steppe theory and western europe

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its all fine
You have the right for your opinion
But small question:
How the hell does the israeli-palestinian conflict
and the jews are related to the topic of this thread and the steppe ?

somebody started to accuse somebody else of being anti-Semitic

this whole thread is derailing again

some have very large toes in here
 
Well, Jew expelling from Spain in 1492 was only a continuity in politics of many western european kingdoms. France expelled their jews in XIV century, England and Wales in XIII century, German and Austrian territories along XIV and XV centuries, Portugal in 1497, Italy along XVI century... all our kingdoms wanted one and only religion inside their frontiers. Jews found refuge only in the Netherlands, Otoman Empire and Magreb. Jews expellings in territories of France and Germany took place as soon as XII century. All these territories were much more hard with pagans like Jews and Muslims than the Iberian ones (some people is mistaken nowadays because of the spanish black legend invented by dutchs).
I don?t know if people from outside Iberia know about one of the key battles in Europe during Middle Age: Navas de Tolosa Battle, where at last, only the charge of the christian cavalry with three iberian kings in the head (Pedro II of Aragon, Alfonso VIII of Castile and Sancho VII of Navarra) could stop and win the battle in front of the yihadist Almohade Army from Africa. Well, the christian army firstly was composed by crusaders came from other parts of Europe (France, Germany, England, etc...). When the christian army, before the battle, took a village, these 1.500 crusaders mainly from France were extremely cruel with muslim and jew inhabitants... this was not acceptable for Iberians, so these three iberian kings expelled those animals back to France.
Western Kingdoms like France or England in XII-XIII-XIV-XV centuries were not able to understand other people practising a religion different than the Christian one, that?s because of the behavior of these animals in Spain with Muslim inhabitans, but this was not the case of Iberian Kingdoms, where other religions were tolerated. Muslims, jews and christians in Spain were not friends, but they were able to tolerate ones each others sometimes. That was not the case of other western kingdoms.
Gaska said about Holy Inquisition who burned blablabla... but the truth is these kind of tribunals were common in the whole western Europe at those times and most of them were much more cruel than the Iberian ones. These are facts, not ******* black legend and so on. Germany, France and England burned much and much more witches and heretics than muslims, jews, witches and heretics burned Iberian Kingdoms.
 
Well, I see my post is not about steppe theory and western europe, so I apologize.
 
This last question is a bit provocative because all Europe has problems of nationalism-Scotland, Northern Ireland, Corsica, Northern Italy, Flanders, the Balkans (Macedonia, Bosnia, Serbia, Kosovo, Montenegro), Crimea etc etc. As for the Basque Country, we have unfortunately suffered from ultra-nationalist terrorism for 40 years. Thank God it all ended more than ten years ago but I have lost friends and relatives killed by other Basques who did not think like me. I hope that violence will never come back because it makes no sense, particularly I feel very proud to be Basque and of course Spanish. Spain is a democratic country with a Constitution that must be respected, and a Spanish government will never accept unilateral decisions from any region. What we want to be will be decided by all of us.The key is to inform people well of the consequences and ignore the populist politicians who only seek to destabilize the system.
 
Well, about being anti-semitic in this post... I believe... Spaniards have not been racist people in the past nor in the present, you just have to see the appearance of our people in America, absolutely mixed with africans and amerindians since 1492, while in North America amerindians still live in zoos and africans: "Black Lives Matters". So... in Spain we call "black" to an african and there is nothing wrong with that word, as there is nothing wrong with the word "white" when someone is referring to european appearance. Gaska gave his opinion, but with no "postmodernian" filters, as we usually do in Spain. We were extremely surprised when recently an uruguayan footballer who plays in England was punished for calling a friend of him "negro" (black) in Twitter... it?s incredible...
 
We Spaniards have been psychoanalyzing ourselves for hundreds of years, trying to understand our behavior towards other countries, peoples, religions, ethnicities, etc. It is true that the black legend has tried to obscure our behavior while trying to hide that of other European countries, but that does not mean that we should forget our responsibility in many truly unjust acts.

The first thing to understand is that we cannot judge the past with our current values because otherwise the whole history of most European countries would be garbage (and not only European countries, also Asian, African and Americans countries were not charity nuns either). Nowadays we are tolerant and democratic because we have understood that it is the fairest system to live freely and with dignity.

The second thing to try to do is to use the terms correctly - only mental idiots like Hitler (or Sabino Arana, who for those who don't know was the founder of Basque nationalism) can think that a person is superior to another because of the color of his skin, his craniometry or his hematotypology, in this sense I don't think anyone of those who participate in this forum nor the overwhelming majority of Europeans are racists, we are already vaccinated against such silly thoughts.

However I think we are all to some extent xenophobic, i.e. we feel distrust or fear towards foreigners, i.e. towards those who are different from us. We worry about losing our welfare, customs, culture, religion, or our political systems because of people who do not fit well in our societies. I think we simply try to defend (rightly or wrongly) what we understand to be ours in this case our country, our civilization or our continent.


 
.......
Do you want to know how far the stupidity of the politically correct goes? - In Spain, if there are flags or banners of villages or regions with heads of Moors cut off in memory of old warrior feats, they are removed because it can damage the sensitivity of Muslims. Or we change the names of villages with centuries of years of history for being anti-Semitic-For example, Castrillo Matajudios (Matajudios means Kill-Jews), or there are people who renounce their last name as Matamoros (Kill-Moors) for being offensive. Of course anyone who dares to criticize these nonsense is immediately considered a dangerous anti-Semitic or anti-Muslim racist. Doesn't it seem ridiculous to you?

What about the feelings of Christians in Spain that are being clattered, and hurt on regular basis by the anti-Christian radical leftists? It‘s crazy that even once ultra-Catholic Spain has totally shifted to radical leftism and has embraced the liberal madness and PC terror from the USA.

The out-of-control leftists everywhere use black people, Muslims, other minorities, or once oppressed groups as human shields in order to attack and erase the Christian and cultural heritage of Europe without facing much resistance. Next to “whiteness“ as they say Christianity is the symbol of oppression and colonialism. It‘s all left-wing bully and shaming tactics disguised as tolerance and inclusion. These woke leftists who play the savior and avengers of minorities or so-called people of color are not about the oppressed or marginalized people, but about power, control, and winning the cultural war no matter what. Besides, Antifa beheads and pulls down statues of Christ and the saints, and historical figures, including those who fought against slavery just because they‘re white. In Italy, a Catholic Church, Santa’Agata al Collegio in the Sicilian town of Caltanissetta was desecrated. The Eucharist was thrown on the floor. Relics and images were desecrated. The burning, and vandalism of Churches are taking place regularly all over Europe. Many historical old Churches in France are being burned down to the ground without being restored. So, it‘s no coincidence that two iconic Cathedrals, Notre Dame and the Cathedral in Nantes were burned down. In hyper secular France, praying Christians were beheaded inside the Church, and the media and politicians were pretty tame and didn't really condemn the Islamic terrorists with strong language. These PC double standards where it's not that bad when Christians get their feelings hurt, harassed, and bullied and their Churches destroyed while voicing criticism about radical Muslims is racist or islamophobe, is unbearable. In Germany, some towns have renamed the traditional Christmas markets, instead of Happy Christmas/Eastern, the PC crowd introduced Happy holidays. Many traditional rituals, celebrations, and costumes are being phased out. For example, celebrating X-mas and X-mas trees are banned in some schools in order not to insult Muslims, even though many Muslims don't mind or care. In some Kindergartens, elementary schools they've replaced Mary, Baby Jesus, and Joseph in the Nativity play with fruits. So, the children dress up as fruits instead of Mary, Baby Jesus, and Joseph for not discriminating against Muslim children. Since the Nativity play is a demonstration of culture more than faith, in order to prevent one form of discrimination, another was created. The thing is that leftists decided that Muslims have to feel offended by the Nativity play in spite of the fact that many Muslims rather liked this scence. This is liberal madness with a method. It's time to stand up against the woke mob.


 
We Spaniards have been psychoanalyzing ourselves for hundreds of years, trying to understand our behavior towards other countries, peoples, religions, ethnicities, etc. It is true that the black legend has tried to obscure our behavior while trying to hide that of other European countries, but that does not mean that we should forget our responsibility in many truly unjust acts.

The first thing to understand is that we cannot judge the past with our current values because otherwise the whole history of most European countries would be garbage (and not only European countries, also Asian, African and Americans countries were not charity nuns either). Nowadays we are tolerant and democratic because we have understood that it is the fairest system to live freely and with dignity.

The second thing to try to do is to use the terms correctly - only mental idiots like Hitler (or Sabino Arana, who for those who don't know was the founder of Basque nationalism) can think that a person is superior to another because of the color of his skin, his craniometry or his hematotypology, in this sense I don't think anyone of those who participate in this forum nor the overwhelming majority of Europeans are racists, we are already vaccinated against such silly thoughts.

However I think we are all to some extent xenophobic, i.e. we feel distrust or fear towards foreigners, i.e. towards those who are different from us. We worry about losing our welfare, customs, culture, religion, or our political systems because of people who do not fit well in our societies. I think we simply try to defend (rightly or wrongly) what we understand to be ours in this case our country, our civilization or our continent.


In Germany, we have a strong culture of remembrance about the Holocaust, WWII, Nazi Germany. Actually is good when a nation and its people don't sugarcoat, justify or defend the wrongs and ills from the past, and take responsibility in order not to repeat the errors of the past. The point is that many liberal-progressives are abusing this good cause for pushing their woke agenda. They denounce and shame and name their ancestors to feel morally superior. Thus this pointing the finger at the vile and wretched white people from the past is only about to make oneself look good. What I find also absurd is the fact, that even ancient Germans that have nothing to do with WWII are being vilified. Hence, no German is allowed to identify or reconnect with them without facing being called a Nazi. Germans can basically only talk about Germanic tribes when they distanced themselves and show contempt. That's why we have lots of recreation groups about the Romans, and typically looking Germans play Romans and not their Germanic Barbarian ancestors. In fact, Germans today are culturally defeated people. Besides, Scandinavians who never had colonies nor oppressed non-Whites (but rather terrorized other Europeans/whites in Vikings' times) are told to feel bad for white privilege, white supremacy, and colonialism. During these BLM demonstrations, for instance, we could see how white folks with their heads down theatrically went on their knees in front of random black folks, BLM activists to apologize for being white. Nothing but a silly circus. We need less sloppy sentimentality and more balance, rationality, sobriety, and honesty since people are going from one extreme to the other.

 
its all fine
You have the right for your opinion
But small question:
How the hell does the israeli-palestinian conflict
and the jews are related to the topic of this thread and the steppe ?


I agree. We got carried away here. It would be great if the Mods could split this discussion and move the debate about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict or the role of Moors in Spain to another thread.
 
Well, about being anti-semitic in this post... I believe... Spaniards have not been racist people in the past nor in the present, you just have to see the appearance of our people in America, absolutely mixed with africans and amerindians since 1492, while in North America amerindians still live in zoos and africans: "Black Lives Matters". So... in Spain we call "black" to an african and there is nothing wrong with that word, as there is nothing wrong with the word "white" when someone is referring to european appearance. Gaska gave his opinion, but with no "postmodernian" filters, as we usually do in Spain. We were extremely surprised when recently an uruguayan footballer who plays in England was punished for calling a friend of him "negro" (black) in Twitter... it�s incredible...

white isn't really "european appearance". it's still mostly split in either "northern european like appearance" or non-black, non-asian appearance for a lot of people at least in europe. for example my parents think that white people means everyone who isn't black or asian. that is the case with many older people.
 
he was criticising Trump and Israel, not the Jews
it's obvious you can't see the difference

Oh no, I can, perfectly fine, thank you. It's obvious you are being dishonest about your personal sentiment. The claim that Jewish-Americans run American foreign policy is indeed slanderous. If anything, Jewish-Americans are typically liberal and not nearly as passionate about Israel as Evangelical Christians. This entire argument is shameful, and a disgrace. Gaska has just admitted he blames Jewish-Americans for the conflict in the Middle East, because he believes they run US foreign policy, as a group. For him, everything goes back to the Jews, including Spain's modern problems. I'm done with this subject, because it is disgraceful.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XULTHbK5z8&t=113s

@Real expert-

Don't worry, they won't be able to beat us because we have deep-rooted millenary traditions.

I actually like that you’re so straightforward. It means you’re honest and not likely to hide your opinions and feelings. That said, people are very sensitive these days, thus feel easily offended by others who are direct and don’t use a diplomatic language. Hence, for this kind of individuals discussing with you is rather unpleasant and your attitude quite upsetting. Anyway, we need to open a separate thread for talking about this kind of stuff.
 
Oh no, I can, perfectly fine, thank you. It's obvious you are being dishonest about your personal sentiment. The claim that Jewish-Americans run American foreign policy is indeed slanderous. If anything, Jewish-Americans are typically liberal and not nearly as passionate about Israel as Evangelical Christians. This entire argument is shameful, and a disgrace. Gaska has just admitted he blames Jewish-Americans for the conflict in the Middle East, because he believes they run US foreign policy, as a group. For him, everything goes back to the Jews, including Spain's modern problems. I'm done with this subject, because it is disgraceful.

I see, you're very swift in making your conclusions, but they don't make sense.
You're twisting other peoples words and your own.
I have no intention to discuss any further with you.
 
@ American


Unfortunately, certain Jewish individuals like Soros who are powerful and politically very involved give other Jewish people who don’t share their views and neither support them, a bad name.
 
@ American


Unfortunately, certain Jewish individuals like Soros who are powerful and politically very involved give other Jewish people who don’t share their views and neither support them, a bad name.

Agreed. But rational, intelligent people should refrain from blaming an entire group. Soros and his woke army actually hate Israel, along with Poland, Hungary, America, and countless other nations, so this should be enough to dispel any notion that all Jews are acting in unison. For some of the mental children on here, unfortunately, it does not.

As an American, without regard to my personal ethnicity, I would react defensively if people on here blames African-Americans as a whole for the BLM pogroms.
 
In Germany, we have a strong culture of remembrance about the Holocaust, WWII, Nazi Germany. Actually is good when a nation and its people don't sugarcoat, justify or defend the wrongs and ills from the past, and take responsibility in order not to repeat the errors of the past. The point is that many liberal-progressives are abusing this good cause for pushing their woke agenda. They denounce and shame and name their ancestors to feel morally superior. Thus this pointing the finger at the vile and wretched white people from the past is only about to make oneself look good. What I find also absurd is the fact, that even ancient Germans that have nothing to do with WWII are being vilified. Hence, no German is allowed to identify or reconnect with them without facing being called a Nazi. Germans can basically only talk about Germanic tribes when they distanced themselves and show contempt. That's why we have lots of recreation groups about the Romans, and typically looking Germans play Romans and not their Germanic Barbarian ancestors. In fact, Germans today are culturally defeated people. Besides, Scandinavians who never had colonies nor oppressed non-Whites (but rather terrorized other Europeans/whites in Vikings' times) are told to feel bad for white privilege, white supremacy, and colonialism. During these BLM demonstrations, for instance, we could see how white folks with their heads down theatrically went on their knees in front of random black folks, BLM activists to apologize for being white. Nothing but a silly circus. We need less sloppy sentimentality and more balance, rationality, sobriety, and honesty since people are going from one extreme to the other.


Wokeness is indeed a mental disorder, and hopefully, once this globalist nightmare is voted out, will be treated as such.

It amuses me to no end that the only “Indigenous people” (note the capital I, because all Indigenous people share a common struggle against the white cisheteropatriarchy, apparently) in Europe are the Sámi. No one else is entitled to a cultural identity they can be proud of on their own land. Not the Basques, the Bretons, the Carpatho-Rusyns, the Sardinians, etc etc. They are all “white settler-colonialists, according to the woke ****.
 
Wokeness is indeed a mental disorder, and hopefully, once this globalist nightmare is voted out, will be treated as such.

It amuses me to no end that the only “Indigenous people” (note the capital I, because all Indigenous people share a common struggle against the white cisheteropatriarchy, apparently) in Europe are the Sámi. No one else is entitled to a cultural identity they can be proud of on their own land. Not the Basques, the Bretons, the Carpatho-Rusyns, the Sardinians, etc etc. They are all “white settler-colonialists, according to the woke ****.

I agree with you, 100% here. Wokeness is utter, total craziness displayed by people with no real values nor virtues.
 
Agreed. But rational, intelligent people should refrain from blaming an entire group. Soros and his woke army actually hate Israel, along with Poland, Hungary, America, and countless other nations, so this should be enough to dispel any notion that all Jews are acting in unison. For some of the mental children on here, unfortunately, it does not.

As an American, without regard to my personal ethnicity, I would react defensively if people on here blames African-Americans as a whole for the BLM pogroms.


I understand what you’re saying. Certainly, you can’t blame all Jews for the wicked actions of certain Jewish individuals or activists. However, not few people believe in guilt by association, though.
 
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