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Immigration What should Europeans do with illegal immigrants?

LeBrok said:
It was just written to ilustrate dying villages problem, and jobs that locals don't want to do. They already live here for half a year, so what would change if they stay? They would spend all their money they made locally!
Besides this half of population of Alberta wasn't born here in this province or even in Canada. Well, and we are live, prosperous with good standard of living. Nothing bad happened, the world didn't claps, neither our Western civilization. Immigrants come here and work hard. There are not many more cases of lazy emigrants on welfare system than country's average. So don't give me this BS that immigrants are coming to Europe to do nothing and abuse the system. Statistics don't confirm your point of view.
There racecourses are there to help, you just don't want to help, period. It has more to do with your human condition and most Europeans than material ability to help.

It is just 200 thousand in average year. To put it in perspective, Canada builds new housing for 300 thousand refugees a year, with population of 35 million people. Europe has 750 million people! How hard is to accommodate 200 k or even half a million this year!? Beside the point that it is not a big effort to accommodate that many people a year, is the fact that in Europe there are millions of empty houses in villages! You just don't want to give them, or rent them, the empty homes. Nice!
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The age of petty low grade jobs is almost over in Europe.

We are in an age of online banking, online shopping, driverless metro trains and increasing automation which will make all labour intensive forms of work largely obsolete.

Europe has massive youth unemployment not because the young are lazy (though some are) but because most of the old manual industries have disappeared or are disappearing in the West.

There are too many people already (without migrants from outside the EU) for too few jobs.

The EU should man up and make deals with the powers that be in Tripolitania (Libya) and Turkey to set up centres where people can be processed to see if they are genuine asylum seekers like Syrians or Eritreans.

Economic migrants like most West Africans are simply not required.
 
LeBrok said:
Tell me how many illegal emigrants comes every year through US/Mexico border?

Besides, this thread is about Europeans making a solution to this crises. You are getting defensive, god knows why, and instead of finding a solution, you criticize other countries?! That's how local problems are solved, right? Blame others and do nothing.
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The solution is easy: Close the borders, sent the lot back to the save country they came from. Have the navy patrol the Libyan coast and catch the boats with migrant, tow them back, destroy the boats and other equipment the smugglers use and arrest the smugglers. This is completely OK with international justice, because as Libya has no functional government Europe is allowed to act on its territory to defend its interest.

The fact is that a lot of political correct people don't want that because these are blacks and other third world peoples and the PC social justice warriors consider these victims no matter what. These people will resist any stern measurement but can not convince the European population to to the only other thing they can do: Fly all persons in the world that wish to come in nd grant them asylum. Therefore they will simply resist anything being done. Thus the situation persists, as there actually *is* a way to come in, i.e. by these boats.

Thousands have drowned thanks to the PC crowd. They, despite what they themselves would believe, have blood on their hands.

PS: Call these people what they are: colonists. Yes, they are refugee as well, but don't forget that a large amount of, for instance, South African whites stem from refugees that migrated further, to wit the Huguenots.
 
LeBrok said:
It is just 200 thousand in average year.
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It is far more. Germany alone expects 800.000 asylum seekers this year. But immigration to Germany (Families brought in, other immigration) is far higher. In 2013 in was more than a million: http://www.west-info.eu/immigration-to-germany-at-its-highest-rate/

LeBrok said:
Beside the point that it is not a big effort to accommodate that many people a year, is the fact that in Europe there are millions of empty houses in villages! You just don't want to give them, or rent them, the empty homes. Nice!
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In the Netherlands the average waiting time in cities for social rent houses is years. But not for refugees. Currently they are given houses within a year.

LeBrok said:
So don't give me this BS that immigrants are coming to Europe to do nothing and abuse the system. Statistics don't confirm your point of view.
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70% of the Somalian colonists in the Netherlands have a unemployment allowance. All immigrants show far higher unemployment rates.

http://www.cbs.nl/nl-NL/menu/themas...even-van-de-tien-somaliers-in-de-bijstand.htm

That is the statistics involved. Confirming the opposite of your view.
 
Vallicanus said:
I have no power to alter immigration policy anywhere.
Nor do you.
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It was never about what you can do personally, but about your opinion, solution, attitude and willingness or not to help.

Is it too difficult for you to understand that only the owners of those empty houses you pontificate about have the right to dispose of them.
You can suggest ideas like anybody else but no more than that.
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Sure, what is the problem for government to open a hotline, so owners of empty homes can register the address of property for refugees? Someone needs to organize the process, don't you think?
 
Vallicanus said:
The age of petty low grade jobs is almost over in Europe. We are in an age of online banking, online shopping, driverless metro trains and increasing automation which will make all labour intensive forms of work largely obsolete.
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Really? You mean locals are so eager to work as janitors, construction workers, burger flippers in fast food industry, farmers, etc


Europe has massive youth unemployment not because the young are lazy (though some are) but because most of the old manual industries have disappeared or are disappearing in the West.

There are too many people already (without migrants from outside the EU) for too few jobs.
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This is a problem for countries with not so good economy. When countries are properly run like Germany, Switzerland, Ireland, UK and many more. Besides, immigrants bring economical growth. They need everything from homes, cars, cloths to toilet paper and food. How come Germany can host 10 million immigrants and still have one of lowest unemployment?

The EU should man up and make deals with the powers that be in Tripolitania (Libya) and Turkey to set up centres where people can be processed to see if they are genuine asylum seekers like Syrians or Eritreans.
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Now, that's a plan.
 
LeBrok said:
It was never about what you can do personally, but about your opinion, solution, attitude and willingness or not to help.

Sure, what is the problem for government to open a hotline, so owners of empty homes can register the address of property for refugees? Someone needs to organize the process, don't you think?
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Contact the EU politicians, not me.

You see yourself as a citizen of the world but as far as I'm concerned I'm not my brother's (or sister's) keeper.
 
LeBrok said:
Really? You mean locals are so eager to work as janitors, construction workers, burger flippers in fast food industry, farmers, etc


This is a problem for countries with not so good economy. When countries are properly run like Germany, Switzerland, Ireland, UK and many more. Besides, immigrants bring economical growth. They need everything from homes, cars, cloths to toilet paper and food. How come Germany can host 10 million immigrants and still have one of lowest unemployment?

Now, that's a plan.
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I did say that manual work is disappearing with new technologies.

In the UK there are still plenty of indigenous construction workers and janitors. Our burger joints and coffee houses have enough workers from Eastern Europe plus local students trying to pay for their university education.

Spain and Greece have over 50pc unemployment among the young and Italy and Portugal about 40pc.

Bulgaria, Romania and Poland have to send their young to work in Britain and elsewhere.

We can take asylum seekers but not economic opportunists who finish up in many cases as unemployed and on benefits as epoch mentioned above for the Netherlands.
 
LeBrok said:
Besides, immigrants bring economical growth. They need everything from homes, cars, cloths to toilet paper and food.
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Hahaha. LOL. Jezus Christ, you made me laugh. This is so out of touch with reality. How much money do you thing these people put *in* this economy?


EDIT: A dutch news paper article (run through google translate if you wish) stating that people smugglers praise the Netherlands, amongst others: "You'll get an allowance and a house, paid for by the government".

http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/1012/Nederla...mokkelaars-prijzen-opvang-Nederland-aan.dhtml
 
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epoch said:
The solution is easy: Close the borders, sent the lot back to the save country they came from. Have the navy patrol the Libyan coast and catch the boats with migrant, tow them back, destroy the boats and other equipment the smugglers use and arrest the smugglers. This is completely OK with international justice, because as Libya has no functional government Europe is allowed to act on its territory to defend its interest.

The fact is that a lot of political correct people don't want that because these are blacks and other third world peoples and the PC social justice warriors consider these victims no matter what. These people will resist any stern measurement but can not convince the European population to to the only other thing they can do: Fly all persons in the world that wish to come in nd grant them asylum. Therefore they will simply resist anything being done. Thus the situation persists, as there actually *is* a way to come in, i.e. by these boats.
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I was actually surprised that boat refugees are not loaded on an Italian, in case of Italy, ship and taken back to Libya, the country they left. Perhaps because they need to separate political refugees, from economic migrants. With such volume and lack of documents it became impossible to do. Instead of finding a new solution, solution based on scale of the problem, they were/are still stuck in old ways when only hundreds refugees arrived each month.
I don't think it is a colour of skin issue. White Syrians are treated the same way.
 
LeBrok said:
The EU should man up and make deals with the powers that be in Tripolitania (Libya) and Turkey to set up centres where people can be processed to see if they are genuine asylum seekers like Syrians or Eritreans.
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Now, that's a plan.
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No it's not. Most of the people would not be genuine asylum seekers. These would still come as it is the promise of golden streets and easy money they follow - especially Subsaharan Africans. You see, before you come into Libya Syrians fled their country to safety. After that the migration plans come.

So according to EU asylum rules *no one* in Libya should be allowed.

LeBrok said:
Really? You mean locals are so eager to work as janitors, construction workers, burger flippers in fast food industry, farmers, etc
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I don't know for janitors. But construction workers are quite happy to do their jobs in Europe. I know a lot of them.
 
epoch said:
Hahaha. LOL. Jezus Christ, you made me laugh. This is so out of touch with reality. How much money do you thing these people put *in* this economy?


EDIT: A dutch news paper article (run through google translate if you wish) stating that people smugglers praise the Netherlands, amongst others: "You'll get an allowance and a house, paid for by the government".

http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/1012/Nederla...mokkelaars-prijzen-opvang-Nederland-aan.dhtml
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I know personalty many immigrants in Canada who received government help and housing at the arrival (government being a sponsor). In short few years they learned language and local skills. Since they worked hard for all these years and payed taxes. UK statistics posted above about migrants are in sink with my observations.
Sure new immigrants will get place to live and allowance to make start easier, but after years they are paying few folds as every other citizen. I doubt it is much different in Netherlands.
 
LeBrok said:
I was actually surprised that boat refugees are not loaded on an Italian, in case of Italy, ship and taken back to Libya, the country they left. Perhaps because they need to separate political refugees, from economic migrants. With such volume and lack of documents it became impossible to do. Instead of finding a new solution, solution based on scale of the problem, they were/are still stuck in old ways when only hundreds refugees arrived each month.
I don't think it is a colour of skin issue. White Syrians are treated the same way.
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But white Syrians are third world people. That makes them also special interest people.
 
LeBrok said:
I know personalty many immigrants in Canada who received government help and housing at the arrival (government being a sponsor). In short few years they learned language and local skills. Since they worked hard for all these years and payed taxes. UK statistics posted above about migrants are in sink with my observations.
Sure new immigrants will get place to live and allowance to make start easier, but after years they are paying few folds as every other citizen. I doubt it is much different in Netherlands.
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I know a lot of migrants that have a passport but still speak only their language or English with their fellow countryman.

And the statistics I posted are official government statistics. I know Germany has similar experience.
 
That English employment statistic is not about England, it is about *London*. It isn't usable to compare colonists employment to British as huge numbers of native English, to wit the middle class, have moved out of London.

EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxm1mqbgxcM
 
Sweden

The housing shortage is forcing young people to live at home
This is how 20-25-year-olds live in Sweden
36 percent live in the parental home
40 percent live in rented dwellings with their own first-hand contract.
10 percent live in the condominium.
5 percent live in rented dwellings in the secondary.
10 percent live in a house or other housing.
Source: Adolescent accommodation - Progress Report 2013, Building and Planning


July 2015: In the last month the unemployment rate was 6.5 percent, which was 0.6 percentage points lower than the same month last year. The total number of unemployed - 349 600 people. Seasonally adjusted and smoothed figure for unemployment was 7.4 percent.
In a comparison with other EU countries is Sweden's youth unemployment just below the EU average. Among the countries that have the lowest youth unemployment are Germany and Austria.


Despite major historical variations in the number of people who have migrated to and from Sweden the overall trend is clear. Sweden has over the last 150 years has gone from being a country of emigration to being a country of immigration. Some periods excels especially when immigration and emigration has been of particular importance for the Swedish population development. Towards the end of the 60th century, labor migration large, largest proportion came from Finland. Between the years 1850-1910 emigrated almost one in five Swedish, and 1992 has long distinguished itself as a record year for immigration to the country, mainly due to the wars in the Balkans. 2014, however, was the largest ever year of immigration and this was mainly due to a large increase in refugees from the war in Syren.
In 2014 immigrated over 120 000 people in Sweden, about 58 000 women and 70 000 men, which was an increase of 9.6% compared with 2013. At the same emigrated about 51 000 persons, which gives a net immigration of about 75 000 people.


SÄPO - Security Police in Sweden "At least 80 people have traveled to Syria and joined the al-Qaeda-inspired groups to battle. More than half of them have returned to Sweden ... "


In a report in the Romanian television described Sweden as a "paradise" for Roma (Gypsies) who wish to go abroad to beg.
 
LeBrok said:
I doubt it is much different in Netherlands.
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I showed you the statistics. It is not good. That happy melting pot where we all are or will become citizens of the world doesn't exist but in the mind of the same kind of people who once thought Esperanto would overcome all differences.

Now I don't mind people dreaming dreams like that. As long as they will never get to set policies and run countries. Unfortunately the opposite is true.
 
I suggest

PUBLIC HANGING FOR TRAFFICKERS
 
epoch said:
But white Syrians are third world people. That makes them also special interest people.
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Well, at least we know that this political correctness is not about skin colour. Actually, following this line of thinking, economical migrants from Eastern Europe being white Europeans should be treated worse than Syrians and Black Africans. Are they?
Perhaps treating everybody equally makes it look like political correctness to some?
 
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