Politics Balkanian disagreements.

Albanian History:
We are Atlantis, Pelasgians, Epirotes, Illyrians, Dardanians, Albanoi, Arnauts, Arbanasi, Arberesh, Arvanites, Albanians, Shqiptars and everything we want to be.
We speak the most ancient language in the world the illyrian, dardanian, pelasgian and everything we say it is.
We dont need any sources, we make our the history as we want.
 
Ike said:
The problem is that medieval Albanian is not the same as Shqiptar.
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Vaccarizzo Albanian is a subdialect of the Arbëresh dialect of the Albanian language. Spoken in the villages of Vaccarizzo Albanese and San Giorgio Albanese in southern Italy by approximately 3,000 people, Vaccarizzo Albanian has retained many archaic features of the Tosk dialect, on which the Standard Albanian is based.Vaccarizzo Albanian is a dialect of Arbëresh, which is a dialect of Tosk, one of the two major dialects of the Albanian language. Within Arbëresh along with the subdialects of Macchia, San Cosmo Albanese, San Demetrio Corone, Santa Sofia d'Epiro it belongs to a group of dialects spoken in the region of Cosenza. Although it is a part of the Tosk dialects, Vaccarizo Albanian also contains Gheg elements.The communes of Vaccarizzo Albanese and San Giorgio Albanese were founded by Albanian refugees after the conquest of Albania by the Ottoman Empire and the subsequent mass migration of Albanians to Italy. As all Arbëresh dialects, Vaccarizzo Albanian exhibits many medieval elements of the Albanian language. However, unlike other Arbëresh dialects, which under southern Italian dialectal influence have undergone through a process of partial or total fricativization resulting in the change of the intervocalic voiced velar plosive ([ɡ]) to a voiced velar fricative ([ɣ]), Vaccarizzo Albanian has retained the initial [ɡ].[4]Another feature of the Vaccarizzo dialect is the sonorization of the voiceless velar fricative [x], which also occurs in the Arbëresh dialects of the region.[5] As Albanian dialects of the Balkans it exhibits doubly articulated consonants; however, unlike in Balkan Tosk dialects, the final unstressed schwa rarely appears in Vaccarizzo.seems to me even albanians of albania have retain elemenst that arbreshe didnt. gheg.jpg As you can see not much has changed.
 
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DejaVu said:
Albanian History:
We are Atlantis, Pelasgians, Epirotes, Illyrians, Dardanians, Albanoi, Arnauts, Arbanasi, Arberesh, Arvanites, Albanians, Shqiptars and everything we want to be.
We speak the most ancient language in the world the illyrian, dardanian, pelasgian and everything we say it is.
We dont need any sources, we make our the history as we want.
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Dejavu.even if you dont like it or dont like it their is nothing you can do about us.You posting rubbish about castriota with no facts.I personaly know some of the castriota family.Do you know why they say they are albanian?Every family that came from albania in the 14ctry in italiy was documented an archive.even today if a arbreshe has a child born the child is documented.An about illyrian thrcian pelasgians,Who were the thracians by the eye of the ancient greeks?Im sure they said thracians were part of pelasgian race.I know this is not a genetic forum,but sorry to say we mmediate ancestors are Mesolithic Balkanic people.suck it up
 
DejaVu said:
Albanian History:
We are Atlantis, Pelasgians, Epirotes, Illyrians, Dardanians, Albanoi, Arnauts, Arbanasi, Arberesh, Arvanites, Albanians, Shqiptars and everything we want to be.
We speak the most ancient language in the world the illyrian, dardanian, pelasgian and everything we say it is.
We dont need any sources, we make our the history as we want.
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What is your ethnic back ground if you dont mind me asking dejavu?
 
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DejaVu said:
Albanian History:
We are Atlantis, Pelasgians, Epirotes, Illyrians, Dardanians, Albanoi, Arnauts, Arbanasi, Arberesh, Arvanites, Albanians, Shqiptars and everything we want to be.
We speak the most ancient language in the world the illyrian, dardanian, pelasgian and everything we say it is.
We dont need any sources, we make our the history as we want.
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an now this More Y-SNP calls from Iron and Bronze Age Bulgaria

Posted on September 1, 2015 by Genetiker — 2 Comments
Below are more Y-SNP calls for four samples from Iron and Bronze Age Bulgaria. Positive calls are in bold, and negative calls are in non-bold.
This post gives more information about the four samples, along with analyses of their autosomal DNA.
The published DNA-based sex determination analyses, along with previous analyses of my own, indicated that V2 and K8 were female, which was in conflict with the archeological evidence, which indicated that they were male. But I’ve now done new sex determination analyses that indicate that all four samples were male.
The calls show that P192-1 belonged to haplogroup E1b1b1a1b-Z1919. The autosomal DNA of P192-1 differed from that of the other samples in that it completely lacked the K12b Gedrosia component, while the other three samples had large amounts of it.
The calls for T2G2, a sample from a Thracian burial mound, show that he did not belong to haplogroups E, I, or J. The very large amount of the Gedrosia component for T2G2 indicates that he belonged to R1b or R1a, and I have little doubt that he belonged to R1b-Z2103.View attachment 7457 As i said my friend albanians came from Mesolithic Balkanic..Do you know what this mean dejavu?This means dna was found on thracians bones that carries the same genetic marker of albanian people this research was done this year I hope you learn something.An yes abreshe has changed alotsome where on the lines they mixed with others as do all race. but you should see todays research this year,eb1b is very high in siclily,,i will post very soon.This put a big damper on bulgarians been thracians lol.Bulgars are semetic turkish an slavnic people bulgar derives from a turkish tribe
 
Ike said:
You are free to prove that medieval Albanians were in fact of Shqiptar ethnic origin and that they spoke Shiptar language. One simple word, or script, or stone carving, or something? From Dimitri Progon? Or anyone else? Surely Scanderbeg would at least give credits to Shiptar language with one tiny little needlework on the scarf, banner, clothes, etc... if Shqiptar was really his mother tongue.
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You think a language is going to change in 140yrs then you are out of your mind.hello.jpg Gjon Buzuku (16th century) was an AlbanianCatholic priest who wrote the first known printed book in Albanian. Gjon Buzuku was born in the village of Ljare (Krajina, Albanian: Krajë) in the Bar district, close to Northern Albania (Krajë is located on the shores of Skadar Lake), then Ottoman Empire. He probably lived in or near Venice, Italy. There are claims that he was the bishop of two dioceses in north Albania or that he was a monk.From March 20, 1554 to January 5, 1555 he wrote a translation of the Catholic missal into the Gheg dialect of Albanian. He published it as a book of 188 pages. The Apostolic Library in the Vatican holds the only known copy of the book. It is missing the frontispiece and the first 16 pages, which explains why the title and year of publication of the work are not known.
The book was discovered in 1740 by Gjon Nikollë Kazazi, the Albanian archbishop of Skopje. In other libraries there are three photocopies from the original, one of them in Tirana. In 1996, the librarians were not able to locate the book, which had been used in 1984 for the last time. Eqrem Çabej wrote a monograph on the book in 1968. The dialect used in Mëshari was one of the main subjects of Selman Riza's works.[1]
The place the book was printed is thought to be either Venice or Shkodër.
The book contains the liturgies of the main holidays. There are also texts of prayers and rituals and catechetical texts. Every page contains two columns. The initials are decorated. The grammar and the vocabulary are more archaic than in the Gheg text from the 17th century. The text is very valuable from the viewpoint of the history of language. The vocabulary is quite rich. The archaic text is easily read due to the circumstance that it is mainly a translation of known texts, in particular the Bible. Most of the Gospels of Matthew, Luke and John were translated in the book. It also contains passages from the Psalms, the Book of Isaiah, the Book of Jeremiah, the Letters to the Corinthians, and many illustrations.
The orthography is peculiar. The Latin alphabet with some additional letters is used. The consequent character of orthography and grammar seems to indicate an earlier tradition of writing.
In Albanian, the book is known as Meshari (The Missal). All we know about the author is from the book's colophon written by Buzuku himself in Albanian. Language used is a pre-runner to the Official Gheg Albanian Language. However, it is clear that the dialect of Malësia e Madhe (The Great Highland) was used. Even today one can hear words and expressions from Malësia older people that sound as if jumping from the pages of the missal.
 

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ukaj said:
What is your ethnic back ground if you dont mind me asking dejavu?
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IIRC he is Macedonian Slav, or at least half. I'm not sure why he is afraid to introduce himself to you?
 
ukaj said:
You think a language is going to change in 140yrs then you are out of your mind. Gjon Buzuku (16th century) was an AlbanianCatholic priest who wrote the first known printed book in Albanian. Gjon Buzuku was born in the village of Ljare (Krajina, Albanian: Krajë) in the Bar district, close to Northern Albania (Krajë is located on the shores of Skadar Lake), then Ottoman Empire.
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If Albanians had always lived there, then why would they call the region Krajina? Etc...


ukaj said:
Ike.I dont understand why you mention albanian an shqiptar they are same people.Clearly you dont know why we call ourselves shqiptar.Shqiptar or shqiperia means to speak clear.We also use the old term arbon witch is older form in all albanian dilects both tosk an gheg,You saying albanians are basicly not same as medievil albanians of arbreshe an arbantie..How do you know that they are not the same as us with all the assimilation that has gone on you might be right.Their is alot of ottomans in greece alot of vlachs,slavs etc
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I know couple of theories why you call yourself Shqiptars, but they're not important now. It is you who impose that Albanians are not the same as medieval Albanian. I've asked you to present the connection here, and you evade it. Read #435.
 
Ike said:
If Albanians had always lived there, then why would they call the region Krajina? Etc...Thats like me saying if slavs has always been in nis when nis is a albanian word that pre dates slavnic arrival.alot changed when slav migration came,what happen to dardania.why is their slavnic toponyms in greece aswell as albania etc?




I know couple of theories why you call yourself Shqiptars, but they're not important now. It is you who impose that Albanians are not the same as medieval Albanian. I've asked you to present the connection here, and you evade it. Read #435.
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I gave you a connection shqiptar shqipoj means to speak or to speak clearly,Im sure it is in arbreshe also an arbantie. infact Gjon Buzuku used in in the meshari in 1555.You do know arbon is the oldest word to describe albania it is medievil aswell.aj is silent in albanian names an places normally a albanian name with silent aj at the end of surname take that away then this is their old name.such as lemaj,lem,camaj,cam,pamaj pam,samaj sama dukaj,duka,etc.skada is shkodra,krajina,kraje.I cant explain this but same as kruja,kruje,etc means nothing.in shkodra their is 14ctry kulla their.Anyhow their is many albanian places around their that is only albanian an in the indo european influence.like mal i zi, montenegro, ulqin,an much more.when slavs came they changed alot
 
LeBrok said:
IIRC he is Macedonian Slav, or at least half. I'm not sure why he is afraid to introduce himself to you?
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maybe he just wants to prove less of albanian people without his identity being exposed..maybe we should speak about macedonia an the bulgarians.:grin::grin:


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Piro Ilir said:
I'm starting from the last question: I just think that the inhabitants of Mati, Dibra and Kruja during the rule of Kastrioti were ethnic ghegs. We can't be 100% what really kastrioti family was, simply because they were nobles and they got married with other nobles including Greeks, albans, Serbs, montenegrins etc. George Kastrioti was married with the daughter of Gjergj Arianiti , whose realm was located in tosk lands.

Linguistically it's proven that the arberesh of Italy were tosks. They migrated from south Greece. A small portion of them were ghegs who migrated from north Albania after the fell of Kastrioti principality. These ghegs settled in south Italy because were welcomed by the king of Naples, who was a close allied of scanderbeg. Besides that, the majority of the inhabitants of gheg Albania migrated further north up to the republic of Ragusa, which was still not subdued by the ottomans. This migration happened afterward the fell of Scodra, which was the last strong hold anti- ottoman throughout Albanian lands.

If we see the large amount of tosk settlements throughout south Italy afterward the ottoman invasion of south Greece, we conclude or assume that the tosk population throughout south Greece was much more larger than it's said in our history books.
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Gjergj Arianiti hmmm is hard bro because i have never seen tosks with name gergji ever in my life.his father was from durres. durres is not completely tosk.This is why i truly belive in 14ctry gheg albanians were dominate in albania.Their was not much about tosks without being rude most of the medievil albanian names are gehg.This is why i belive in times of medievil many ghegs were assimulated in greece an south of albania.it hard to ashume.An gheg albanians are genetic related to the people in greece an macedonia,more than they are with tosk.this sounds stupid but is true,their could be migration that may have happen early then 13ctry,14ctry an 15ctry. possibly from my view.ghegs migrated into greece region long time,As i mentioned before i spoke with arbantie an he said his family came to greece in 13ctry from shkodra.Still most of all the names exist in northern tirbes.
 
DejaVu said:
The Byzantine Empire in 1042 attacked the young Serbian state after having defeated the Arabs in Sicily and having brought the Sicilian Albanians under their command and christianizing them. The leader of the Byzantines who led the Albanians was named Georgius Maniakos. Maniakos brought Albanian mercenaries from Sicily to fight the Serbs and they settled in two waves in modern day Albania, first the mercanaries came, and then came the women and children. After the defeat of Maniakos, the Byzantines would not let the Albanians return, thus the Albanians requested that the Serbs let them stay on the land. They settled under mount Raban and the city of Berat and from this, the Serbs called them "Rabanasi" or "Arbanasi". The city of Berat was known as Belgrad also, before the Albanians came to settle there. They mostly tended sheep and cattle and lent themselves out to Serbian nobles as brave soldiers.

Michael Attaliota: Historia, Corpus Scriptorum Historiae Byzantinae. Impensis ed. NJeberi, Bonnae


Turkish name for the Albanians: "Arnauti", which means "those who have not returned"
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You mean that Albanians are Sicilian ? Sicily during the classical period, was part of magnia graecia. Afterward the Roman invasion the whole magnia graecia became latinized. The whole Italian peninsula became latinized. There were zero non latins. So your claims are just nonsense. Albanian language show an earlier Slavic interference, before 1040 . This mean that Albanians were there during the Slavic migration 600-700 ad. Also Albanian language show only doric Greek or north West Greek ancient interference, which mean that is impossible they came from Sicily

The most close to ancient Macedonians are the tosk Albans, which mean the inhabitants of south- west modern Macedonia.
 
Ike said:
So, you're starting with insults?


Ok, for the 3rd time. Give me something that was written at least 500 years ago. Do you understand that? Not a Serbian book from 5 years ago, but a letter written by Skanderbeg 500 years ago. This is the last time I'm asking for it.


No, I'm not from Serbia.
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But definitely you are a Serb [emoji57]
 
Piro Ilir said:
You mean that Albanians are Sicilian ? Sicily during the classical period, was part of magnia graecia. Afterward the Roman invasion the whole magnia graecia became latinized. The whole Italian peninsula became latinized. There were zero non latins. So your claims are just nonsense. Albanian language show an earlier Slavic interference, before 1040 . This mean that Albanians were there during the Slavic migration 600-700 ad. Also Albanian language show only doric Greek or north West Greek ancient interference, which mean that is impossible they came from Sicily

The most close to ancient Macedonians are the tosk Albans, which mean the inhabitants of south- west modern Macedonia.
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Bro just question.Albanian language show only doric Greek or north West Greek.what dilect out of gheg an tosk share the most ancient greek.just wondering
 
Ike said:
I'm not talking about substrate, but about pronunciation.
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The Albanian language has clearly and definitely an IE origin. I'm not getting your point. Don't hide behind words as usually you do
 
ukaj said:
You said struga were all tosk.Anyway.all is well i sounded like i trying to devide albanian people am srry for that,,
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Indeed they are. I mean the autochtonous people. But there might be migrants from the north. No surprise about that.
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These are the areas were during 1912 were Albanian majority speaking. The extreme south west Macedonia is tosk. Today there might by a gheg influence because of the large gheg Albanian population of Macedonia. During ex Yugoslavia that area remained isolate. The gheg influence is foreigner .
 
DejaVu said:
Albanian History:
We are Atlantis, Pelasgians, Epirotes, Illyrians, Dardanians, Albanoi, Arnauts, Arbanasi, Arberesh, Arvanites, Albanians, Shqiptars and everything we want to be.
We speak the most ancient language in the world the illyrian, dardanian, pelasgian and everything we say it is.
We dont need any sources, we make our the history as we want.
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Indeed, is generally accepted by the majority of international scholars that modern Albans evolved from ancient Illyrians.
 
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