Hitler's Y-DNA?

[Gheg]

I think there are sick people with every haplogroup. Not to mention there are women who are sick and have no Y chromosome at all. I do believe certain traits may be programmed in the Y Chromosome, but insanity is a disease not a trait.

 

[brakeyawself]

So in conclusion, Hitler's Y haplo has no recent connection to Jews or Africans. yay. Glad that got worked out.

 

[norbert]

Has it been confirmed that Hitler belonged to E-V13? As someone mentioned, about 8-9% of Austrian men carry that haplogroup. I don't see how there could be a Jewish or NA connection. Like all European men who belong to that haplogroup, Hitler's autosomal profile was entirely European. Whoever brought that haplogroup to Europe, did so 8000 years ago. There's basically nothing left from that individual's genetic legacy. And there were no Jews 8000 years ago nor is E-V13 (or E-M78 for that matter) a Jewish haplogroup. Even the Ashkenazim are predominantly European when it comes to their autosomal heritage.

 

[Southpaw]

Has it been confirmed that Hitler belonged to E-V13? As someone mentioned, about 8-9% of Austrian men carry that haplogroup. I don't see how there could be a Jewish or NA connection. Like all European men who belong to that haplogroup, Hitler's autosomal profile was entirely European. Whoever brought that haplogroup to Europe, did so 8000 years ago. There's basically nothing left from that individual's genetic legacy. And there were no Jews 8000 years ago nor is E-V13 (or E-M78 for that matter) a Jewish haplogroup. Even the Ashkenazim are predominantly European when it comes to their autosomal heritage.

It has not been confirmed but i lean almost certainly that he was E-V13. If he was some sort of E-M34 or E-M81 or E-V12, or E-V22 certainly they would have posted his whole subclade, but since they only posted E1b1b likely he was E-V13, they wanted to sound more sensational and make it paradoxical so they stopped at E-M215 not elaborating further the subclade.

This is my opinion of course.

 

[Riverman]

It was an old test, most likely, so they never went further than that. The result was sensational enough the way it was, so they had no need to dig deeper.

 

[Southpaw]

It was an old test, most likely, so they never went further than that. The result was sensational enough the way it was, so they had no need to dig deeper.

I heard a historian saying that if Hitler invaded Western Poland, Switzerland, Austria, Czhech Republic and stopped at there he would have been hailed as the greatest statesmen of Germany, instead he went full retard on warmongering and on Jewish civilians resulting in Holocaust. He just could not put his ego on check. They were also too hurt from WW1 ending.

Also, he was kinda too obsessed and paranoid on Bolshevik-Communists, he accused Jews of conspiracy on creating Bolshevik revolution, ironically he wasn't too wrong on that, a lot of Jews were crucial on Bolshevik revolution, but it is not as if Jews have a committee to decide what evil they should do next, i think this is the part where it becomes conspiracy.

 

[Riverman]

I heard a historian saying that if Hitler invaded Western Poland, Switzerland, Austria Czhech Republic...

Germany didn't invade Switzerland...

 

[Southpaw]

Germany didn't invade Switzerland...

My bad, must have been wrong there.

 

[norbert]

It has not been confirmed but i lean almost certainly that he was E-V13. If he was some sort of E-M34 or E-M81 or E-V12, or E-V22 certainly they would have posted his whole subclade, but since they only posted E1b1b likely he was E-V13, they wanted to sound more sensational and make it paradoxical so they stopped at E-M215 not elaborating further the subclade.

This is my opinion of course.

I agree with riverman that they simply didn't dig deeper. The sensationalism is also featured in Maciamo's own entry where he emphasises that the Afroasiatic languages originated among carriers of haplogroup E. Compared to most other haplogroups, with the exception of C and D, of course, E can be viewed as a macro-haplogroup. Only some clades of E can be associated with AA (even the language family itself is controversial, especially in regards to Omotic being classified under that category; same can be said about its proposed age) and we can't say that E-M78 can be counted among the candidates, regardless of where subclades of that haplogroup are found today.

I don't know if it was mentioned on the forum but I recently came across an article on the website of Austria's public broadcaster ORF in which the case for a West Asian origin of Homo sapiens was made. This theory is based on the discovery of a 1m-year-old human skull discovered in 1990 in China. For a long time it was believed that the skull belonged to Homo erectus but now it's classified as Homo longi, close relatives of the Denisovans. This suggests that the split between Homo sapiens, the Neanderthals and Denisovans occured much earlier than previously thought. Same goes for the diversification of various Homo sapiens groups. I mention this because this could mean a strong shift in favour of a Eurasian origin of DE and subsequently D and E, which, in my opinion, always made much more sense. The dominant presence of a haplogroup today, including its diversity (a rather unreliable argument for any haplogroup), does not mean that that's where it originated.

 

[norbert]

I heard a historian saying that if Hitler invaded Western Poland, Switzerland, Austria, Czhech Republic and stopped at there he would have been hailed as the greatest statesmen of Germany, instead he went full retard on warmongering and on Jewish civilians resulting in Holocaust. He just could not put his ego on check. They were also too hurt from WW1 ending.

Also, he was kinda too obsessed and paranoid on Bolshevik-Communists, he accused Jews of conspiracy on creating Bolshevik revolution, ironically he wasn't too wrong on that, a lot of Jews were crucial on Bolshevik revolution, but it is not as if Jews have a committee to decide what evil they should do next, i think this is the part where it becomes conspiracy.

Hitler had the backing of Germany's industrialists and bankers. Yes, he did dictate policy but he had support among the revanchist classes. Germany in WW2 was Germany from WWI, just under a different disguise. The imperial ambitions were the same. Since Germany failed to establish colonies on other continents like Britain and France did, it focused on Eastern Europe and hegemony in continental Europe. All the ruling classes in Europe were obsessed with the threat of Bolshevism. Churchill was no less an anti-Bolshevik than Hitler and even openly symphatised with Mussolini in whom he saw a bulwark against Bolshevism. Similarly, Hitler was seen as a solution against the rising threat emanating from the Communist and workers movement.

I'm not sure how much of Hitler's antisemitism stemmed from their identification with Bolshevism. It seems his antisemitism was cultivated during his years in Vienna where he had some bad experiences with them. For instance, he was angry because Jewish vice was rampant in Vienna. The same issue was raised elsewhere, especially after Jewish emancipation, most notably in France. In other words, he viewed Jews as crooks that were corrupting the German nation from within. The Bolshevik aspect was only part of the story.

On the other hand, he was very kind to his family doctor who was Jewish. He wrote a letter to said doctor to express his eternal gratitude for everything he did for Hitler's mother who died of cancer. It was Hitler who let him escape in 1938 or so. There is absolutely that ever suggested that Hitler was paranoid or mentally sick in any other way. You can be perfectly sane and of genius intellect, yet still commit vile atrocities through rationalisation. The mass murder of Jews was not initially planned. What the Nazis wanted was to expell them from Germany and possibly all of Europe. Some Zionist factions collaborated with the Nazis, trying to get their support for the establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine. There was also the so-called Madagascar Plan. It was only in 1942 that they opted for the "Endlösung" because war was already going bad for Germany. Disenfranchised and excluded from contributing to the economy of Germany, the Jews were simply confined to ghettoes. Simply put, they were a burden to the (war) economy since they had to be fed and ressources were becoming scarce for ethnic Germans as well. Another problem was the historically underdeveloped agriculture of Germany which is why they were so hell-bent on getting their hands on the fertile land of Ukraine and southern Russia. This was not just a Nazi ambition. It had been part of the "Drang nach Osten" agenda since WW1.

The people who organised and executed the industrial murder of Europe's Jews were technocrats you never heard of. Economists, social scientists, lawyers, statisticians, bureaucrats of all sorts. Many of them continued to have illustrious careers after the war. It wasn't the ideologues or at least not primarily.

 

[norbert]

So apparently it's not enough that Hitler was a genocidal mass murderer, they have to invent some more stuff about him. Previous claims that he was a madman, a homosexual, an illegitimate child, of Jewish origin (the argument of self-hatred), of Slavic origin, and impotent, are no longer enough to attract media attention. Meet the new "discoveries" made by... "scientists."

Hitler's DNA reveals Nazi leader likely had syndrome that can affect genitals, researchers say​

Hitler's DNA reveals Nazi leader likely had syndrome that can affect genitals, researchers say

Researchers behind the "Hitler's DNA" documentary say the Nazi dictator likely had Kallmann Syndrome, a rare genetic condition which can cause undescended testicles and a micropenis.

www.cbsnews.com

Hear, hear. Hitler "most likely" suffered from Kallmann syndrome, leading to a "micropenis." Begs the question how he then developed secondary sexual characteristics resulting in a very masculine appearance which includes the sporting of a conspicuous moustache.

Obviously this nonsense disseminated to counter Hitler's alleged popularity on social media and to attack the so-called groypers. The authors of the documentary seem to know everything about Hitler's intimate life and relationships to women. Apparently if you're not a hypersexualised womaniser, you must be gay or genetically maimed. I guess we can't say that about Jeffrey Epstein. Anyway, there are enough studies and books that discussed Hitler's relationship to women. Most women that interacted with him described him as kind and caring. Hitler was very much shaped by the early loss of his mother who died from cancer and the suicide of his niece Geli Raubal.

The whitewashing and overt demonisation of a negative historical figure are two sides of the same coin and inherently opposed to a rational and conscientious study of historical truth. Even to describe Hitler as a bloodthirsty madman is a trivialisation of the crimes committed by the Nazis. Those crimes were not the doing of a single man, the ideology underlying them not the articulation of a single mind. Nazism, like fascism, arose in a particular historical context, under particular circumstances. To insinuate that all goes back to a single man having a micropenis is as an insult to the human intellect.

 

[Riverman]

Like I wrote at genarchivist he was most likely a silent carrier of recessive allels, without symptoms. Usually, that sydrome being associated with effeminated body proprtions, very weak beard and body hair and a high pitch voice.

 

[norbert]

Like I wrote at genarchivist he was most likely a silent carrier of recessive allels, without symptoms. Usually, that sydrome being associated with effeminated body proprtions, very weak beard and body hair and a high pitch voice.

The sample itself is rather questionable, provided it was even acquired. The Guardian cast some doubt, writing that "in their attempt to authenticate the blood, the research team failed to get a fresh DNA sample from any of Hitler's surviving relatives in Austria and the U.S., who are all understandably reluctant about media exposure."
This paragraph is from the CBS article linked above:

The Guardian article, however, said that many scientists aren't comfortable using the kind of genetic testing cited by the researchers, known as "polygenic risk scores," to indicate an individual's likelihood of developing such disorders.

An in-depth explanation from The Guardian:

Instead, the makers also set out to “assess [Hitler’s] genetic propensity for psychiatric and neurodevelopmental conditions”, by carrying out polygenic risk score (PRS) tests. From the results, they assert that Hitler had “higher-than-likely average likelihood of ADHD”, a “high probability” of some autistic behaviours, a “propensity for antisocial behaviour” and “a high probability of developing schizophrenia”.

PRS tests are part of a booming industry that promise to estimate individuals’ risks for developing not just diseases but also behaviours: popular websites such as ancestry.co.uk, where people can submit swabs to trace their heritage, now also automatically suggest to subscribers whether they are likely to have certain “traits”, such as “trying new things”.

Many scientists fear this to be part of an insidious creep towards genetic determinism that is not backed by evidence. “Polygenic risk scores tell you something about population at large, not about individuals,” says David Curtis, an honorary professor at the UCL Genetics Institute. “If a test shows you to be in the upper percentile of polygenic risk, the actual risk of acquiring a condition may still be very low, even for conditions that are strongly influenced by genetic factors”. A psychological test may determine whether you have a “propensity” for schizophrenia – a PRS test, many scientists say, cannot indicate a propensity in the same sense of the word.

Did Hitler really have a ‘micropenis’? The dubious documentary analysing the dictator’s DNA

Was the wartime chant about his solitary testicle correct? Did he have Jewish ancestry? New documentary Hitler’s DNA is trying to answer these, and more contentious, questions – but should it have gone there at all?

www.theguardian.com

 

[Southpaw]

So the likelihood that Hitler was E-V13 have increased exponentially.

They state they have compared the y-dna with decade old cousin Y-DNA study which was E-M35. They refuse Jewish origin and state it is kinda common among Austrians.

We can deduce what they mean, it is E-V13 afterall.

IDK about the rest of the comments, Hitler had a very deep voice, how can someone with Kalmann have such a deep voice.

Ironically, Churchill should have been E-V13 as well.

 

[Riverman]

So the likelihood that Hitler was E-V13 have increased exponentially.

They state they have compared the y-dna with decade old cousin Y-DNA study which was E-M35. They refuse Jewish origin and state it is kinda common among Austrians.

We can deduce what they mean, it is E-V13 afterall.

IDK about the rest of the comments, Hitler had a very deep voice, how can someone with Kalmann have such a deep voice.

Ironically, Churchill should have been E-V13 as well.

Its not just the voice, but also the beard growth and body proportions. Going by the available evidence, he had average to above average beard growth, which should be totally uncommon for the phenotype of the syndrome.

Concerning the likelihood for E-V13, yes indeed, it is the most likely variant, since E-V13 rises in Northern Lower Austria and Southern Czechia, from which we can assume his ancestor came from, to about 5-10 %, whereas other variants of E-M35 are extremely rare.
If his unknown grandfather would have been Jewish, E-M34 would have been the much more likely option, but given that this is not the case, E-V13 is more than 10 times as likely to be his haplogroup.

If Churchill was E-V13, which is not as sure, since we have no direct testing, we have something of a downstream variant determined as well. I would like to get a more detailed information about other prominent E-V13 carriers, like Hitler and Putin.

For Garibaldi I know he was very likely a member of E-FGC11451, because that's the most common haplogroup of a namesake from his birth region plus its the most common E-V13 branch in tested Genuese in general.

 

[norbert]

The only "sources" that claim that Putin belongs to E-V13 are Albanian online tabloids. They even make the absurd claim that his ancestors came from Kosovo.

The other kind of "sources" are Russian/Belarusian opposition groups in exile like this one: https://charter97.org/en/news/2025/3/24/634295/

Here's a motive:

He has something in common with Hitler.

It is much more likely that Putin is N1c. Otherwise it's simply R1a. E1b is a very exotic haplogroup among Russians and the hacking story is for the gullible.

It's also very unlikely that Churchill was E-V13. Sounds like wishful thinking. While we're at it, I'd be interested in finding out which branch the Attenboroughs belong to?

 

[Riverman]

The only "sources" that claim that Putin belongs to E-V13 are Albanian online tabloids. They even make the absurd claim that his ancestors came from Kosovo.

The other kind of "sources" are Russian/Belarusian opposition groups in exile like this one: https://charter97.org/en/news/2025/3/24/634295/

Here's a motive:



It is much more likely that Putin is N1c. Otherwise it's simply R1a. E1b is a very exotic haplogroup among Russians and the hacking story is for the gullible.

It's also very unlikely that Churchill was E-V13. Sounds like wishful thinking. While we're at it, I'd be interested in finding out which branch the Attenboroughs belong to?

E-V13 is not that rare in Russians, as I can see in my own matches by the way.

The Churchill story is a fairly typical one insofar, as you have a descendant of a line, but the issue with such cases is always which genealogy holds and whether there are NPE's etc. Again we have multiple old English E-V13 lineages in the data base and even if both Putin and Churchill would be confirmed E-V13, we would still have way more prominent people from other lineages in these ethnicities. So the statistics will hold and correlate with the 2-5 % both English and Russians seem to have.

Really rare and astonishing results are from haplogroups which account for less than 1 % in a population. Everything which has multiple percents is not that extraordinary. If you think about it that way, 5 percent is every 20th, like 1-2 in every school class of 30 boys and 2,5 % is still a 3/4 chance for a class to get at least one.
If you look at percentages that way, how likely it is to have in a class of 30 boys one carrier, you get what's really rare.

In that sense any E-M35 haplogroup other than E-V13 would be exceptionally rare in Northern Lower Austria and Southern Czechia among non-Jewish locals, while E-V13 would appear in every school class about 1-3 times on average and being therefore fairly common.

I wouldn't consider a haplogroup which appears regularly in about 1 in 30 or more that rare. Really rare is anything at e.g. 1 in 100. And that's not the case for Lower Austrians and Southern Czech people, but also not in Russians and English for E-V13.

 

[Southpaw]

The only "sources" that claim that Putin belongs to E-V13 are Albanian online tabloids. They even make the absurd claim that his ancestors came from Kosovo.

The other kind of "sources" are Russian/Belarusian opposition groups in exile like this one: https://charter97.org/en/news/2025/3/24/634295/

Here's a motive:



It is much more likely that Putin is N1c. Otherwise it's simply R1a. E1b is a very exotic haplogroup among Russians and the hacking story is for the gullible.

It's also very unlikely that Churchill was E-V13. Sounds like wishful thinking. While we're at it, I'd be interested in finding out which branch the Attenboroughs belong to?

Actually it is not Albanian media who posted, they were kinda the last, the first was German media bild i think. IDK about Putin, i do not want to comment on that.

In regards to Churchill, it is not wishfull thinking, Princess Diana's brother confirmed in genealogy that their male line and the American Spencer branch (who tested E-V13, FGC1451 subclade i think) stem from the same root. Churchill is related to Diana's male family.

I have to edit and say that although 4 brothers Spencer claim Bedford Spencer ancestry, this issue is still unsettled, the likelihood of them being of same paternal root is big, but nothing is verified so far.

 

[Southpaw]

Attenboroughs AFAIK are under E-V13 S2979.