I2(I-S17250) birthplace

Newbie here. Did 23&Me and Ancestry.com so far.

39% (and most): I2a1b2a1 S17250 aka. Y=P204

With these subs that I still know very little about


I-Y4882

I-Z16971
I-Z16983

According to family history: the First known ancestor (supposedly) was Stanislaw Hosszúmezey (Dolhay) c 1330-1366 Vovoide of Beregh County, in the Kingdom of Hungary. Later family members got nobility type papers and served in various military, judicial, and administrative capacities in Northern Transylvania, Slovakia, Western Ukraine, and later Buda and Vienna.

I was born in Budapest, Hungary, but only 2 gen away from Transylvanian birthplaces of Paternal Grandparents.

Both the the Polish and the Croatian connection with
I-Y4882 come as somewhat of a surprise and I'm trying to connect the dots with all of it. I guess it's entirely possible, given the constant movement and mixing in the region, and I'm sort of wondering if one of my foremothers "had stepped off the reservation sometime in the past"... and (Family) History is only about papers , legends, and some archaeology, but genetics you can't really argue with...

I think you do not have enough knowledge to understand results.
First off all you cannot be 39% S17250, you can be only positive or negative on S17250, in some rare cases there is "no call" for a SNP which means that test did not read the position.
The second thing is that you cannot in same time be positive on 3 parallel branches of S17250 (I-Y4882 I-Z16971 I-Z16983). Those branches have common ancestor that lived at least 1850 years ago. You can see it on the tree https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-S17250/
So if you are positive on one of three branches you named here, automatically you are negative on the rest two.
I know that all of it might be confusing for newbies.

Have you taken recently 23andme test?
Is your test V5 chip that test S17250?
Could you see what is your Y-haplogroup results at 23andme?
Is your known paternal line from Beregh county Hungarian or Slavic? Name Stanislaw is a slavic name.
 
Why do you use the term "white" Croats. Its like referring to Nigerians as "black" Nigerians lol

Y Haplogroup: I2(I-S17250)
mtDNA: U5b2a

From what I recall reading, peoples of the steppes used colours to denote direction. White was west. The ancestors of Croats (at least the people we inherited the name Croats from) were a steppic people who migrated into Europe and resided over the Slavs as a ruling military caste. These Slavs eventually became White Croats (West Croats).
 
From what I recall reading, peoples of the steppes used colours to denote direction. White was west. The ancestors of Croats (at least the people we inherited the name Croats from) were a steppic people who migrated into Europe and resided over the Slavs as a ruling military caste. These Slavs eventually became White Croats (West Croats).

The Iranian (steppic) origin of Croats is just a speculation. First known Croatian dukes had Slavic names and their language was Slavic. The genetics and anthropology also indicate Slavic origin. Archeology doesn't see any traces of Iranian culture in Croatian medieval tombs.

However, Slavs also used colours (white as north). The example is the name of modern country of Belarus (= White Rus').
 
Hello All. I am in yseq right now getting processed. So far...

Quick results summary:
I2a-M423 Panel processing
CTS10228 C+
S17250 A+
PH908 C-
Y4882 A+
Y5596 A-
A10230 processing
Y16473 processing

I am Interested in your discussions on where my distant ancestors paths were. Interestingly my father came up as 16% Greek where I have no Greek showing for me in MyHeritage system but I show % as 53 Balkan 44 Baltic and 3 Scandinavian. I haven’t seen much talk here recently so maybe the chat has gone elsewhere... let me know - Richard
 
Hello there!

Unfortunately the most of the I2a1b (and subclade forums) are pretty silents.
I only know my Y side til I-S17250 and don't know deeper subclades.

I'm not sure here, and hope someone will correct me, but as I see at the moment:
I haplogroup is one of the "local" haplogroups in Europe, and it's here since the cro magnons are here. You can find subclades and variants almost every European paleolithic, mesolithic and neolithic cultures. Here is a huge gap in my knowledge and in the timeline, but the next step for "us" are the so-called or better say, maybe pre-Slavic cultures, like Przeworsk and Zarubnty cultures. Later on, this line became White Croatian around the area of Vistula, and wandered with the other Slavic or Slavicized haplogroups from there to the Carphatians (maybe became the Rusyns there), and to the Balkan: they became Croatians, Serbs and Bosnians, in different percentages.
Or at least this is how seems at the moment for me.

The connection with other cultures, like Goths, Vandals, Bastarnae, Dacians and Thracians is an open question for me.

I hope it's helped at least little bit.
 
Some interesting stuffs from the comments on the blog.

Ancient DNA from pre-Slavic and Slavic individuals was extracted to compare human genetic diversity before and after a possible demographic event traditionally associated with Slavic ethnogenesis.
Study Title: Genetic Diversity in Migration Period and Early Middle Ages
Center Name: University of Fribourg
Study Name: Pre-Slavic and Slavic Ancient DNA

Raw data link: https://www.ebi.ac.uk/ena/browser/view/PRJEB39997

Results:
LIB11 https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-L241/
LIB2 https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-Z180/
LIB3 NA
POH11 https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-Z283/
POH13 NA
POH27 https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-P312/ eventually https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-Y3267/
POH28 https://www.yfull.com/tree/R-Z92/
POH3 NA
POH36 https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-S17250/
POH40 NA
POH41 https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-Z16971/
POH44 https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-S17250/

LIB is Breclav-Libiva (5th century), POH is Pohansko (early Middle Ages)

I hope raw data could be analyzed more so we can find about subclades. For now, there are 3 x S17250
I have not managed to find original paperwork to see dating of the samples, it could be anywhere between 6th and 10th century.
 
Getting further


SampleID Ordered Marker+ Chr Start End Allele
35840 2021-02-22 CTS10228 ChrY 17222477 17222477 C+
35840 free FGC27543 ChrY 19858974 19858974 G+
35840 free FGC30459 ChrY 18973336 18973336 A+
35840 2021-02-22 S17250 ChrY 13419474 13419474 A+
35840 free V3022 ChrY 13419474 13419474 A+
35840 free V4023 ChrY 17222477 17222477 C+
35840 2021-02-22 Y4882 ChrY 18973336 18973336 A+
35840 free YP204 ChrY 13419474 13419474 A+
35840 free YP2178 ChrY 19858974 19858974 G+
 
FYI A1328 is a typical SNP for a Serbian group of families known as Rodići. Also known as Krajiski Srbi (Serbs from Military Frontier) Perhaps this group of families originate from North Macedonia (Medieval Serbia) Very interesting for this group is the fact they all celebrate the same Slava – St. Archangel Michael/Aranđelov-dan. Perhaps they moved from Prilep (North Macedonia) to Herzegovina (Old Serbian land as well) then spread across all territories of Austro-Hungarian Military frontier (Bosnia, Dalmatia and Lika,...) Perhaps your ancestor moved to Hungary...
Google the next headline Rodići – priča o jednoj porodici

Slava – very unique tradition among Serbs. Equally useful like last name and haplogroup – helps with tracing of fathers lineages
Look for Slava on Wikipedia
 

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