The rise of PIEs in the steppes --- From the Ural or from the from the Caucasus?

[Yetos]

It isn't necessarily a Slavic marker. The areas that seem like the best candidates of the Slavic homeland, are mostly R1a and have low amounts of I2a. The areas with the highest amounts of I2a in the West Balkans are the mountainous parts (such as Herzegovina). The flat parts of Croatia for example have a higher frequency of R1a (which isn't exclusive a Slavic marker, but it tends to be the most common in Slavic populations), than the mountainous parts. Flat areas are better for farming, so ofcourse new conquerors (in this case Slavs) would mostly settle there, therefore the native population best survived in the mountains. And the typical phenotype of a person in high altitude parts of ex-Yugoslavia is Dinaric/Borreby. Long face, back of the head seems "cut-off", long legs, hairiness is common, extreme tallness, etc. And I know this from personal experience. In the flat areas of ex-Yugoslavia, people have the typical Slavic look, rounder faces, lighter eyes and hair, average height, etc.

How can I2a be Slavic when:
1) 70% of men in Herzegovina have it, and it is one of the most isolated parts of the Balkans
2) Russians, Poles, and other typical Slavs have it at a MUCH lower frequency (under 20%)
3) the obvious areas where Slavs would have settled in the Balkans have the typical high R1a frequency and low I2a frequency
4) The South Slav phenotype is completely different from the West and East Slav phenotype

R1a in Balkans except Croatia is very low rest except Greece.

so how come Ra is Slavic marker when Serbia bosnia bulgaria have lower than Greece?
so Slav people enter south of danube creating 5 countries and many linguistic groups to become Greek speakers at the end?
same with Goths,

generally R1a is not a Slavic marker. some sub- maybe,

on the other hand I2a2 Din today I2a1b seems to enter from above Danube and in time simmilar to Slav expansion south of Danube,
so I2a1b seems more as Slavic marker than R1a,

besides the case has been discussed in a special thread about that HG.

I mean leaving outside Hrvati how come Greece has bigger R1a than Serbia Bosnia Bulgaria Romania (Severi passage)?
on the other hand the big consentration of I in Serbo-Bosnia and in fyrom feats more with pre-Dusan and after Dusan kingdoms.

I think that R1a in balkans is at least 5500 years old, or Balkans is the motherland of R1a due to the plural of varities, yet macciamo belives is a sink phenomena.

 

[Templar]

R1a in Balkans except Croatia is very low rest except Greece.

so how come Ra is Slavic marker when Serbia bosnia bulgaria have lower than Greece?
so Slav people enter south of danube creating 5 countries and many linguistic groups to become Greek speakers at the end?
same with Goths,

generally R1a is not a Slavic marker. some sub- maybe,

on the other hand I2a2 Din today I2a1b seems to enter from above Danube and in time simmilar to Slav expansion south of Danube,
so I2a1b seems more as Slavic marker than R1a,

besides the case has been discussed in a special thread about that HG.

Some "Slavs" did bring it, but they were mixed with populations in Romania before they spread elsewhere. Romania still has a fairly high frequency of haplogroup I, and it is diverse (and probably dates back to the neolithic). My point is that it has always been in the Balkans, Slavs only spread it more Southwards. Do you really believe that the original Slavs in Russia and Poland had it? That makes no sense, Paleolithic Europeans only survived in places where they could blend and get new technology from neolithic farmers. We see this in the Balkans, Sardinia, Iberia, etc. The only exception I guess would be Germanic people, but that might have been due to isolation in the far North. In Eastern Europea the steppe people would have absolutely destroyed Paleolithic Europeans, because they were still hunter-gatherers there. But in the Balkans, neolithic near eastern technology ensured that they survived and had a decent population.

 

[Knovas]

@Malsori

What Dienekes' said, is that IE was probably linked to West Asia, even if the ones who have the highest peak are non-IE speakers. And more recently, when analyzing Daniel MacArthur's genome, he observed that sometimes admixture interprets West Asian and South Asian randomly, since the tools aren't obviously perfect. And the same is surely valid for North Indian or Gedrosian components due to higher overlap. Specially low percents regarding the mentioned ones, are common in the different analysis and don't look particularly informative.

Anyways, that wasn't my point. I assumed you were refering to isolation in the proper terms, now I see what you meant.

 

[Taranis]

Frankly, I don't know where to start. How about this: I have moved the vast amount of offtopic discussions, which had preciously little to do with the original thread topic, to here. You can continue your discussions there, but please, mind your manners.