Politics Turkish genocide and the US

barbarian said:
Reinaert, it is not about excuse what I am trying to explain. It is about the double face of west. I.e. Nobody took any measurements against Serbs during the Bosnia case, but everybody try to help "Petroloid" countries. About the joining to EU: we all know that neither eu nor turkey don't care about it anymore.
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I ask you to be honest!
I know that Armenians are considered as crooks and thieves by many people from the middle east.
I heard that from colleagues I had, that worked in The Netherlands and originated from your part of the world.
For instance legends that Armenians have hidden treasures in the mountains of East Turkey.
There is a racist background behind this.

Do you agree?

Just like Wilders has a racist agenda.
He is also a bad person that harms our international reputation.
I admit that, I even hate what the man does.
But at least I admit it, and why can't you and other Turks do the same.
 
Reinaert said:
I ask you to be honest!
I know that Armenians are considered as crooks and thieves by many people from the middle east.
I heard that from colleagues I had, that worked in The Netherlands and originated from your part of the world.
For instance legends that Armenians have hidden treasures in the mountains of East Turkey.
There is a racist background behind this.

Do you agree?

Just like Wilders has a racist agenda.
He is also a bad person that harms our international reputation.
I admit that, I even hate what the man does.
But at least I admit it, and why can't you and other Turks do the same.
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i gues i can not express myself well, may be because of language problem.

1st, about excuse, i said before that i personally excuse from armenians for this shit, because i feel that such a case happened. and i believe our goverment should force to create an international work group to investigate the details and scale of this case (as i told before) and accordingly should excuse.

2nd, i try to be honest everytime. but i may say lie even to myself due to superego.

3rd, i say: even now, western countries (or countries having the power at the moment) are enough sinful for me to name them double faced.

5th: this one %100 honest-- i never heard anything about their stealing habit.
turkish people believe that armenians and romans (greeks?) are well experts especially in fishing and construction. in the past most of the people respected their handiness, but cold to them not because of racism but because they are "gavur" or christian in the house. these days, average people do not like them because of current superego.

6th, turkish people thinks that they put the goldens in the mountins or in the small rivers-- that is true. turks believe that when romans and armenians are running out from the country, they hide their golds to some secret places. even now, people are searching these golds. some greek people also come from greece and search those golds also.:smile:

7th, you hate one of your party leader. i hate my prime minister. it is not hard to admit something like this.

lastly, we have still armenians and romans in the country and some of them are very good artist. like hayko cepkin (very interesting character please watch it till end if you like brutal vocal)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQ26nqyLc0M

bass guitarist ari barokas from the band duman

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX3iA-QEim0

and sezen aksu- the diva of turkish pop (no link cause i dont like her)
 
my reply to post no:38 are not allowed yet. i dont know the reason. but, elias i advise you make a simple search about memlukes

from wiki:
"
A Mamluk (Turkish: Memlük, also called Kölemen; Arabic: مملوك (singular), مماليك mamālīk (plural), "owned"; also transliterated mamlouk, mamluq, mamluke, mameluk, mameluke, mamaluke or marmeluke) was a soldier of slave origin, often of Turkic ancestry[1]. The "mamluk phenomenon", as David Ayalon dubbed the creation of the specific warrior class,[2] was of great political importance and was extraordinarily long-lived, lasting from the 9th to the 19th century AD. Over time, mamluks became a powerful military caste in various Muslim societies. Particularly in Egypt, but also in the Levant, Iraq, and India, mamluks held political and military power. In some cases, they attained the rank of sultan, while in others they held regional power as amirs or beys. Most notably, mamluk factions seized the sultanate for themselves in Egypt and Syria in a period known as the Mamluk Sultanate (1250–1517). The Mamluk Sultanate famously beat back the Mongols at the Battle of Ain Jalut and fought the Crusaders effectively driving them out from the Levant by 1291 and officially in 1302 ending the era of the Crusades.[citation needed]
They were of varied ancestry but were often Kipchak Turks/Cumans,[3] depending on the period and region in question. While mamluks were purchased, their status was above ordinary slaves, who were not allowed to carry weapons or perform certain tasks. In places such as Egypt from the Ayyubid dynasty to the time of Muhammad Ali of Egypt, mamluks were considered to be “true lords,” with social status above freeborn Muslims"
 
I know they ruled egypt I said that already, but they were slaves, Ottomans used alot of slaves in army and civil service. So don't act the way you do.

If I may be blunt, I've noticed turks think of themselves as sinnless people who do good everywhere and but are pretty facist. You fall under this catagory too trying to defend genocide as well. And this paranoia that the west has some pro-christian biases. I guess Lybia dn Iraq are christian, thats why we helped them?

I hope not every turk is like this because turkey is not an angelic country and is quiet the opposite, trying to cause problems for all turkey's neighbours including the eastern meditteranean now. Turkey is a very agreissive country and gets away with it cause America lets turkey who are in NATO. Now that turkey isn't getting into the EU, maybe NATO is in the past as well? I hope so, because turkey literally gets away with murder.

Erdogan thinks Turkey is some sort of power and this will bite turkey is the ass sooner or later.
 
Elias2 said:
I know they ruled egypt I said that already, but they were slaves, Ottomans used alot of slaves in army and civil service. So don't act the way you do.

If I may be blunt, I've noticed turks think of themselves as sinnless people who do good everywhere and but are pretty facist. You fall under this catagory too trying to defend genocide as well. And this paranoia that the west has some pro-christian biases. I guess Lybia dn Iraq are christian, thats why we helped them?

I hope not every turk is like this because turkey is not an angelic country and is quiet the opposite, trying to cause problems for all turkey's neighbours including the eastern meditteranean now. Turkey is a very agreissive country and gets away with it cause America lets turkey who are in NATO. Now that turkey isn't getting into the EU, maybe NATO is in the past as well? I hope so, because turkey literally gets away with murder.

Erdogan thinks Turkey is some sort of power and this will bite turkey is the ass sooner or later.
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either i am very bad in writing or you dont understand what you read. what you wrote is racist by itself. anyway, ....
 
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barbarian said:
either i am very bad in writing or you dont understand what you read. what you wrote is racist by itself. anyway, have a nice day.
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I know what I wrote, I think you don't want to reply because of your "superego". Turkey has alot of skeletons in its closet.
 
Elias2 said:
I know what I wrote, I think you don't want to reply because of your "superego". Turkey has alot of skeletons in its closet.
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no need to answer your groundless aggression better to edit my post no:46 :laughing:
 
barbarian said:
no need to answer your groundless aggression better to edit my post no:46 :laughing:
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You see now matter how much back and forth the turth stands that Turks did commit genocide during WW1 :good_job: You ancoestors commited barberism and have blood on their hands of innocents, you should be ashamed.
 
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Elias2 said:
You see now matter how much back and forth the turth stands that Turks did commit genocide during WW1 :good_job: You ancoestors commited barberism and have blood on their hands of innocents, you should be ashamed, but considering you are turk, I think you like it :thinking:
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I ignore you. Please don't quote or answer me.
 
Elias2 said:
You see now matter how much back and forth the turth stands that Turks did commit genocide during WW1 :good_job: You ancoestors commited barberism and have blood on their hands of innocents, you should be ashamed, but considering you are turk, I think you like it :thinking:
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Hmm.. You seem to be a Canadian, and looking at what you typed, I ask myself..
Have you been drinking alcohol before you typed this?
Not very wise.
 
Reinaert said:
Hmm.. You seem to be a Canadian, and looking at what you typed, I ask myself..
Have you been drinking alcohol before you typed this?
Not very wise.
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What does it matter what nationality I am? I would like an answer on this if this disturbs you so much.

If you have heard the stories of what happened to armenian/greek/assyrian christians and how turkey is trying to deny it and people like barbarian try to deny it I don't see what is wrong with my post.

Genocide did occur and children like Barbarian pout when the truth comes out. Of course in Turkey when people say things like this they go to jail, censorship is still high in that country, so I understand how this culture of denial sparks anger in the hearts of turks when the topic is brought up.

That and the continual suppresion of the Kurds, but this is for another discussion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gq8IwaH3C5c

I remeber a while ago there was another Turkish person on this forum that was more straightfoward on the events and better conversation was had, he stopped posting here after that once and I wish he was here to get another unbiased turkish perspective on the matter, b/c barbarian's perspective is clouded with nationalism.
 
Anatolian chevalier said:
Mİllİon natİve anatolİan are massacred by european İnvaders ...they massacred theİr master we gİve them a cİvİlİzatİon they massacred natİve anatolİans
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That had nothing to do with your people being Anatolian, but because you were Muslim. And so did Muslims killed Christians in great numbers just because they were Christians, not because they were European.
 
Anatolian chevalier said:
Turkey turks are ANATOLİAN people who are native to ANATOLİA. Anatolian people want to save their native country its our problem not your Your uncivilized ancestor who invade our land and killed NATİVE ANATOLİAN PEOPLE WHO ARE DESCEND OF LYDİANS,HİTİTİES ETC. YOUR PEOPLE ALSO STOLE OUR CİVİLİZATİON AİNT THEY? ROMA WAS FOUNDED BY ANATOLİAN ,MONEY İS FOUNDED BY ANATOLİAN LOT OF FOLK COME FROM ANATOLİA...NOW ANATOLİANS ARE BARBAR LOL
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Are you insane? Turkic people came from Central Asia, invaded the land of the people who lived in Anatolia before, and they conquered the area from its native people. If your ancestors are true native Anatolians you can't be Turkic. Today you can be a native Anatolian, who is a Turkish citizen and part ot the Turkish nation, but ethnically not a Turkic! Although of course inter-marriages happend for hundreds of years, so I seriously doubt that anyone could be a 100% pure Anatolian... ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkic_peoples - for the clearer understanding of the difference between Turkish and Turkic )

I can tell you however that since the Antiquity, Anatolia (Asia Minor) was a multi-ethnic region! Greeks lived there for at least 3000 thousand years, but after WWI the Turkish expelled (if the weren't massacered) these native people of Anatolia. As you speak about Hittites, Urartu etc. They are the forefathers of Armenians whom the Turkish also killed or in a fortunate situation just expelled from their many-thousand-year-old home.
 
Anatolian chevalier said:
İ am anatolİan do you undertsnad anatolİa İs my natİve land; kurds,greek and assyrİans arent natİve ....do you understand? Do you know who are anatolİan people?? Mİllİon natİve anatolİan are massacred by european İnvaders ...they massacred theİr master we gİve them a cİvİlİzatİon they massacred natİve anatolİans
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Anatolia_Ancient_Regions_base.svg


Anatolia - 500 BC

Who where massacred and when? What do you mean by Anatolian? Weren't the Perisans who conquered Anatolia as a whole first? European identity is not so old my friend! It only comes with the Middle Ages, and of course not in the mind of ordinary people, just in soe theoretists sitting in the abbeys writing their books.
 
Maciamo said:
Actually it does not, as long as you don't regard the Armenians as another racial or ethnic group from other Anatolians. Under the Ottoman Empire they were part of the same country and so cannot be considered a different national group either.

Unwittingly you have helped me demonstrate that the UN's definition of 'genocide' does not apply to what the Turks did to the Armenians.
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The same true for holocaust! Many emancipated Jewish people considered themselves ethnically/nationally Hungarian in the case of Hungary, but of Jewish religion. Same true for the other Central European states as well, and I seriously doubt that it won't be true for Benelux or France! So this is really a FALSE argument! Armenians considered themselves as a different ethnic and of course religious group than Turks. Self-determination is the key element of a nation or an ethnic group!
 
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