern was more Mediterranean than Northern Italian. I wonder what Angela scored on FTDNA if she ever took that specific test.
My mom is French Canadian and scored 99% West and Central Europe and French people have a significant Neolithic farming component.
Not really.
Alex says:
"and if there is one pattern i have noticed by my results is that i am wherever the sardinians are in gencove southwestern in myorigins southeastern in genographic southern and the K25/K29 on geneplaza underlined it all just nicely"
sorry, I didn't get any of that
That entire quote. I can't decipher it.what exactly?
That entire quote. I can't decipher it.
47% Southwestern Europe
40% Northern and Central Europe
5% Eastern Mediterranean
5% Northeast Europe
3% Iran Caucasus Anatolia
It was a Sardinian/Sicilian cluster. IT WAS NOT JUST SARDINIAN.
It could as well mean closeness to Sicilians.
just so there are no misunderstandings i am not complaining/questioning any of my results in fact being half central european and half south european i think all my results are spot on; i like them a lot;
as for the quote, if i understood it correctly than clusters are based on populations and if such a cluster incl the sardinians my southern half always scores/corresponds with that cluster as should be for north italian (academic based); a quick example there was a calculator called K25 and on that calculator was a cluster called sardinian-sicilian, now not many people scored it and app a lot complained not scoring it so the creator in bold fat letters (mwauthy knows what im talking about) explained that the reason not many score it is because the sardinians are isolated yet if someone did score it it would indicate shared drift with the isolated sardinians and even claimed that that is synonymous with EEF; i scored proper 27% of that sardinian drift (only half north italian!) so it is just a pattern i have noticed by my own results which corresponds to academic results;
seems as if anthrogenica is knocked out again, when it works i link the link of the creator to you via PM;
cant find the link anymore, but someone gave me a link as to what the myOrigins is modeled on and if i remember it correctly than West and Central incl french-swiss and southeastern the sardinians; and if there is one pattern i have noticed by my results is that i am wherever the sardinians are in gencove southwestern in myorigins southeastern in genographic southern and the K25/K29 on geneplaza underlined it all just nicely; i assumed that solely based on the academic data, guess not the wrongest reference to go by; not sure about french but with sardinian you can be certain that EEF goes hand in hand;
yes, really is the case;
def not in my case i score 0.0% sicilian k29 yet 27% sardinian-sicilian k25 (the pattern); when anthrogenica works again ill link to the creators explanation #533 of sardinian-sicilian being sardinian 'original population drift' meaning you can read it first hand (from the creator);
@Sile
for the two clusters you mentioned gencove writes the following
Southwestern Europe
Reference populations: Southern French, Spanish, Basque, and Sardinian.
Northern and Central Europe
Reference populations: Norwegian, Orcadian, Scottish, British, Icelandic.
So according to Gencove northern Italians and Sardinians are more similar to Iberians, but on FTDNA they are more similar to Greeks? Which is more accurate according to the academic papers?
According to Gencove, northeastern and north central Italy seem to be Northern and Central European like, and northwestern Italy all the way down through Tuscany is Iberian like. In central Lombardia there's some overlap. That's going by the map upthread.
I've given up on results from these companies. I'm totally typical for where I come from, always placing midway between Bergamo and TSI samples. Academic studies of ancient dna tell me and will tell me how I got that way.
These companies are making all sorts of subjective decisions as to which clusters they'll use, and therefore the results are all different. It just confuses most people. That said, some tend to be better than others. I never tested at FTDNA because, indeed, as Pax says, they seemed ridiculous. For goodness sakes, in the beginning, and even now for all I know they use Ashkenazim, with their perhaps 60% European as a reference for the Middle East. McDonald used to do the same. That is completely NUTS.
The only thing I'll give gencove is that it duplicates all the Mid-to-late Spanish like Neolithic and Chalcolithic that I found through Kurd's ancient samples calculator. That doesn't mean a migration from Spain to Northwest Italy, for anyone who is wondering.
Absolutely true, even in this dumb commercial they perpetuate this misconception. This guy says he thought he was German, which he definitely is since he apparently knows his lineage. Yet, he actually thinks he's Scottish, and not German at all just because the test uses that population as a reference for populations that overlap between West Germany, and Scotland. I think some of this is for marketing purposes, so they can sell to people who may be surprised by their results, by finding something they think they didn't know about. At least that's what I'm getting from this commercial. The geneticists behind the test certainly know the truth behind what those reference populations actually imply. I get that its a business, and they want to make money, but this is not useful to people unless they are more adept in understanding how to gauge the results.
Yeah! None of these tests can tell you where exactly your ancestors were born and should not be used to override a paper trail like in that commercial. All these tests can do is show certain allele frequencies based on subjective regional groupings. For the average layman unaware of that they are going to waste a lot of time looking for a “lost ancestor” in their paper trail that doesn’t exist. For example, being French I get around 25% Iberian on many calculators. If I knew nothing about the genetic history of these regions I would be looking for a Spanish grand parent in my family tree.Thats committing fraud on their part, unless they try to explain why this would happen in a simple but informative way. I doubt Bobby Joe has any desire to dig deep through a textbook on genetics.
So according to Gencove northern Italians and Sardinians are more similar to Iberians, but on FTDNA they are more similar to Greeks? Which is more accurate according to the academic papers?
I’m curious as to what exactly the “Iberian” category entails on FTDNA? It used to be part of “Southern Europe” prior to 2.0. It doesn’t seem to include southwest France since my mom and I received 0% Iberian. It doesn’t seem to include Sardinia either. If you could find that link your friend sent you regarding the FTDNA regions that would be awesome!
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