China, China, China!

[davef]

If anyone were to force me to wear a chip that monitors my behavior and awards points based on being an "outstanding citizen" I would curse them out, rip the chip out and flush it down a grimy toilet and make sure they see it spiral down the tube so these worthless piece of crap lowlifes know how I feel about them

 

[martinmkp]

They Chinese don't need to do much empire building - the countries that they are primarily interested in are gravitating towards China anyway. If they can economically integrate geographically pivotal and resource-rich Russia and Iran that will be a problem for us, as it would entail a huge decline in influence and economic power. They might manage to do just this without firing a single bullet:

The silk road - I think it is more idealistic concept in the head of Xi Jinping (Belt and Road Iniciative), not rality. Russia and China? Enemies who are together if any other enemy is in sight, they never truly cooperated and will not cooperate. If you look at your neat map - Central Asia was always strategic region for Russia - do you eally believe that they would give up it so easily for the sake of Silk road idea? I mean to give up in favour of China? I believe that Russia would never do it.

So to manage this dream, it is not so easy. Look at 16+China iniciative, for example. A lot of words with little results, if not taking into account Serbia and some other countries where China was active before launching the mentioned iniciative.

 

[martinmkp]

If anyone were to force me to wear a chip that monitors my behavior and awards points based on being an "outstanding citizen" I would curse them out, rip the chip out and flush it down a grimy toilet and make sure they see it spiral down the tube so these worthless piece of crap lowlifes know how I feel about them

If I am not wrong, China had this concept partially in the past already - not in electronic way, of course, but as a concept of good citizen.

 

[davef]

If I am not wrong, China had this concept partially in the past already - not in electronic way, of course, but as a concept of good citizen.

It's so ridiculous. I read they monitor things like driving over the speed limit. So if the US (as highly unlikely as it is) were to implement this, would driving just a mile over the speed limit impact my score? Would drinking alcohol impact my score, even if it's just a simple glass of wine at dinner? And to worsen things, it's essentially stamping a value on a person and forcing him/her to carry it around. That's completely demoralizing. I'm not against grading systems like what we see in schools, those are essential but this takes it too far

 

[markod]

The silk road - I think it is more idealistic concept in the head of Xi Jinping (Belt and Road Iniciative), not rality. Russia and China? Enemies who are together if any other enemy is in sight, they never truly cooperated and will not cooperate. If you look at your neat map - Central Asia was always strategic region for Russia - do you eally believe that they would give up it so easily for the sake of Silk road idea? I mean to give up in favour of China? I believe that Russia would never do it.

So to manage this dream, it is not so easy. Look at 16+China iniciative, for example. A lot of words with little results, if not taking into account Serbia and some other countries where China was active before launching the mentioned iniciative.

Russian-China relations have never been better. It's a matter of realism in any case: Russia doesn't have the population or the political will to exploit its vast resources, let alone project power in Central Asia. Russia is not a rising power, but an alliance with China would prevent its decline. Its main adversaries are the EU/US.

 

[Alcuin]

The Chinese are now buying farmland in France. Why shouldn't they, if we are stupid enough to let them do it?

I don't understand this either. French media seem happy to attack middle-class English folk for buying up France's 'precious' chateaux and raising house prices through the purchase of second homes, as indeed the English media seem happy to make reference to Russian and Saudi 'oil dollars' and 'blood money' buying up swathes of London. Yet there's never a mention of the Chinese government buying energy companies, farmland, housing projects, etc. Why?

 

[Groninger]

Russian-China relations have never been better. It's a matter of realism in any case: Russia doesn't have the population or the political will to exploit its vast resources, let alone project power in Central Asia. Russia is not a rising power, but an alliance with China would prevent its decline. Its main adversaries are the EU/US.

The EU/US don't leave Russia another option but to form an alliance with China. How else should the Russians react to the expansion of NATO right to their border?

 

[LABERIA]

The EU/US don't leave Russia another option but to form an alliance with China. How else should the Russians react to the expansion of NATO right to their border?

But even Russia don`t leave to EU and USA another option. You think that the end of the Cold War was the end of the war? No, it`s an inevitable fatality, Thucydides Trap is called.
"τοὺς Ἀθηναίους ἡγοῦμαι μεγάλους γιγνομένους καὶ φόβον παρέχοντας τοῖς Λακεδαιμονίοις ἀναγκἀσαι ἐς τὸ πολεμεῖν"
"What made war inevitable was the growth of Athenian power and the fear which this caused in Sparta."

 

[Groninger]

But even Russia don`t leave to EU and USA another option. You think that the end of the Cold War was the end of the war? No, it`s an inevitable fatality, Thucydides Trap is called.
"τοὺς Ἀθηναίους ἡγοῦμαι μεγάλους γιγνομένους καὶ φόβον παρέχοντας τοῖς Λακεδαιμονίοις ἀναγκἀσαι ἐς τὸ πολεμεῖν"
"What made war inevitable was the growth of Athenian power and the fear which this caused in Sparta."

Well, the expansion of NATO into Warschau Pact territory was not inevitable, it was a political choice, as it was a choice for the West to get involved in the Ukraine and Georgia.

 

[bicicleur 2]

Well, the expansion of NATO into Warschau Pact territory was not inevitable, it was a political choice, as it was a choice for the West to get involved in the Ukraine and Georgia.

I don't know about NATO, but some western politicians who should have known better were pretty naïve about the orange revolution at Maidan square.
Nevertheless if Saoudi-Arabia is goin to become a NATO member, I don't see why Ukraïne not.

 

[hrvclv]

I don't understand this either. French media seem happy to attack middle-class English folk for buying up France's 'precious' chateaux and raising house prices through the purchase of second homes, as indeed the English media seem happy to make reference to Russian and Saudi 'oil dollars' and 'blood money' buying up swathes of London. Yet there's never a mention of the Chinese government buying energy companies, farmland, housing projects, etc. Why?

I am not aware of much complaining round here against British (or, for that matter, Dutch) people buying real estate in France. In fact it keeps prices from plummeting in remote rural areas, which is good news for those who sell.

As regards Chinese-owned farms, well, they currently distribute their produce locally. But the concern is that they might in future ship their production directly from the farm to China if demand there rises dramatically. Which would pose a risk for European food safety. Chinese reps are already buying significant quantities of timber, which goes straight to China.

 

[bicicleur 2]

I am not aware of much complaining round here against British (or, for that matter, Dutch) people buying real estate in France. In fact it keeps prices from plummeting in remote rural areas, which is good news for those who sell.

As regards Chinese-owned farms, well, they currently distribute their produce locally. But the concern is that they might in future ship their production directly from the farm to China if demand there rises dramatically. Which would pose a risk for European food safety. Chinese reps are already buying significant quantities of timber, which goes straight to China.

are the Chinese buying farms in France?

 

[LABERIA]

Well, the expansion of NATO into Warschau Pact territory was not inevitable, it was a political choice, as it was a choice for the West to get involved in the Ukraine and Georgia.

Excuse me, but what they should have done in your opinion, stay good and see that Russia surpassed the difficult moment and then return back stronger and not only recover everything that had lost but even see one day the Russian soldiers wash their boots on the Channel? The end of the Cold War means only the end of an episode of this clash between Russia and the West, not the end of the war per se.
Then, we must not forget that there was also an almost unanimous will to join EU and NATO, not only of the governments of the former member countries of the Warsaw Pact but also of the population of these countries who have always seen participation in these pacts(Warsaw and Comecon), not as an alliance but as an occupation by the Soviets.
However the principle is simple, if you do not attack them, they will attack you. There is no third option.

 

[LeBrok]

Well, the expansion of NATO into Warschau Pact territory was not inevitable, it was a political choice, as it was a choice for the West to get involved in the Ukraine and Georgia.

Countries can't enter NATO by their own will because they will anger Russia?!

 

[Groninger]

Of course it is understandable the former Warschau Pact nations wanted to join NATO, but NATO should not have accepted them, especially in the case of the Baltic states; that has been a Peace of Weimar-like mistake.

 

[CrazyDonkey]

It's a Devil's bargain (with Hell to pay). We'll enslave our people and put them to work for you, if you'll sell us your soul.

 

[Minty]

Russian-China relations have never been better. It's a matter of realism in any case: Russia doesn't have the population or the political will to exploit its vast resources, let alone project power in Central Asia. Russia is not a rising power, but an alliance with China would prevent its decline. Its main adversaries are the EU/US.

Well, the Mainland Chinese, yes this is what we overseas-born Chinese called them, gave a chunk of land to the Russians. That piece of land has petrol. As a result, the Russians has made money from that. Yes, Russians do like to befriends with the Chinese. Not just the Mainland Chinese. I get a lot of approaches from them.

 

[Minty]

Chinese scientists are creating CRISPR babies.
A daring effort is under way to create the first children whose DNA has been tailored using gene editing.

https://www.technologyreview.com/s/...Xh8pZZed6ByAJKhs5TKKRnTHJIbXEBlWn04idgfUgVMko

they are going to use technology that is considered non-ethical in the west, and I don't see how we can prevent them from doing so

it is important to be more critical about what is ethical and what not
we must be sure our judgment is not clouded by lobbyists of all kinds or by political correctness
or we will be no match for China and the like

This is indeed unethical. It is almost like in past when the Mainland Chinese invented gun powder but due to confucianism it was not used to rule the world. Then, the west used it to rule to world. The west had found formulas how to modify genetics prior to the Mainland Chinese scientist ability to do this, however, due to ethnical reasons, they did not go forward with this. It is as if though, communism destroyed Chinese traditional cultures and now it is just about power and money, but instead of ruled by the emperors, it is now replaced by communist rulers.

 

[martinmkp]

Of course it is understandable the former Warschau Pact nations wanted to join NATO, but NATO should not have accepted them, especially in the case of the Baltic states; that has been a Peace of Weimar-like mistake.

This your thought - I would be very thankful if you could elaborate it more clearly - hope I did not understand you well.

 

[martinmkp]

Well, the Mainland Chinese, yes this is what we overseas-born Chinese called them, gave a chunk of land to the Russians. That piece of land has petrol. As a result, the Russians has made money from that. Yes, Russians do like to befriends with the Chinese. Not just the Mainland Chinese. I get a lot of approaches from them.

Only for curiosity - what "chunk of land" do you refer to?