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Illyrian-Albanian Continuity

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@Garrick

Don't overestimate E-V13. It's high percentage on Kosovo is just an anomaly due to a recent and obvious genetic drift. It's even higher than in Albania itself.
If you want to see thing clearly just think of that area colored same as others around, as it was up to 200 years ago.

I noticed it, but my friend from one Balkan country told me that there are areas in Romania with high percent E-V13 and maybe they can be trace (he gave a lot of arguments about this). And of this forum you can read about it. Of course, and your arguments are logical.

But for me it is interesting discussion of Dienekes who argues that (Greek ) J2 very late entered in Albanian population, and it is possible as assimilation of Greeks. I would like to see more evidence of this.
 
You can see thread "Thracians spoke Balto Slavic language", where Romanians and Serbs, also and today's Bulgarians are probably mostly desendants of Thracians.

It is possible that ancestors of todays Albanians had a close environment with Dacians, somewhere in Romania. Here and another forums some members pointed that Albanians probably originate from the area in/about Romania or they had lived in Romania any time, probably in mountain areas. And when they left that areas they came to Bulgaria, and with the progress of Bulgarian state, to Adriatic. If it is correct then Albanians has nothing with Illyrians.

According Y-DNA it is interesting situation, they have E-V13 (relative majority), J2, R1b (mostly Armenian haplotype, Ht35), R1a, and less I2a.

What can be some explanation, if such movements were:

Armenians or similar Caucasian people mostly R1b Ht35 came in mountain areas of Romania (similar at Caucasus), here met numerous group of indigenous, who much earlier came as early farmers with Middle East/Egypt, mostly E-V13. There they were mixed but it is possible that the elite consisted by Caucasians. Meanwhile, in the meantime they had liguistic influence of Dacians. When they moved to Bulgaria had different impacts which in reflected in haplogroups. Certainly, in Romania and Bulgaria, R1a and I2a entered in their population.

If the basis of Albanian is Armenian, or similar, then problem don't exist, because Armenian is Satem. Some words are from E-V13 population. And impacts of Dacian can be explained.

But it is possible (Dienekes wrote about it) that J2 came in their population the latest, with Greek assimilation, maybe in Adriatic and hinterland. It can be explanation why in Albanian has relatively few Greek words, when Greek population is assimilated language was already created. Far is all proven but it is a possible explanation of movement. If it is true of course that there are Thracian/Slavic DNA (I2a, R1a) but it is interestnig more in Tosks than Gegs.
There are many R1b1a2a2 in Caucasus Albania(Southern Dagestan, Northern Azerbaijan)
The Bagvalins(Bagvalal) have 75% R1b1a2
 
Axiom level 999 :)



So what are Albanian God given lands?
Its Illyrian territories. Those are our ancestral lands. You sit on them. I am not saying we will recover them, it will be a nonsense to claim that. But God gave those lands to us and we were not able to keep what god gave to us.
Slavic lands lie from today's Ukraine up to Mongolia.
 
I noticed it, but my friend from one Balkan country told me that there are areas in Romania with high percent E-V13 and maybe they can be trace (he gave a lot of arguments about this). And of this forum you can read about it. Of course, and your arguments are logical.

But for me it is interesting discussion of Dienekes who argues that (Greek ) J2 very late entered in Albanian population, and it is possible as assimilation of Greeks. I would like to see more evidence of this.

Dienekes is a Greek centrist propagandist. He claims that Arvanites are Greeks by heritage not citizenship. Greek y Dna is mostly J2a as it is Turkeys. Albanians on the other hand score up to 15% J2b and less than 3% J2a.
So had Albanian J2 been Greek would have been J2a. Up to 3% of Greek J2 is J2b, same like Albanians but if you keep in mind that 25% of Greek population is Arvanites ( Albanian) it does quite make sense Dienekes propaganda of J2 in Albania is Greek.
Foe Dienekes center of earth is in Delphi Greece. So if you accept the B.S Dienekes is trying to spread is an individual matter but no real science is involved in it.
 
You can see thread "Thracians spoke Balto Slavic language", where Romanians and Serbs, also and today's Bulgarians are probably mostly desendants of Thracians.

It is possible that ancestors of todays Albanians had a close environment with Dacians, somewhere in Romania. Here and another forums some members pointed that Albanians probably originate from the area in/about Romania or they had lived in Romania any time, probably in mountain areas. And when they left that areas they came to Bulgaria, and with the progress of Bulgarian state, to Adriatic. If it is correct then Albanians has nothing with Illyrians.

According Y-DNA it is interesting situation, they have E-V13 (relative majority), J2, R1b (mostly Armenian haplotype, Ht35), R1a, and less I2a.

What can be some explanation, if such movements were:

Armenians or similar Caucasian people mostly R1b Ht35 came in mountain areas of Romania (similar at Caucasus), here met numerous group of indigenous, who much earlier came as early farmers with Middle East/Egypt, mostly E-V13. There they were mixed but it is possible that the elite consisted by Caucasians. Meanwhile, in the meantime they had liguistic influence of Dacians. When they moved to Bulgaria had different impacts which in reflected in haplogroups. Certainly, in Romania and Bulgaria, R1a and I2a entered in their population.

If the basis of Albanian is Armenian, or similar, then problem don't exist, because Armenian is Satem. Some words are from E-V13 population. And impacts of Dacian can be explained.

But it is possible (Dienekes wrote about it) that J2 came in their population the latest, with Greek assimilation, maybe in Adriatic and hinterland. It can be explanation why in Albanian has relatively few Greek words, when Greek population is assimilated language was already created. Far is all proven but it is a possible explanation of movement. If it is true of course that there are Thracian/Slavic DNA (I2a, R1a) but it is interestnig more in Tosks than Gegs.
You better open a fantasy thread. You don't show minimum knowledge of things you are trying to discuss. The Dacian tale you are trying to sell here is discredited. Dacian vocabulary of Latin is two century after Christ, Albanian vocabulary is 1 century before Christ. Had Albanians been from the same are like Dacians should the vocabulary of Latin been of the same period?
I know you don't know those things because you are on a different mission, but you discredit yourself with the utterly lack of knowledge than you are building your cause.
I never have tried to discuss Slavic ancestry and history because I know they belong to Asia and I never tried to lean anything.
 
Its Illyrian territories. Those are our ancestral lands. You sit on them. I am not saying we will recover them, it will be a nonsense to claim that. But God gave those lands to us and we were not able to keep what god gave to us.
Slavic lands lie from today's Ukraine up to Mongolia.

:facepalm:


You better open a fantasy thread. You don't show minimum knowledge of things you are trying to discuss. The Dacian tale you are trying to sell here is discredited. Dacian vocabulary of Latin is two century after Christ, Albanian vocabulary is 1 century before Christ. Had Albanians been from the same are like Dacians should the vocabulary of Latin been of the same period?
I know you don't know those things because you are on a different mission, but you discredit yourself with the utterly lack of knowledge than you are building your cause.
I never have tried to discuss Slavic ancestry and history because I know they belong to Asia and I never tried to lean anything.

OK, just one question then. If it turns out by a chance that Albanians are not really native Europeans (and even you must admit there is at least 0.001% chance for it) will you be willing to lead them back to their promised land?
 
:facepalm:




OK, just one question then. If it turns out by a chance that Albanians are not really native Europeans (and even you must admit there is at least 0.001% chance for it) will you be willing to lead them back to their promised land?

I am not saying that Albanians are native Europeans. The Dna composition shows that Albanian population is formed by merger of many migratory populations. Native Europeans are Neanderthals and probably I1 haplogroup.
So it means every existing European population is a mixture of different migratory populations in different times.
What we Albanians claim is that we have a documented presence in this territories since 2000 yrs before Christ, when Herodotus mentioned our presence in his book "Iliad", that north of Greece there were Illyrians living.
The presence of Illyrians were Documented until 7 century ad.
Then Illyrians disappeared and Albanians came to being.
This is historically true that with Slavic migration to the Balkans the majority of Illyrian provinces did not exist.
 
What we Albanians claim is that we have a documented presence in this territories since 2000 yrs before Christ.

I may believe that you have, but the rest of us haven't seen it yet.
You understand that if it was true, there would not be this thread?
 
I am not saying that Albanians are native Europeans. The Dna composition shows that Albanian population is formed by merger of many migratory populations. Native Europeans are Neanderthals and probably I1 haplogroup.
So it means every existing European population is a mixture of different migratory populations in different times.
What we Albanians claim is that we have a documented presence in this territories since 2000 yrs before Christ, when Herodotus mentioned our presence in his book "Iliad", that north of Greece there were Illyrians living.
The presence of Illyrians were Documented until 7 century ad.
Then Illyrians disappeared and Albanians came to being.
This is historically true that with Slavic migration to the Balkans the majority of Illyrian provinces did not exist.

There are no evidence of what you are talking.

And according available data there is no evidence that Albanians are descendants of Illyrians, and Albanians and Albanian language mentioned much much after Christ.

Sorry but hypothesis and constructions are for pastime but facts are those that decide.

First written document in Albanian is from 1462. It is fact and reality:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_e_pagëzimit

According it, Albanian language is very young and Albanians are very young nation.

You can see which languages are written before Albanian:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_first_written_accounts
 
There are no evidence of what you are talking.

And according available data there is no evidence that Albanians are descendants of Illyrians, and Albanians and Albanian language mentioned much much after Christ.

Sorry but hypothesis and constructions are for pastime but facts are those that decide.

First written document in Albanian is from 1462. It is fact and reality:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_e_pagëzimit

According it, Albanian language is very young and Albanians are very young nation.

You can see which languages are written before Albanian:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_first_written_accounts
So much uninformed! Nobody believes that Albanian language is very young! The belief is that Albanian language is the third oldest in Europe.

LB.jpg
 
[h=2]26 August 2014[/h][h=3]Family Tree of Languages, Albanian one of the oldest -New York Times[/h]

Albanian Language is among 3 oldest languages! What a great discovery! Albania is ancient, and we are proud of that. Thank New York Times for publishing the findings!
[h=2]By NICHOLAS WADE[/h]
Biologists using tools developed for drawing evolutionary family trees say that they have solved a longstanding problem in archaeology: the origin of the Indo-European family of languages.










[h=6][/h]The family includes English and most other European languages, as well as Persian, Hindi and many others. Despite the importance of the languages, specialists have long disagreed about their origin.
Linguists believe that the first speakers of the mother tongue, known as proto-Indo-European, were chariot-driving pastoralists who burst out of their homeland on the steppes above the Black Sea about 4,000 years ago and conquered Europe and Asia. A rival theory holds that, to the contrary, the first Indo-European speakers were peaceable farmers in Anatolia, now Turkey, about 9,000 years ago, who disseminated their language by the hoe, not the sword.
The new entrant to the debate is an evolutionary biologist, Quentin Atkinson of the University of Auckland in New Zealand. He and colleagues have taken the existing vocabulary and geographical range of 103 Indo-European languages and computationally walked them back in time and place to their statistically most likely origin.
The result, they announced in Thursday’s issue of the journal Science, is that “we found decisive support for an Anatolian origin over a steppe origin.” Both the timing and the root of the tree of Indo-European languages “fit with an agricultural expansion from Anatolia beginning 8,000 to 9,500 years ago,” they report.
But despite its advanced statistical methods, their study may not convince everyone.
The researchers started with a menu of vocabulary items that are known to be resistant to linguistic change, like pronouns, parts of the body and family relations, and compared them with the inferred ancestral word in proto-Indo-European. Words that have a clear line of descent from the same ancestral word are known as cognates. Thus “mother,” “mutter” (German), “mat’ ” (Russian), “madar” (Persian), “matka” (Polish) and “mater” (Latin) are all cognates derived from the proto-Indo-European word “mehter.”
Dr. Atkinson and his colleagues then scored each set of words on the vocabulary menu for the 103 languages. In languages where the word was a cognate, the researchers assigned it a score of 1; in those where the cognate had been replaced with an unrelated word, it was scored 0. Each language could thus be represented by a string of 1’s and 0’s, and the researchers could compute the most likely family tree showing the relationships among the 103 languages.
A computer was then supplied with known dates of language splits. Romanian and other Romance languages, for instance, started to diverge from Latin after A.D. 270, when Roman troops pulled back from the Roman province of Dacia. Applying those dates to a few branches in its tree, the computer was able to estimate dates for all the rest.
The computer was also given geographical information about the present range of each language and told to work out the likeliest pathways of distribution from an origin, given the probable family tree of descent. The calculation pointed to Anatolia, particularly a lozenge-shaped area in what is now southern Turkey, as the most plausible origin — a region that had also been proposed as the origin of Indo-European by the archaeologist Colin Renfrew, in 1987, because it was the source from which agriculture spread to Europe.
Dr. Atkinson’s work has integrated a large amount of information with a computational method that has proved successful in evolutionary studies. But his results may not sway supporters of the rival theory, who believe the Indo-European languages were spread some 5,000 years later by warlike pastoralists who conquered Europe and India from the Black Sea steppe.
A key piece of their evidence is that proto-Indo-European had a vocabulary for chariots and wagons that included words for “wheel,” “axle,” “harness-pole” and “to go or convey in a vehicle.” These words have numerous descendants in the Indo-European daughter languages. So Indo-European itself cannot have fragmented into those daughter languages, historical linguists argue, before the invention of chariots and wagons, the earliest known examples of which date to 3500 B.C. This would rule out any connection between Indo-European and the spread of agriculture from Anatolia, which occurred much earlier.
“I see the wheeled-vehicle evidence as a trump card over any evolutionary tree,” said David Anthony, an archaeologist at Hartwick College who studies Indo-European origins.






 
Dienekes is a Greek centrist propagandist. He claims that Arvanites are Greeks by heritage not citizenship. Greek y Dna is mostly J2a as it is Turkeys. Albanians on the other hand score up to 15% J2b and less than 3% J2a.
So had Albanian J2 been Greek would have been J2a. Up to 3% of Greek J2 is J2b, same like Albanians but if you keep in mind that 25% of Greek population is Arvanites ( Albanian) it does quite make sense Dienekes propaganda of J2 in Albania is Greek.
Foe Dienekes center of earth is in Delphi Greece. So if you accept the B.S Dienekes is trying to spread is an individual matter but no real science is involved in it.

It is hard word (offense) that this man is propagandist.

Is not there some milder words, if you suspect something, and you should provide evidence.

Dienekes' Anthropology blog is regarded as respectable and it is very visited.

But generally I have observation for virtually all Balkans nations (more or less that I do not scaled).

There are sometimes expressed some jealousy in relation to the Greeks, it's somewhat understandable, Greeks have a complete written records of several thousand years, but other do not have.
 


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[h=6]Published: August 23, 2012[/h][h=1]Tracing the Origins of Indo-European Languages[/h]
A new study suggests that the sprawling Indo-European family of languages originated in Anatolia, or modern-day Turkey. Related Article »

0824-sci-ORIGINS.png
Anatolian
Tocharian
Armenian
Greek
Albanian
Balto-Slavic
Italic
Germanic
Insular
Celtic

RUSSIA
FRANCE
Black Sea
UKRAINE
CHINA
ANATOLIA
EGYPT
INDIA
IRAN
Indo-Iranian
Researchers studied the evolution of words across 103 modern and extinct languages from the Indo-European language family, and created a tree showing the relationships among the different languages, at right.

The map above shows where each major branch probably arose, before spreading and diversifying to other regions.

A competing hypothesis places the point of origin in the steppes of modern-day Ukraine and Russia, north of the Black Sea.

Slovenian

Armenian

Tadzik

Lithuanian

Friulian

Lusatian

Waziri

Old Church Slavonic

Scots Gaelic

Persian

Macedonian

Breton

Italian

Afghan

Belarusian

Icelandic

Provençal

Bihari

Oscan

Greek

Swedish

Danish

Luxembourgish

Old Irish

Ossetic

Kashmiri

Polish

Old English

Welsh

Latin

Flemish

Riksmal

Old Norse

Hittite

Classical Armenian

Slovak

Romansh

Urdu

Marwari

Romanian

Avestan

Ukrainian

Bengali

Czech

Spanish

German

Dutch

Kurdish

Vlach

Nepali

Gujarati

Ancient Greek

Albanian

Lahnda

Russian

Hindi

French

Irish

Cornish

Umbrian

Bulgarian

Luvian

Lycian

Oriya

Catalan

Vedic Sanskrit

Old Prussian

Marathi

Old High German

Romani

Faroese

Sindhi

Latvian

Serbo-Croatian

Ladin

Assamese

Gothic

Indo-
Iranian

Insular
Celtic


Italic

Germanic

Balto-Slavic

Albanian

Greek

Armenian

Anatolian

Tocharian

Tocharian

Singhalese

Wakhi

Frisian

Old Persian

Sardinian

Portuguese

Baluchi

ENGLISH

Walloon

8,000years ago
7,000
6,000
5,000
4,000
3,000
2,000
1,000
TODAY



Send Feedback






 
So much uninformed! Nobody believes that Albanian language is very young! The belief is that Albanian language is the third oldest in Europe.

You do not read carefully, I'm talking about written documents.

And, why older Albanian written documents are missing?

It is very strange, you can see that many other languages, for which no one suggests that they are particularly old, they have much older written documents than Albanian.
 
There are no evidence of what you are talking.

And according available data there is no evidence that Albanians are descendants of Illyrians, and Albanians and Albanian language mentioned much much after Christ.

Sorry but hypothesis and constructions are for pastime but facts are those that decide.

First written document in Albanian is from 1462. It is fact and reality:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_e_pagëzimit

According it, Albanian language is very young and Albanians are very young nation.

You can see which languages are written before Albanian:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_first_written_accounts
I am copy and paste the NY Times article but its not coming out as it it is the original. I am trying one more time:
[h=6]Published: August 23, 2012[/h][h=1]Tracing the Origins of Indo-European Languages[/h]
A new study suggests that the sprawling Indo-European family of languages originated in Anatolia, or modern-day Turkey. Related Article »

0824-sci-ORIGINS.png
Anatolian
Tocharian
Armenian
Greek
Albanian
Balto-Slavic
Italic
Germanic
Insular
Celtic

RUSSIA
FRANCE
Black Sea
UKRAINE
CHINA
ANATOLIA
EGYPT
INDIA
IRAN
Indo-Iranian
Researchers studied the evolution of words across 103 modern and extinct languages from the Indo-European language family, and created a tree showing the relationships among the different languages, at right.

The map above shows where each major branch probably arose, before spreading and diversifying to other regions.

A competing hypothesis places the point of origin in the steppes of modern-day Ukraine and Russia, north of the Black Sea.

Slovenian

Armenian

Tadzik

Lithuanian

Friulian

Lusatian

Waziri

Old Church Slavonic

Scots Gaelic

Persian

Macedonian

Breton

Italian

Afghan

Belarusian

Icelandic

Provençal

Bihari

Oscan

Greek

Swedish

Danish

Luxembourgish

Old Irish

Ossetic

Kashmiri

Polish

Old English

Welsh

Latin

Flemish

Riksmal

Old Norse

Hittite

Classical Armenian

Slovak

Romansh

Urdu

Marwari

Romanian

Avestan

Ukrainian

Bengali

Czech

Spanish

German

Dutch

Kurdish

Vlach

Nepali

Gujarati

Ancient Greek

Albanian

Lahnda

Russian

Hindi

French

Irish

Cornish

Umbrian

Bulgarian

Luvian

Lycian

Oriya

Catalan

Vedic Sanskrit

Old Prussian

Marathi

Old High German

Romani

Faroese

Sindhi

Latvian

Serbo-Croatian

Ladin

Assamese

Gothic

Indo-
Iranian

Insular
Celtic


Italic

Germanic

Balto-Slavic

Albanian

Greek

Armenian

Anatolian

Tocharian

Tocharian

Singhalese

Wakhi

Frisian

Old Persian

Sardinian

Portuguese

Baluchi

ENGLISH

Walloon

8,000years ago
7,000
6,000
5,000
4,000
3,000
2,000
1,000
TODAY



Send Feedback
Source: Science



 
You do not read carefully, I'm talking about written documents.

And, why older Albanian written documents are missing?

It is very strange, you can see that many other languages, for which no one suggests that they are particularly old, they have much older written documents than Albanian.
Did you not just said Albanian language is very young?
I am bringing proof that its the opposite, its very old.
Nobody said that Albanians wrote their language.
Under Ottomans Albanians were forbidden write their language and have schools in our language.
There are over 100 priests or muslims hoxha's killed because they kept trying to introduce Albanian language script and schools.
 
It is hard word (offense) that this man is propagandist.

Is not there some milder words, if you suspect something, and you should provide evidence.

Dienekes' Anthropology blog is regarded as respectable and it is very visited.

But generally I have observation for virtually all Balkans nations (more or less that I do not scaled).

There are sometimes expressed some jealousy in relation to the Greeks, it's somewhat understandable, Greeks have a complete written records of several thousand years, but other do not have.
Look what he writes in the coment section of his famous blog:
Dienekes said...>> only Dienekes and some other ultra-nationalists can claim that who is living today in an area was always there. Take Athens for example, by 1800's it was a small Albanian village.

First of all it is inaccurate that Athens was an "Albanian" village.

http://kleftouria.blogspot.com/2008/04/1821-2.html

There were certain Arvanites in ATTICA in the 1800s, but they were a minority and they were certainly not "Albanians".
Arvanites were not Albanians for certain?
And you don't believe me he is a propagandist?
There is no jealousy from us against Greeks. Its only a contribution to tell the historical truth as it was, not as Greeks wished it to be.
Nobody is denying the glory of Greek antiquity but as much as it belongs to Greeks.
Have you taken any art history lessons?
The oldest Greek sculpture is Egyptian sculpture of a man standing with a leg foreword the other backward. The sculpture is on the Metropolitan Museum of Art in NYC. It clearly shows Egyptian influence in Greek art, Have you heard any Greek mentioning that?
 
Did you not just said Albanian language is very young?
I am bringing proof that its the opposite, its very old.
Nobody said that Albanians wrote their language.
Under Ottomans Albanians were forbidden write their language and have schools in our language.
There are over 100 priests or muslims hoxha's killed because they kept trying to introduce Albanian language script and schools.

You can read carefully, I wrote about list written documents:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_first_written_accounts

Before 1000 BC

Further information: Bronze Age writing

Seal impression from the tomb of Seth-Peribsen, containing the oldest known complete sentence in Egyptian



Writing first appeared in the Near East at the beginning of the 3rd millennium BC. A very limited number of languages are attested in the area from before the Bronze Age collapse and the rise of alphabetic writing:


In East Asia towards the end of the second millennium BC, the Sino-Tibetan family was represented by Old Chinese. There are also a number of undeciphered Bronze Age records:



c. 2690 BC Egyptian Egyptian hieroglyphs in the tomb of Seth-Peribsen (2nd Dynasty),
Umm el-Qa'ab[4] "proto-hieroglyphic" inscriptions from about 3300 BC (Naqada III; see Abydos, Egypt, Narmer Palette)

c. 2600–2500 BC Sumerian Cuneiform texts from Shuruppak and Abu Salabikh (Fara period)[5][6] "proto-literate" period from about 3500 BC (see Kish tablet); administrative records at Uruk and Ur from c. 2900 BC.

c. 2400 BC Akkadian A few dozen pre-Sargonic texts from Mari and other sites in northern Babylonia[7] Some proper names attested in Sumerian texts at Tell Harmal from about 2800 BC.[8] Fragments of the Legend of Etana at Tell Harmal c. 2600 BC.[9]

c. 2400 BC Eblaite Ebla tablets

c. 2300 BC[10] Elamite Awan dynasty peace treaty with Naram-Sin
21st century BC Hurrian Temple inscription of Tish-atal in Urkesh[11]

c. 1650 BC Hittite Various cuneiform texts and Palace Chronicles written during the reign of Hattusili I, from the archives at Hattusa see Hittite cuneiform, Hittite texts

c. 1450 BC Greek Linear B tablet archive from Knossos[12][13][14]

c. 1400 BC Luwian Hieroglyphic Luwian monumental inscriptions, Cuneiform Luwian tablets in the Hattusa archives[15] Isolated hieroglyphs appear on seals from the 18th century BC.[15]

c. 1400 BC Hattic Hittite texts CTH 725–745

c. 1300 BC Ugaritic Tablets from Ugarit[16] see Ugaritic alphabet

c. 1200 BC Old Chinese
First millennium BC

The earliest known alphabetic inscriptions, at Serabit el-Khadim (c. 1500 BC), appear to record a Northwest Semitic language, though only one or two words have been deciphered. In the Early Iron Age, alphabetic writing spread across the Near East and southern Europe. With the emergence of the Brahmic family of scripts, languages of India are attested from after about 300 BC. The earliest examples of the Central American Isthmian script date from c. 500 BC, but a proposed decipherment remains controversial.[20]

The Ahiram epitaph is the earliest substantial inscription in Phoenician.




First millennium AD

From Late Antiquity, we have for the first time languages with earliest records in manuscript tradition (as opposed to epigraphy). Thus, Old Armenian is first attested in the Armenian Bible translation.


1000–1500 AD

This list is incomplete; you can help by expanding it.



According to written documents Albanian is young, as a written language.

...
You can see, Greek is written 1450 BC, and Greeks can say a lot in last 3.500 years according to this fact.
 
I am copy and paste the NY Times article but its not coming out as it it is the original. I am trying one more time:
Published: August 23, 2012

Tracing the Origins of Indo-European Languages


A new study suggests that the sprawling Indo-European family of languages originated in Anatolia, or modern-day Turkey. Related Article »

0824-sci-ORIGINS.png
Anatolian
Tocharian
Armenian
Greek
Albanian
Balto-Slavic
Italic
Germanic
Insular
Celtic

RUSSIA
FRANCE
Black Sea
UKRAINE
CHINA
ANATOLIA
EGYPT
INDIA
IRAN
Indo-Iranian
Researchers studied the evolution of words across 103 modern and extinct languages from the Indo-European language family, and created a tree showing the relationships among the different languages, at right.

The map above shows where each major branch probably arose, before spreading and diversifying to other regions.

A competing hypothesis places the point of origin in the steppes of modern-day Ukraine and Russia, north of the Black Sea.

Slovenian

Armenian

Tadzik

Lithuanian

Friulian

Lusatian

Waziri

Old Church Slavonic

Scots Gaelic

Persian

Macedonian

Breton

Italian

Afghan

Belarusian

Icelandic

Provençal

Bihari

Oscan

Greek

Swedish

Danish

Luxembourgish

Old Irish

Ossetic

Kashmiri

Polish

Old English

Welsh

Latin

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Source: Science




If this map is correct.........then it clearly shows that albanian is not illyrian
 
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