37 mtDNA sequences from Minoan Crete

Paesci said:
The bull thing in iberia, has its origins in the basque country (poor basques, always speculating about them)
And they have the highest r1b of spain and only and 2,5% J2 one of the lowest.

Bull playing was forbidden in all muslim territory during the reconquista, and in the rest of the north, galicia, asturias(where reconquista began ) and cantabria, this tradition its inexistent ,but remained in basque country and navarre , not only bullfighting but also bull running, or throwing the bulls at the streets and other bull festivals. its a basque thing that was spread across spain and evolved in andalucia in modern bullfighting.

Basque traditional style of bullfighting was based in jumps over the bull, dodges and banderillas....

See this video, is in valencia(today basque style is still in use), its remember me alot at minoian bull jumping.

i cant link, search this in youtube "incredible spanish bull leapers"
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Modern bullfighting has its origins in medieval Castile, not in the Basque country. I think you are confusing with the bull race at the San Fermin in Pamplona.

The earliest recorded bullfighting in ancient times was in Catalonia at the time of the Punic Wars. It is likely to have been brought by the Carthaginians (who inherited it from the Phoenicians).
 
kamani said:
Bull worship is characteristic of the ancient Levant. Cananites and later Carthagenians had their deity Moloch, often represented as a bull. There is also the ancient worshiping of Baal in Levant and Anatolia. So actually it is more common among ancient semitic speaking populations than among indo-european ones.
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As I said, it is a trait of J2 population, and J2 is strongest in the Levant and Anatolia.
 
ebAmerican said:
"However, R-U152 occurs in 7.3% of Cretans suggesting introgression Y chromosomes of North Italian (Venetian) origin, from the 400 years of Venetian rule of the island."

http://www.davidkfaux.org/R1b1c10_Resources.pdf
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R1b-U152 in Crete is only a portion of all the R1b. It could have been brought by the Venetians or the Romans. Anyway there is no reliable estimate of its percentage. It could be as low as 1% of the population.
 
Maciamo said:
R1b-U152 in Crete is only a portion of all the R1b. It could have been brought by the Venetians or the Romans. Anyway there is no reliable estimate of its percentage. It could be as low as 1% of the population.
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The U152 could be genoese ( ligurian ) as the genoese lost crete to venice in 1218 after a 5 year war.

true also, is that the venetians migrated up to 12000 veneti to crete in the 13th and 14th century, but most left between 1620 and 1669.
Italian archives state that the 12000 was approx 20% of the islands population in the 14th century.

The search should be the cretans that left with the venetian commander Morosini in 1669 and where placed in the venetian owned Ionian islands.........check if the populace of these islands have this U-152
 
Maciamo said:
R1b-U152 in Crete is only a portion of all the R1b. It could have been brought by the Venetians or the Romans. Anyway there is no reliable estimate of its percentage. It could be as low as 1% of the population.
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Myres et al. 2010 finds 7.25% of U152 in Crete (sample of 193)
 
Wilhelm said:
Myres et al. 2010 finds 7.25% of U152 in Crete (sample of 193)
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Yes, all right. But Crete is very mountainous and has a lot of isolated communities. The data of Martinez et al 2007 clearly showed big variations between the various regions of the island. So it all depends how evenly spread are Myres et al.'s samples. I expect the Genoan and Venetian lineages to be confined to the port cities, not to the Lasithi Plateau where the Minoan samples come from.
 
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Maciamo said:
Yes, all right. But Crete is very mountainous and has a lot of isolated communities. The data of Martinez et al 2007 clearly showed big variations between the various regions of the island. So it all depends how evenly spread are Myres et al.'s samples. I expect the Genoan and Venetian lineages to be confined to the port cities, not to the Lasithi Plateau where the Minoan samples come from.
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wiki link on lasithi plateau and other links on the net all say the venetian vacated totally all the cretan people from this area for over 200 years ( penalty of death if caught ). So we can safely say this marker was not minoan or local
 
zanipolo said:
wiki link on lasithi plateau and other links on the net all say the venetian vacated totally all the cretan people from this area for over 200 years ( penalty of death if caught ). So we can safely say this marker was not minoan or local
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I did not know that. However the plateau had to be repopulated later by people from elsewhere on the island, so it does not exclude the possibility that many Minoan lineages found their way back to this region.
 
Most Cretans today are j2, some 37%, nearly 40% of them...this accounts for the original Minoan males and their dark haired locks, the Dorians (R1b Greeks, possibly some R1a or I2) came later and destroyed Minoan civilization. Maternally I am surprised as they seem to have been very typical European , as they are today all across Europe with mtdna H dominating in literally every part of Europe, these middle eastern men , many of them, may have bred with typical cro-magnid European women.
 
wiki link on lasithi plateau and other links on the net all say the venetian vacated totally all the cretan people from this area for over 200 years ( penalty of death if caught ). So we can safely say this marker was not minoan or local
 
Attached is just before. I have enough kills to use intimidate option with the first thugs, so no need to fight them.Then pick to sneak and kill crossbowman.Which after save do you need ?
 
Hello, I have recently become very interested in Greek history (mostly with regards to Christianity). I've watched many YouTube videos recently and came across one that suggests that the Minoans were more similar to modern western/northern Europeans than to modern Greeks.

Here is the video:

youtube.com/watch?v=nrFlUDy04tI

The video cites the following study:

nature.com/articles/ncomms2871

and highlights the following figure:

nature.com/articles/ncomms2871/tables/1

Is is true that the Minoans are more similar to modern western/northern Europeans than to modern Greeks?
 
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