Very advanced Indoeuropeans - cows reveal their history! :-)

[LeBrok]

No one will listen to you if you make fun of. All you'll do is gain enemies. It is as if debating is a war to you, where you do your best to mock your enemy, than discussing ideas.

Be my guest and show me how you discuss ideas with Rethel. Remember that he asked us to have better sense of humor, so I tried.

 

[Angela]

I guess my allusions are to the notion of the male Yamnaya line originating on the steppe as opposed to the Caucasus or South. So far that's what it looks like to me, and so "dilution" would have been mostly female. I know this suggestion pisses people off, and it's a bit of an extreme model, but Samara/Karelia are pretty convigncing to me in spite of the small sample size. I'll say again, AUTOSOMALLY IDENTICAL. Not to mention the archaeological continuity, which I've already beat to death on dead genocentric ears. If we find R1b in Maykop with all or much more caucasus_Gedrosian/ENF("Armenian") or whatever then I'll eat crow, but until then I have to go with Steppe origin receptive to technological streams via Balkans/CT and the Caucasus. That being said, R1, especially R1b is a hair ball, and the 50-50 Armenian-Karelia/Samara model along with the unlikelihood of a purely female source of this "Armenian" weighs on my mind.

I'll be taking lots of med tonight, don't worry.

I can't speak for anyone else, but the whole buying and raiding for 'Armenian' wives thing doesn't ****me off. I would describe my reaction to the macho posturing and adolescent delight exhibited by a few posters as they describe it as one of amusement.

That's separate from the fact that just in terms of scale, if nothing else, this does indeed seem like an "extreme model" to use your phrase. Still possible, I suppose.

 

[LeBrok]

No one will listen to you if you make fun of. All you'll do is gain enemies. It is as if debating is a war to you, where you do your best to mock your enemy, than discussing ideas.

Be my guest and show me how you discuss ideas with Rethel. Remember that he asked us to have better sense of humor, so I tried.

Did you like the one "Get a room".

 

[holderlin]

I can't speak for anyone else, but the whole buying and raiding for 'Armenian' wives thing doesn't ****me off. I would describe my reaction to the macho posturing and adolescent delight exhibited by a few posters as they describe it as one of amusement.

That's separate from the fact that just in terms of scale, if nothing else, this does indeed seem like an "extreme model" to use your phrase. Still possible, I suppose.

Well I can imagine how it might "piss off" a dude who sees themselves as being ancestors of these "Armenians".

 

[holderlin]

Angela please: I do respect science (and I respect you too!): I am an atheist. But don't you think there are limitations to everything?

"Those who idolize "facts" never notice that their idols only shine in a borrowed light. They are also meant not to notice this; for thereupon they would have to be at a loss and therefore useless. But idolizers and idols are used wherever gods are in flight and so announce their nearness."

-MH

All scientists should have this quote up on their wall.

 

[Johannes]

"Those who idolize "facts" never notice that their idols only shine in a borrowed light. They are also meant not to notice this; for thereupon they would have to be at a loss and therefore useless. But idolizers and idols are used wherever gods are in flight and so announce their nearness."

-MH

All scientists should have this quote up on their wall.

Who wrote this? It's pretty deep. Was he/she a poet or scientist or both?

 

[holderlin]

Who wrote this? It's pretty deep. Was he/she a poet or scientist or both?

Martin Heidegger. The most important philosopher in the last 100 years and maybe even 1000s of years aside from Nietzsche. Not coincidentally a large body of his work are some of the most important interpretations of Nietzsche. Without Heidegger, we never fully understand Nietzsche. I sort of see them both as the same epoche.

 

[Salmon]

Eurasia has a diverse range of "bovines."

Exploiting dairy to its limits was important for Northern Europeans as many of the crops domesticated in warmer and more temperate climates in Eurasia did not grow very well in some places. The cows could process inedible cellulose into milk which humans could transform in butter, cheese, yogurt.

Eurasians to the South and South East could exploit other food sources. Asians went on to favor pigs and chickens. They would ferment legumes and vegetables instead of milk, most of the time. Mongolians loved dairy. Chinese preferred to use the cows to pull wagons and large loads. They liked the taste of pork over the taste of sheep and goats.

 

[Johannes]

Martin Heidegger. The most important philosopher in the last 100 years and maybe even 1000s of years aside from Nietzsche. Not coincidentally a large body of his work are some of the most important interpretations of Nietzsche. Without Heidegger, we never fully understand Nietzsche. I sort of see them both as the same epoche.

Ah, did you read and fully understand what he wrote? I remember reading him at the same time I was studying Nietzsche. I could not understand what the hell he was talking about and all I remember him saying was about Nietzsche being the last metaphysical philosopher and about instinct as opposed to reason. Except for Nietzsche most German philosophers were very bad writers. Have you tried to read Kant, Marx, and Hegel?? I fully understood Nietzsche without the use of Heidegger's analysis.

 

[Tomenable]

Can someone give me a link to that recent study which describes how cattle got to China ???

I mean the one which says that cattle was brought to China via the steppe by Indo-Europeans.

Except for Nietzsche most German philosophers were very bad writers.

Nietzsche actually self-identified as an ethnic Pole. So I'm not sure if we can call him German.

Though objectively he spoke German etc., but it is self-identity that really matters, or not?

 

[Johannes]

Can someone give me a link to that recent study which describes how cattle got to China ???

I mean the one which says that cattle was brought to China via the steppe by Indo-Europeans.

Man I wish I would have kept all the National Geographic magazines I used to collect!!! In one, during the 1990's, there was an article about Indo-Europeans (Tocharians) who settled in the Tarim Basin and began to trade with China. They brought with them cattle, the wagons (wheel), chariots, and bronze weapons. All these were introduced (along with jade) to the Chinese around the 3rd millenium BCE. When the Chinese could not find any wheels, chariots or bronze metals made by the Chinese before 2,500 BCE, they stopped all studies into Tocharian history and since then have hidden from the world all new discoveries.

 

[Johannes]

Nietzsche actually self-identified as an ethnic Pole. So I'm not sure if we can call him German.

Though objectively he spoke German etc., but it is self-identity that really matters, or not?

Nietzsche self-identified as a Pole because of self-hatred. The Germans did not read his books or understood where he was coming form. He also resented the fact that he was not famous. Nietzsche also saw how the Germans had degenerated from being "Thinkers and Poets" to military men who blindly obeyed and hated the rise of Germany as a world power. However, there was a study made of Nietzsche's family, especially on his father's side (because Nietzsche thought his real surname was "Nietsky"). The study found no Polish or Slav ancestors back to the 18th century. So it seems that Nietzsche was 100% Deutsch.

 

[Mordred]

This would mean that you actually know more about Nitsche than he did. I think he was clever enough to know his origins. Your reasoning would diminish all his work just by stating the fact that he didn't know what he was or what he wrote.

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