Were the Croatians originally Slavic?

[Tomenable]

Albanians are really autochthonous

I thought those were Neanderthals who were really (!) autochthonous, not Albanians?: :shocked:

 

[Ike]

You mentioned the famous via egnatia, above. The real split between the two Albanian dialects tosk and gheg was after this ancient road was built. This ancient highway is the borderline between the two dialects. Further north of this road lives the ghegs, and further south lives the tosks. This road made itself the borderline between the Albanian branches. This is another proof that Albanians were living there. Linguistic evidences show that Albanian language spoken on this areas predated the Slavic migration.

So your view is that Albanians were frogs? Having problem crossing the highway?

At least, you need to bring any argument about your unproven theories. Probably as we know, the dardanians were one of the largest Illyrian tribes.

This could be a good starting point for you to think about when creating the wild theories about Albanian history:

"For instance, the high degree of sharedcommon ancestry among Albanian speakers might be because most of these originated from a small village rather than uniformly across Albania and Kosovo."

"This suggests that a reasonable proportion of the ancestors of modern-day Albanian speakers are drawn from a relatively small, cohesive population that has persisted for at least the last 1,500 years."

"These individuals share similar numbers of common ancestors with nearby populations as do individuals in other parts of Europe, implying that the Albanian speakers have not been a particularly isolated population so much as a small one."


source: http://arxiv.org/pdf/1207.3815v1.pdf

 

[LeBrok]

First time I hear this theory. North West Greek dialect and doric dialect on Albanian language dismisses your theory.

It is no theory, but a prediction based on your hypothesis. You should have read your post again to understand the context.

 

[Trojet]

I thought those were Neanderthals who were really (!) autochthonous, not Albanians?: :shocked:

Autochthonous relative to our Slavic neighbors. You know exactly what I mean, don't act so ignorant.

Now back to topic everyone. This thread is not about the origin of the Albanians.

 

[Sile]

You mentioned the famous via egnatia, above. The real split between the two Albanian dialects tosk and gheg was after this ancient road was built. This ancient highway is the borderline between the two dialects. Further north of this road lives the ghegs, and further south lives the tosks. This road made itself the borderline between the Albanian branches. This is another proof that Albanians were living there. Linguistic evidences show that Albanian language spoken on this areas predated the Slavic migration.

The question is, ............IMO, the Ghegs and Tosks are a completely different ethnic race from each other in ancient times. Different, in culture, language and DNA

 

[Trojet]

The question is, ............IMO, the Ghegs and Tosks are a completely different ethnic race from each other in ancient times. Different, in culture, language and DNA

Your opinion doesn't matter because time and time again you have been proven wrong. Opinions are often based on facts which you don't provide any besides just expressing your anti Albanian agenda all over the internet.

 

[Sile]

Romanian is a romance language, but it was formed later than the period of the first Roman invasion in Balkans. Illyrians were the first people submitted by the Romans. After them the tracians and the Helens. The romance language which are still spoken in Balkans show a later period of evolution. Albanian language shows a earlier period of interference by the Latin. The only logical problem between Illyrian and modern Albanian language is the division satem- centum. Albanian is satem and the Illyrian was unknown. There are evidences of centum in illyrian, and likewise of satem. Tracian show a strong evidence of satem too, but we don't have much words by the tracian language, either.
But although I read sources which saying that all this division satem centum is not too much reliable.

The theory that Illyrians came from around modern Hungary and headed west and south-west over time has never been disputed , even though it is noted for 100 years before many many historians.

Illyrians also also attached to
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vučedol_culture

as Proto-illyrians, again always noted and never disputed.

Ancient greeks did note that Thracians occupied modern serbia and montenegro before the Illyrians arrived there.

 

[Sile]

Your opinion doesn't matter because time and time again you have been proven wrong. Opinions are often based on facts which you don't provide any besides just expressing your anti Albanian agenda all over the internet.

I am not anti-anyone ................I am anti-fabrication, something you seem to thrive on.............I give you questions on ancient albanians that you cannot answer, it must mean you know very little about ancient Albanians or you are not even an Albanian. Have you followed your Albanian family line?

 

[Sile]

Your opinion doesn't matter because time and time again you have been proven wrong. Opinions are often based on facts which you don't provide any besides just expressing your anti Albanian agenda all over the internet.

The Thread is about Croatians and not Albanians .....................I suggest you stop yacking about Albanians and talk about them in an Albanian thread.

 

[Trojet]

I am not anti-anyone ................I am anti-fabrication, something you seem to thrive on.............I give you questions on ancient albanians that you cannot answer, it must mean you know very little about ancient Albanians or you are not even an Albanian. Have you followed your Albanian family line?

Show me what I have fabricated? It is not my fault that you have a problem with history and trying to rewrite it. You are acting ridiculous to even question my nationality zanipolo, aka vettor, aka sile. What do u think I am? Or what do u think my Y-DNA says?

Language, archeology, and genetics all point to the same conclusion that Albanians are descendant of Paleo-Balkan populations who have inhabited roughly the same areas since the Bronze age. I dare anyone to bring facts that this is not true, otherwise please back to topic about Croatians.

 

[Trojet]

Double post. Please delete.

 

[Yetos]

You mentioned the famous via egnatia, above. The real split between the two Albanian dialects tosk and gheg was after this ancient road was built. This ancient highway is the borderline between the two dialects. Further north of this road lives the ghegs, and further south lives the tosks. This road made itself the borderline between the Albanian branches. This is another proof that Albanians were living there. Linguistic evidences show that Albanian language spoken on this areas predated the Slavic migration.

ha?

so 1200 AD is before 800 BC?

 

[Yetos]

First time I hear this theory. North West Greek dialect and doric dialect on Albanian language dismisses your theory.

?????

and I thought that Albanian is language of its own,

now you mix it again with Greek dialects?

 

[joeyc]

No they are Turkic Avars.

 

[Ike]

Show me what I have fabricated? It is not my fault that you have a problem with history and trying to rewrite it. You are acting ridiculous to even question my nationality zanipolo, aka vettor, aka sile. What do u think I am? Or what do u think my Y-DNA says?

Language, archeology, and genetics all point to the same conclusion that Albanians are descendant of Paleo-Balkan populations who have inhabited roughly the same areas since the Bronze age. I dare anyone to bring facts that this is not true, otherwise please back to topic about Croatians.

For the fifth time in this forum. I dare you to present a single proof that those Paleo Balkan people that are Albanians today were also Albanians just 1000 years ago. And open a separate thread.

 

[DuPidh]

For the fifth time in this forum. I dare you to present a single proof that those Paleo Balkan people that are Albanians today were also Albanians just 1000 years ago. And open a separate thread.

Roman sources. They state that Illyrians inhabited the region.
The amount of E v13, J2b, I2a ballkanic came from slavisized Illirians. Croatian language shows that its original site was south Poland border with Ucraine. Current slavic population living there does not have this haplogroups.

 

[Trojet]

For the fifth time in this forum. I dare you to present a single proof that those Paleo Balkan people that are Albanians today were also Albanians just 1000 years ago. And open a separate thread.

I have given you numerous sources such as this and this my ignorant Slavic friend, but your job is to deny everything Albanian, so there is no point for me to continue.

http://www.britannica.com/place/Albania/Cultural-institutions#toc129453
http://www.britannica.com/place/Albania/The-Roman-Empire#toc42643

 

[Ike]

Roman sources. They state that Illyrians inhabited the region.
The amount of E v13, J2b, I2a ballkanic came from slavisized Illirians. Croatian language shows that its original site was south Poland border with Ucraine. Current slavic population living there does not have this haplogroups.

1. A single Illyrian corpse with any of those haplogroups please?

2. What do you mean they don"t have these haplogroups? Half of Europe's got like ~10 % of E-V13. Are you certain that they didn't also have it in the 4th century? There is a huge probability that there was 10x more Slavic E-V13 that entered Balkan, than autochthonous ones.

3. How do you connect these with Albanians anyway. There is a timehole of 1000 years between.

I have given you numerous sources such as this and this my ignorant Slavic friend, but your job is to deny everything Albanian, so there is no point for me to continue.

http://www.britannica.com/place/Albania/Cultural-institutions#toc129453
http://www.britannica.com/place/Albania/The-Roman-Empire#toc42643

Do you understand a concept of a fact? What you gave up there are not facts or proofs, but opinions. And separate thread dude...

 

[Piro Ilir]

I thought those were Neanderthals who were really (!) autochthonous, not Albanians?: :shocked:

Yes, the Neanderthals were the real autochtonous. But we are talking about the people who are still alive

 

[Piro Ilir]

So your view is that Albanians were frogs? Having problem crossing the highway?




This could be a good starting point for you to think about when creating the wild theories about Albanian history:

"For instance, the high degree of sharedcommon ancestry among Albanian speakers might be because most of these originated from a small village rather than uniformly across Albania and Kosovo."

"This suggests that a reasonable proportion of the ancestors of modern-day Albanian speakers are drawn from a relatively small, cohesive population that has persisted for at least the last 1,500 years."

"These individuals share similar numbers of common ancestors with nearby populations as do individuals in other parts of Europe, implying that the Albanian speakers have not been a particularly isolated population so much as a small one."


source: http://arxiv.org/pdf/1207.3815v1.pdf

No. You misinterpreting my view. Albanians or the Albanian language survived from the Latin influence only on some isolated small pockets throughout south Illyria and Epirus. This is what I read from the serious linguists. Via egnatia was as a Latin gap between the two branches of the Albanian. This gap separated the two branches, but not only these. We had other ancient roads which divided other sub dialects of the Albanian. Ancients roads were a latinized area, where the Albanian language disappeared. If we see the ancient maps where the Roman roads crossed the territory, we will see the map of the division of the modern Albanian dialects. It can't be a coincidence